Dear developers,
this has bothered me for quite some time now but I’ve never found the time to write it all up so far (not being a native speaker, a wall of text like this takes me ages…).
All the more I hope you take notice and maybe there’s even a chance you might consider implementing parts of this concept.
There are some issues and inconsistencies concerning npc crew and multi-crew that bug me and apparently other cmdrs as well.
I think there’s a possibility to bring it all in line much more, while at the same time contributing to gameplay.
Of course, it’s a game and not everything has to be logical but as long as there’s no drawbacks, I think, credibility and consistency is worthwile.
There’s one topic the whole forum seems to agree: Crew members take too much credits when idle.
Another popular gripe is crew members dying on ship destruction, whilst the cmdr magically reappears at some station an instant later.
Another thing that breaks my (hate to say it) immersun, is the possibility to tele-presence across the whole galaxy!
For some reason hardly explainable lore-wise, multi-crew members appear in your cockpit but npc crew don’t.
Now to my proposal:
Crew pilots' cut:
Idle crew pilots receive a well reduced share of all your profit (like about 2%).
Active crew pilots’ cut stays the way it is currently.
On ship destruction:
Crew pilots get rescued just like cmdrs do!
One consequence would be a loss in the pilot's experience on ship destruction (like half a rank?).
Another consequence, depending on how you use the pilot, further below.
Treat npc-crew like modules (not literally though...).
Raise the number of obtainable pilots to 10.
Instead of magically being available at any station’s crew lounge, they need actual whereabouts!
Cmdrs then have two options:
Option A)
Choosing option A could even enable two sub-options:
Multi-crew:
I know there’s two camps here. I’m one of those who would happily fly to a system, meet a friend at a station and physically join his ship for some multi-crew adventure. However, from several threads concerning the topic, I know there’s also those who outright reject this and are happy with the tele-presence thing. I see no reason not to offer both options with their pros and cons, analogous to npc pilots (well, other than the effort to implement this, obviously).
So just like with npc crew you have:
Option A)
Now to Tele-presence:
When it came out I first thought it’s a stupid idea tbh, but I soon realised it’s necessary for SLFs, as I wouldn’t want my pilot to be dead every time the fighter blows up. After all, we control drones over vast distances at present, too, so why shouldn’t it be possible with our ships at game-time?
But please – not across the whole galaxy!
I suggest to introduce a signal range limit.
SLFs have an inherent signal range limit already, so why not apply the same concept to our ships? Being much larger vessels, capable of carrying more sophisticated transponders, it’s only reasonable that their range far exceeds the SLFs’ signal range.
The way this is implemented could also add to gameplay. Instead of tele-presence working up to a certain range (say 100 LY), the signal would deteriorate from a given distance (say 90 Ly) up to a distance it completely fails (say 110 LY). Deterioration would be noticeable by increasing visual and audio-glitches and maybe also a tiny (barely noticeable) lag in response. Of course few people would use it at that range but it’s a nice and immersive indicator that you’re about to leave the usable range. Additionally there’d be a signal strength indicator in your hud when using tele-presence.
You’d have the option to equip any of your ships with their dedicated pilot (giving the ships all the more personality) or scatter some pilots across strategic systems within the bubble to get a good coverage of tele-presence operators (dedicated operator icons and coverage indicators in the galmap)!
That’s about it!
Anyone read this far? Kudos and thanks a lot!
Two more things, if you’re still with me:
Not vital, but what I’d also like is the option to design crew pilots with the holo-me editor. You put a lot of effort in creating it, why not give us more reason to use it?
Personally I’d also get rid of the 3rd person view for the gunner in multi-crew. It’s point and click and doesn’t do justice to the game. I tried it once with a friend and never since.
I know, why you chose that but imho there are way more entertaining ways to implement the gunner role. I think it wouldn’t even require much effort.
I have a pretty concrete vision for that, too. However, I won’t further elaborate on this now as I’m tired and I don’t want this to become a novel, either.
