Newcomer / Intro NPE: What is lacking

[Tick]

Self-docking has to be the most annoying thing ever constructed by the gaming industry. The first attempt at an outpost took me nearly 30 minutes from flying past the station, to the approach, the docking 'lights' going out on my first pass then having to guess what one was landing pad 1, getting told I'll be shot down if I don't move in time, accidentally hitting 'U' and being fined for having guns deploy.

I seriously almost deleted the game. I did, however, already tell my friends to not buy the game though. It seems a good portion of the game was developed by people who were already intimately familiar with the game and enjoy dumbing down the copmputer systems of a sci-fi ship to require a human to push every button to retract every item.... I mean self-land should be a feature you do after you are proficient at flying not before. Auto docking should be core and a 1 click thing. Docking as to be the least enjoyable aspect of the game as you have to do it more often than anything else in the game.

I should be able to set a destination in-system by using my mouse and clicking on the station I want to go to; direction arrows in the HUD should display for fixed targets like nav beacons, stations, planets ect. when you select one of them from the system map. Setting a destination from the galaxy map should be a simple mouse click, and having the pop-up menu disappearing on you if your mouse moves even a slight bit off is just stupid. It can take 2-3 attempts to click on a system then slide the mouse over to set a destination to it and not have the pop-up menu disappear on me... I prefer using a mouse to navigate menus... Not qwesda keyboard controls, and I certainly won't be buying a cheap HID like a joystick for one game, and won't be using a joystick to navigate the menus. 99% of PC gamers use a mouse. Menus and various interface options in screens should be mouse driven.

Having to alt+Tab out of the game to read how to select the destination I'm looking at in the map is not good for retaining new gamers, having to use Alt+Tab to figure out all the steps I have to do to engage the hyperspace is not cool. When I engage the jump drive, have the landing gear and guns automatically retract if I hold down the Jump drive key. This avoids accidental taps that may trigger it. Nothing is more infuriating for a new player than retracting your guns to be given the "error" when you try to use hyperspace. Then when you figure out what it is you have to open the controls menu and scroll down a horrible amount of options to see what key raises the landing gear...

In the future ships would have these sort of things automated. I have no interest in managing every single button and aspect of my ship. Such micro-management disappeared as computer systems moved out of the 1990's.


I'm sure if I invest hours and hours into the learning curve I will figure it all out, but you're asking new players to invest an ass load of time to figure out stuff that serves no purpose other than busy work. Stuff that once you figure out adds nothing to the game-play. It's literally just motions you have to repeat over and over and over to perform the basic aspects of the game. Sure some people may enjoy this, but others will not. This will result in funding for the game drying up and it fading into the bargain discount bin of games before it even has a chance to perform.


I'm sure this game is fun, but new players won't flock towards it the way it is currently set up. As much as I want to See games like Star Citizen and Elite Dangerous succeed and revive the space PC game genre I don't see this game lasting for the reasons I've stated and similar ones I have not.

 

[Myrmidon]

I, for one, enjoy the realism of manual docking. That being said, I've been having a hard time with it recognizing a *perfectly* aligned ship touching down as gently as an angel's kiss.

What resonates with me about this post is that I too get the distinct impression that this game was made by & for veteran players of the game. The controls, the tutorials, it all glazes over lots of basic details, assuming them obvious.

 

[euclydian]

I'm sorry, most of your suggestions sound horrible to me. However, there are a couple of bugs related to landing at the moment which might be causing you frustration. The beacon that lights up your pad for example is not meant to disappear before you land. Hopefully that'll be fixed soon.

Still, the very few manual things there are (this is no way compares to a flight sim) are things I enjoy and make the game interesting for me. I assume you didn't play the previous games? It's not meant to be an arcade game as such like you might prefer.

 

[Almighty Bob]

Out post are easier than going through the slot. Do this

Lock on outpost
100% thrust
at 7.49 KM request docking
look for any landing pad
If yours is not obvious at 1km go 0% thrust and drop your landing gear
then use your up thrusters to orbit the station at a distance that you can see enough detail to spot your pad

Do not use a lot of yaw to align yourself if you are in close but facing the wrong way. it is better to go to a very slow speed or stop and pitch/roll into position then go forwards to touchdown

 

[Tick]

I'm sorry, most of your suggestions sound horrible to me. However, there are a couple of bugs related to landing at the moment which might be causing you frustration. The beacon that lights up your pad for example is not meant to disappear before you land. Hopefully that'll be fixed soon.