Thanks for your patience, thanks for Elite and cheers!
this has bothered me for quite some time now but I’ve never found the time to write it all up so far (not being a native speaker, a wall of text like this takes me ages…).
All the more I hope you take notice and maybe there’s even a chance you might consider implementing parts of this concept.
There are some issues and inconsistencies concerning npc crew and multi-crew that bug me and apparently other cmdrs as well.
I think there’s a possibility to bring it all in line much more, while at the same time contributing to gameplay.
Of course, it’s a game and not everything has to be logical but as long as there’s no drawbacks, I think, credibility and consistency is worthwile.
There’s one topic the whole forum seems to agree: Crew members take too much credits when idle.
The way it is now, there’s no incentive at all to train more than one crew pilot. Many cmdrs even only hire a pilot when they need one and ditch them again before redeeming their reward. I’m sure that’s not how you envisioned that. It’s even an issue when you have only one pilot. Why on earth should they get a cut of 10 to 16% (when elite) of the income I make by exploring or whatever other task they’re useless for? Let alone 30 to 48% when you have three of them…
I agree, they should be paid also when idle (after all they have to live from something, too) but I’ll come to that later.
I agree, they should be paid also when idle (after all they have to live from something, too) but I’ll come to that later.
Another popular gripe is crew members dying on ship destruction, whilst the cmdr magically reappears at some station an instant later.
This is another reason why people don’t bother to train a crew member.
I’ve also read several posts where cmdrs say they don’t bring their pilots, whom they trained for so long, to a fight they might lose. What’s the point then?
Besides, it’s just not very credible that there aren’t any precautions for crew members on our ships.
Yes, I know, others say, the pilots actually don’t die but are rather just fed up with your incompetence and therefore quit. Hardly believable, too.
Of course there should be consequences but, again, some patience.
I’ve also read several posts where cmdrs say they don’t bring their pilots, whom they trained for so long, to a fight they might lose. What’s the point then?
Besides, it’s just not very credible that there aren’t any precautions for crew members on our ships.
Yes, I know, others say, the pilots actually don’t die but are rather just fed up with your incompetence and therefore quit. Hardly believable, too.
Of course there should be consequences but, again, some patience.
Another thing that breaks my (hate to say it) immersun, is the possibility to tele-presence across the whole galaxy!
So in order to be provided with vital market information or about services on stations etc. we need to have docked at the respective station first. While I basically like the aspect of discovery I still find it a little odd, given that we’re able to share such information in real-time across our planet at present. While for some reason this doesn’t seem to be possible within the bubble, we’re still able to fight in real-time across the whole galaxy via tele-presence!
I know this is a more controversial topic than those above but give me the opportunity to make an alternative suggestion.
I know this is a more controversial topic than those above but give me the opportunity to make an alternative suggestion.
For some reason hardly explainable lore-wise, multi-crew members appear in your cockpit but npc crew don’t.
I know there’s a technical reason but I’m sure that’s nothing unsolvable. I’m well aware that my suggestions (which will follow, I promise) would require significant time to develop and that there’s also bugs to be fixed, new content to be added etc. I’m talking long-term here…
Now to my proposal:
Crew pilots' cut:
Idle crew pilots receive a well reduced share of all your profit (like about 2%).
Active crew pilots’ cut stays the way it is currently.
On ship destruction:
Crew pilots get rescued just like cmdrs do!
One consequence would be a loss in the pilot's experience on ship destruction (like half a rank?).
Another consequence, depending on how you use the pilot, further below.
Treat npc-crew like modules (not literally though...).
Raise the number of obtainable pilots to 10.
Instead of magically being available at any station’s crew lounge, they need actual whereabouts!
Cmdrs then have two options:
Option A)
Place them in any suitable ship like you would fit a module. The pilot is physically present on your bridge and stays on that ship unless transferred!
As long as you use that ship the pilot is active, otherwise idle.
Pilot is also visible in the multi-crew seat.
Pros:
As long as you use that ship the pilot is active, otherwise idle.
Pilot is also visible in the multi-crew seat.