Still, the very few manual things there are (this is no way compares to a flight sim) are things I enjoy and make the game interesting for me. I assume you didn't play the previous games? It's not meant to be an arcade game as such like you might prefer.

No I didn't play them, and making a game to assume players of this game played the last will result in a VERY small player base that cannot fund even the servers to keep the game going over the long-haul.

I played every single War Commander, Privateer, Privateer 2, Freelancer etc.

These games had a learning curve but the very beginning basics were intuitive so you could move on to the meat and potatoes of the game and spend days and days figuring out those and mastering the stuff the game is actually about.

When I showed my friends (4 of them over the past 2 days) Every single one of them said they thought it was overly complicated for no reason. New players shouldn't be forced to micro-manage all these aspects on their first log-in. These manual aspects should be for us to explore later on when we have more vested interest in the game and can learn them faster/put up with the frustration due to the hours previously sunk into the game.

It's disheartening to see this game go down the eventual path to obscurity. I had high hopes.

 

[Borgkube]

Self-docking has to be the most annoying thing ever constructed by the gaming industry. The first attempt at an outpost took me nearly 30 minutes from flying past the station, to the approach, the docking 'lights' going out on my first pass then having to guess what one was landing pad 1, getting told I'll be shot down if I don't move in time, accidentally hitting 'U' and being fined for having guns deploy.

I seriously almost deleted the game. I did, however, already tell my friends to not buy the game though. It seems a good portion of the game was developed by people who were already intimately familiar with the game and enjoy dumbing down the copmputer systems of a sci-fi ship to require a human to push every button to retract every item.... I mean self-land should be a feature you do after you are proficient at flying not before. Auto docking should be core and a 1 click thing. Docking as to be the least enjoyable aspect of the game as you have to do it more often than anything else in the game.

I should be able to set a destination in-system by using my mouse and clicking on the station I want to go to; direction arrows in the HUD should display for fixed targets like nav beacons, stations, planets ect. when you select one of them from the system map. Setting a destination from the galaxy map should be a simple mouse click, and having the pop-up menu disappearing on you if your mouse moves even a slight bit off is just stupid. It can take 2-3 attempts to click on a system then slide the mouse over to set a destination to it and not have the pop-up menu disappear on me... I prefer using a mouse to navigate menus... Not qwesda keyboard controls, and I certainly won't be buying a cheap HID like a joystick for one game, and won't be using a joystick to navigate the menus. 99% of PC gamers use a mouse. Menus and various interface options in screens should be mouse driven.

Having to alt+Tab out of the game to read how to select the destination I'm looking at in the map is not good for retaining new gamers, having to use Alt+Tab to figure out all the steps I have to do to engage the hyperspace is not cool. When I engage the jump drive, have the landing gear and guns automatically retract if I hold down the Jump drive key. This avoids accidental taps that may trigger it. Nothing is more infuriating for a new player than retracting your guns to be given the "error" when you try to use hyperspace. Then when you figure out what it is you have to open the controls menu and scroll down a horrible amount of options to see what key raises the landing gear...

In the future ships would have these sort of things automated. I have no interest in managing every single button and aspect of my ship. Such micro-management disappeared as computer systems moved out of the 1990's.


I'm sure if I invest hours and hours into the learning curve I will figure it all out, but you're asking new players to invest an ass load of time to figure out stuff that serves no purpose other than busy work. Stuff that once you figure out adds nothing to the game-play. It's literally just motions you have to repeat over and over and over to perform the basic aspects of the game. Sure some people may enjoy this, but others will not. This will result in funding for the game drying up and it fading into the bargain discount bin of games before it even has a chance to perform.


I'm sure this game is fun, but new players won't flock towards it the way it is currently set up. As much as I want to See games like Star Citizen and Elite Dangerous succeed and revive the space PC game genre I don't see this game lasting for the reasons I've stated and similar ones I have not.

So then... that would be a negative review?

 

[Norbert]

I think you missed the main point of Elite gaming. We like it BECAUSE it is complicated and that's why we backed it. If not, no publisher would have left David Braben and his team doing it. They would have argued just like you do here that it is too complicated for the masses.

So when I see such a thread, I realize how much we should be proud to have supported Frontier's vision. And besides, we don't care if it takes the path of obscurity, cause we backed it just for that, the beautiful obscurity of the milky way

 

[Tick]

Out post are easier than going through the slot. Do this

Lock on outpost
100% thrust
at 7.49 KM request docking
look for any landing pad
If yours is not obvious at 1km go 0% thrust and drop your landing gear
then use your up thrusters to orbit the station at a distance that you can see enough detail to spot your pad

Do not use a lot of yaw to align yourself if you are in close but facing the wrong way. it is better to go to a very slow speed or stop and pitch/roll into position then go forwards to touchdown

I stopped at about 6km out and alt+tabbed to figure out how to ask for docking permission (why are not communication options brought up in a a menu when you lock onto a station sub 10km automatically anyways?!?!? You can always cancel it) I got permission then a square started glowing. I began heading towards it..

Ohh and the planet I was going to was not visible in the solar system I went to it was a whole planet tethered to another planet. I had to fly to the 3rd planet before I even had a visual icon on my display showing the 4th planet.... I spent a good 30 minutes flying around the sun trying to see the planets along the ecliptic and going from the 1st to the 11th and only the 4th was not visible.... I finally flew to the 3rd planet because numerically it was the one before, and then voila! there was the 4th planet.

I flew past the landing pad on my first approach by about 100 meters or so then the light went out and I had to turn around to see where to go... I had a message saying "proceed to landing pad 1" on the pad there was multiple Zone 1's and 2's I tried to stop at zone 1 and nothing. so I sped up to make another pass hoping maybe I can use an automatic land or something. Turning back to face the outpost No landing pad lights were on, so I had to begin flying around the station looking for anything that looked like a landing surface. I got multiple warnings that I will be targeted so I had to fly out and try again.

So I alt+Tabbed and watched a You-tube video on how to dock on these things. Then lining up the damn circle took a while because even though the bullseye was blue I was not docked. Using up/down thrust over and over and faster and faster I eventually slammed down into the surface hard enough to dock.


then I had to Alt+tab to figure out how to complete my contract because I had a forgiving 3 minutes left on it.

 

[Tick]

I think you missed the main point of Elite gaming. We like it BECAUSE it is complicated and that's why we backed it. If not, no publisher would have left David Braben and his team doing it. They would have argued just like you do here that it is too complicated for the masses.

So when I see such a thread, I realize how much we should be proud to have supported Frontier's vision. And besides, we don't care if it takes the path of obscurity, cause we backed it just for that, the beautiful obscurity of the milky way

Add the complexity once new players figure out the basics. We auto land and have the hard-points retract when we hold down "J" instead of pressing it, more mouse usage in menus. Let us add the complexity as we see fit. Just because you have been playing the game longer doesn't mean new players just jump up to the same micro management instantly.

I have to play the game to buy a docking computer that automates the process... You're saying you like the complexity once you play the game, so why is the auto-docking only avail. after you play the game for a while?

Unless the NPE encourages people to explore the game and accept the increasing degrees of complexity then the funds won't be there to keep the game going, and the developers will all say "We were right! There is no market for Space Sims" and the Genre goes into another hibernation for 20 years.

 

[Muthax]

OP, thanks for your feedback. Yeah, it's a game for fans of Elite, it's not a dumbed down shooter.
It won't be for everyone and that's ok
Have fun with whatever is you like

Bye!

 

[Juby]

Sorry OP! I think you have bought the wrong game.

If you wanted a simulation style, space flight, combat, trade, adventure game that doesn't spoon feed you and expects you to investigate, learn, and work to earn the right and the equipment to be good at whichever path you choose to take then this is the game for you.

If you wanted a "press 1 button (the trigger) for everything" space combat game then this is, unfortunately, not the game for you.

I am new to Elite Dangerous having only played since release and I am not having any of the issues you are reporting. I like the complexity and having to do things manually, for me, makes the game more immersive - If I just had to fly in the general direction of a station to dock would just be boring. It may be worth checking out the tutorial videos which go though all the things about docking, travel (supercruise/hyperspace), using the map, etc. If after that the game is still too much for you then there is not much we can do here other than to hope you find a different game that is more to your liking.

 

[Muthax]

No I didn't play them, and making a game to assume players of this game played the last will result in a VERY small player base that cannot fund even the servers to keep the game going over the long-haul.

I played every single War Commander, Privateer, Privateer 2, Freelancer etc.