Pros:
[*=1]You don’t forget to set your pilot active all the time when changing ships.
[*=1]The pilot isn’t subject to tele-presence range limits (I’ll elaborate on that later).
[*=1]Reduced transfer cost for this ship as it will be transferred by its dedicated crew pilot.
Cons:
[*=1]The pilot significantly increases the rebuy cost of your ship (like an expensive module). This will cover the rescue cost on ship destruction.
Leave the pilot at any starport as a tele-presence operator.
He/she can be ordered to your ship via tele-presence just like currently but only within the tele-presence signal range (again, see further below).
Pilot will be visible in the multi-crew seat, visually represented as a hologram.
Pros:
He/she can be ordered to your ship via tele-presence just like currently but only within the tele-presence signal range (again, see further below).
Pilot will be visible in the multi-crew seat, visually represented as a hologram.
Pros:
[*=1]Is available for all suitable ships within signal range.
[*=1]Pilots ordered via tele-presence don’t add to ship insurance.
Cons:
[*=1]Subject to limited signal range.
[*=1]Unwary cmdrs might forget to set their pilots active, just like now.
edit: screw that! To keep it in line with multi-crew, unlike now you should be able to order tele-presence operators within range at any time. Makes way more sense anyway!
- Order the pilot to operate the fighter via tele-presence (the logical choice in every combat scenario).
- Order the pilot to actually board the fighter (would even justify the fact that our fighters have cockpits, right?). On fighter destruction the pilot would actually, irreversibly die, of course. Thus it would be impractical for combat scenarios. For possible future exploration tasks, however, the benefit would be the SLF not being subject to its inherent signal range limit…)
Multi-crew:
I know there’s two camps here. I’m one of those who would happily fly to a system, meet a friend at a station and physically join his ship for some multi-crew adventure. However, from several threads concerning the topic, I know there’s also those who outright reject this and are happy with the tele-presence thing. I see no reason not to offer both options with their pros and cons, analogous to npc pilots (well, other than the effort to implement this, obviously).
So just like with npc crew you have:
Option A)
Rendezvous at a station and physically join your mate’s ship. You stay at the ship until you get dropped off at the same station (and therefore your own ship), get dropped off at any other station with a shipyard (to have your ship transferred), or use the rescue pod, in which case you respawn at the rendezvous point but lose all reward claims you may have made during your trip (bounty claims, exploration data etc.).
Pros:
Pros:
[*=1]Only when physically present at someone’s ship the extra pip is given.
[*=1]You gain the right to pilot your mate’s ship, without access to weapons (avoiding exploits). This way you can set out on an exploration trip together and take turns at piloting, which can be pretty useful on long-distance journeys. Responsibility for the ship remains with its owner, so be careful whom you entrust your ship to…
Must be even more immursive to set out on a long distance exploration trip this way. First discoveries would be shared. You could even name your expedition which would be mentioned in the galmap alongside the cmdrs' names when submitting the exploration data.
Multi-crew member could also fly off with an SLF (only for planetary exploration – no FSD on SLFs!). SLF could again be manned physically to circumvent the signal range limit, carrying the risk of mortal danger… (see above)
Join any ship using tele-presence just like now.
Again, you’ll be visually represented as a hologram.
Pros:
Again, you’ll be visually represented as a hologram.
Pros:
[*=1]No need to rendezvous at a station
[*=1]No need to get dropped off in order not to lose any reward claims
Cons:
[*=1]No extra pip
[*=1]Subject to signal range limit
Now to Tele-presence:
When it came out I first thought it’s a stupid idea tbh, but I soon realised it’s necessary for SLFs, as I wouldn’t want my pilot to be dead every time the fighter blows up. After all, we control drones over vast distances at present, too, so why shouldn’t it be possible with our ships at game-time?
But please – not across the whole galaxy!
I suggest to introduce a signal range limit.
SLFs have an inherent signal range limit already, so why not apply the same concept to our ships? Being much larger vessels, capable of carrying more sophisticated transponders, it’s only reasonable that their range far exceeds the SLFs’ signal range.