These games had a learning curve but the very beginning basics were intuitive so you could move on to the meat and potatoes of the game and spend days and days figuring out those and mastering the stuff the game is actually about.

When I showed my friends (4 of them over the past 2 days) Every single one of them said they thought it was overly complicated for no reason. New players shouldn't be forced to micro-manage all these aspects on their first log-in. These manual aspects should be for us to explore later on when we have more vested interest in the game and can learn them faster/put up with the frustration due to the hours previously sunk into the game.

It's disheartening to see this game go down the eventual path to obscurity. I had high hopes.

Sorry but your whole post (the bolded part in particular) sound very... trollish.

Please try to stay constructive and avoid the pitfalls of "I speak for the world, I know everything and if you don't do as I say this game will die"

You have NO idea what the target for this game was and why

Regards

 

[Diwrnach]

So I alt+Tabbed and watched a You-tube video on how to dock on these things.

You are offered an option to take a tutorial on loading the game. For whatever reason, you chose to skip it. Now you're having problems. Go figure.

 

[Revenheart]

Sorry you feel disappointed but that's how i felt in 84.
Friends had no problems docking me for the life of me I could not get to grips with it.
My solution was to launch and dock for several hour till i got it right. Use the training missions I found them useful.
Even docked first time with out a problem (other than my flight-stick hat not working for left trust...)
Practice makes perfect and then the universe is yours to explore.

 

[Quintrix]

Sorry OP! I think you have bought the wrong game.

If you wanted a simulation style, space flight, combat, trade, adventure game that doesn't spoon feed you and expects you to investigate, learn, and work to earn the right and the equipment to be good at whichever path you choose to take then this is the game for you.

If you wanted a "press 1 button (the trigger) for everything" space combat game then this is, unfortunately, not the game for you.

I am new to Elite Dangerous having only played since release and I am not having any of the issues you are reporting. I like the complexity and having to do things manually, for me, makes the game more immersive - If I just had to fly in the general direction of a station to dock would just be boring. It may be worth checking out the tutorial videos which go though all the things about docking, travel (supercruise/hyperspace), using the map, etc. If after that the game is still too much for you then there is not much we can do here other than to hope you find a different game that is more to your liking.

Exactly...

I started playing on the 16th when it was released... if you can't be prepared to spend a few hours learning - and ENJOYING the learning - then you are probably more suited to the 'instant gratification' type game/lifestyle that seems to be prevalent these days.

Kids these days eh? No patience or concept of real quality.

 

[Diwrnach]

I think you missed the main point of Elite gaming. We like it BECAUSE it is complicated and that's why we backed it. If not, no publisher would have left David Braben and his team doing it. They would have argued just like you do here that it is too complicated for the masses.

This.

I'm actually very impressed how Dangerous has maintained the feel of the original game.

 

[StainzE]

The joy of this game is just like the first day I logged onto SWG (Star Wars Galaxies - sandbox MMO (before it was ruined! by SoE!). In that game you had a little starters which gave you the basics.. then you landed on a planet of my choosing. Mine was Tattooine! you walk out of the spaceport... and it was like, right?! OK?! Now what?! The Galaxy is your oyster.... explore and enjoy. Watch youtube vids..... google to your hearts content.. there's loads of vital info out there.

I personally love the realism (sandbox) approach to the game... I certainly don't want it going down the route of a single click game like WoW became to make the kiddies play it.. (no digs etc.....). I just like the fact that you feel immersed into a real kind of situation. Docking is pretty easy to be fair, it took a while, but now I can do it second nature. I certainly don't want a one button click, docking solution. Although, I think you can buy something for your ship for auto docking?? a bit like an ILS landing system, I guess?

 

[TaoZero5]

Before you give up on this, OP, Download OrbiterSim and the addons needed for the DGVI (of course, all of that takes some figuring out) then fly the Delta Glider IV to dock with the ISS.

After a few hours of that, you will have a real appreciation for just how simple flying a Sidewinder is.

 

[CmdrJacks]

Keep practicing and one day you'll come to this forum and see someone struggling with docking and you will smile and think to yourself: "yes, I mastered this". Then you'll probably leave some sarcastic comment about the person not being the right type of person to play the game and move on.

 

[Lordswift]

Play eve online. Sounds exactly what you want. right click dock, warp to, attack. Did you actually do your research before buying this game? I never have played the previous Elite games due to not being old enough to, but i knew this game wouldn't be a cake walk.