I’m sure there are opponents of a range limit. Sure, it’s very convenient that I’m able to hop into a friend’s ship for some pew pew while actually being out in the black, thousands of lightyears away from the bubble. One of Elite’s strengths, however, is how immersive it can be to set out on a journey, knowing to meet no one for weeks or months to come. Just you and your ship. It’s a decision you make. I know, I don’t have to use it, but the very possibility to just tele-hop into someone’s ship in the bubble breaks that to some extent.
Conversely, it may be nice to hop into some explorer’s ship near Sag A* or wherever from the bubble but I think there’s enough youtube videos for that…
Conversely, it may be nice to hop into some explorer’s ship near Sag A* or wherever from the bubble but I think there’s enough youtube videos for that…
You’d have the option to equip any of your ships with their dedicated pilot (giving the ships all the more personality) or scatter some pilots across strategic systems within the bubble to get a good coverage of tele-presence operators (dedicated operator icons and coverage indicators in the galmap)!
That’s about it!
Anyone read this far? Kudos and thanks a lot!
Two more things, if you’re still with me:
Not vital, but what I’d also like is the option to design crew pilots with the holo-me editor. You put a lot of effort in creating it, why not give us more reason to use it?
My personal experience with crew pilots:
Compared to mission givers, for some reason most crew pilots look kinda odd. Took me a while to find one I liked: Unfortunately she was Expert already, but at the time the contract was made, I didn’t know about the drawback this would bring in the long run. So since Daleysa reached elite, she alone takes 16% of my income and has made more than 1.5 billion credits since „working“ for me. She could long have bought a fleet of Cutters and started her own business but she’s not stupid and knows she’s better off with me…
Hence, after a while I started training a harmless pilot. Again it took me a while to find Isaac. He’s now elite, too, and takes another 10% of my income.
That’s more than a quarter of any credits I make for only two pilots watching tv and consuming Onion Head or whatever they do most of their time.
So I’ve been toying with the idea of ditching Daleysa for quite some time now, but someway I grew fond of her. Plus, I have hopes that you, dear developers, accept that this is out of all proportion…
As meanwhile I’ve become used to have two pilots to choose from and in preparation of dumping Daleysa in case you have no insight, I just hired another harmless pilot, Sidney, but I immediately had to ditch her again as she wouldn’t stop claiming she was taking control of the mothership despite being assigned to the fighter…
Compared to mission givers, for some reason most crew pilots look kinda odd. Took me a while to find one I liked: Unfortunately she was Expert already, but at the time the contract was made, I didn’t know about the drawback this would bring in the long run. So since Daleysa reached elite, she alone takes 16% of my income and has made more than 1.5 billion credits since „working“ for me. She could long have bought a fleet of Cutters and started her own business but she’s not stupid and knows she’s better off with me…
Hence, after a while I started training a harmless pilot. Again it took me a while to find Isaac. He’s now elite, too, and takes another 10% of my income.
That’s more than a quarter of any credits I make for only two pilots watching tv and consuming Onion Head or whatever they do most of their time.
So I’ve been toying with the idea of ditching Daleysa for quite some time now, but someway I grew fond of her. Plus, I have hopes that you, dear developers, accept that this is out of all proportion…
As meanwhile I’ve become used to have two pilots to choose from and in preparation of dumping Daleysa in case you have no insight, I just hired another harmless pilot, Sidney, but I immediately had to ditch her again as she wouldn’t stop claiming she was taking control of the mothership despite being assigned to the fighter…
Personally I’d also get rid of the 3rd person view for the gunner in multi-crew. It’s point and click and doesn’t do justice to the game. I tried it once with a friend and never since.
I know, why you chose that but imho there are way more entertaining ways to implement the gunner role. I think it wouldn’t even require much effort.
I have a pretty concrete vision for that, too. However, I won’t further elaborate on this now as I’m tired and I don’t want this to become a novel, either.
Thanks for your patience, thanks for Elite and cheers!
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