Fiction Official Guidebooks for fiction writers.

[Sloma]

Hello everyone,

So far I'm enjoying reading all Fiction Books, I'm not going to say which one is my favourite but I have one I enjoy reading them so much I often end up talking about Official Fiction on TS during ED sessions.

Being an active member of polish community I often come across people who say that as much as they would like to read any book from Elite universe they can't because they don't speak the language. I think it's probably highly unlikely that we're going to see them translated in polish. I would like to be wrong on this though but I'm being realistic.

However, there are also people who would like to write and they say they have one big problem. Atm, there is a problem to gather enough resources about background world from Elite, there are different sources of unofficial information like Wikis, blogs, fan websites, etc. The problem with I see is they contain loads of inaccurate or outdated information.

I know the authors of official fiction were able to get an access to Official Guidebooks containing proper information about the world of ED. My question probably should be addressed to FD but are these guidebooks ever going to be released? Anyone knows anything? It wouldn't do any harm to FD, authors or publishers but it would greatly help anyone wanting to write a story based in Elite universe using different language. What do you think about this? Probably the best person to answer this would be Michael Brookes.

 

[Joe Spivey]

I would love to write Elite based stories, even just fan fiction shorts. Such a guidebook is needed.

 

[Susimetsa]

We did have some guidebooks, but we also had an uber-long questions and answers thread for all those questions that the guidebooks did not have answers for. So, if the guidebooks are ever going to be published, they need to be worked over to include all the detail that ended up in Q&A threads etc.

And, even then, the Q&A threads only touched on the specific questions that the authors had pertaining to their own stories. New stories might face different needs and answers would again have to be specifically asked for.

 

[JeffRyan]

I think David Hughes RPG when it comes out will have information we're all looking for. Likewise I've wanted to see the writers guides since I knew of their existence, but for writers eyes only I'm afraid.

 

[Flowswithdrek]

I think David Hughes RPG when it comes out will have information we're all looking for. Likewise I've wanted to see the writers guides since I knew of their existence, but for writers eyes only I'm afraid.

As an RPG I would think there will be some good structured information and back story on he various factions and other elements of the universe. I think it will be as close to a guide book as is likely for the time being. I can't say for sure as I'm not involved in the RPG, but I'm sure it will also have limitations in that respect that frontier has set and it also has to be an RPG.

 

[Allen Stroud]

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

It is interesting that when people know documents exist, they want to read them. The publication for the Silmarillion was born out of such a clamour and as many people cite it as a work of genius as those who cite it as a piece of tedium.

I put a lot of work into the guidebooks and there is scope for some of the information appearing in the same way Star Citizen collated their history, although I would suggest the Elite guide material is easier to follow.

However, the guides in their existing form were not written for publication. They were written as reference material for writers. There is a distinct difference. Last year when I was looking at writing a story in the Dark Crystal Universe, I re-purchased a copy of 'World of the Dark Crystal' - a massive coffee table book that narrates much of the history of the fascinating world of Skeksis and Uru created by Jim Henson and Brian Froud. But, the book was next to useless as a reference source, requiring long periods of study to glean any useful answers. When a work is not really ready for publication, it can make the world lose a bit of lustre. The world bible available from GOG that goes with the Wing Commander Franchise is a case in point.

The other problem is, when the cupboard becomes bare, you have to keep refilling it. Currently the existing fiction is selling, but not in massive numbers, which is understandable as the game has not been released. However, this doesn't provide an incentive for more things to be published at this stage. We the loyal followers of all things Elite, would all dearly love to see more and more fiction produced - guidebooks, gazetteers, appendices, timelines, histories and novels, but they have to be economically viable.

Frontier need to see the return on investment of time and resources and so do the writers.

It is also worth pointing out the relative value of writing. One of the reasons I'm not a fan of wikis and open access is that they devalue effort. One of the reasons I like them that is that they can bring a wider participatory audience. The sword is two-edged.

Despite all this, I still expect and understand people considering themselves exceptions and wanting to read the guidebooks anyway. Its part of the nature of constructing myth in stories that people want to know more .

 

[Sloma]

I put a lot of work into the guidebooks and there is scope for some of the information appearing in the same way Star Citizen collated their history, although I would suggest the Elite guide material is easier to follow.

Even something similar to what Star Citizen has done or like it was presented in Gazetteer, anything would be better than nothing.

Currently the existing fiction is selling, but not in massive numbers, which is understandable as the game has not been released. However, this doesn't provide an incentive for more things to be published at this stage. We the loyal followers of all things Elite, would all dearly love to see more and more fiction produced - guidebooks, gazetteers, appendices, timelines, histories and novels, but they have to be economically viable.

Frontier need to see the return on investment of time and resources and so do the writers.

Oh, I agree 100% but that is why where official fiction fails to fill the gaps open source should step in. It's not going to devalue excellent work you and other people have done. I also cannot agree with open source devaluing any effort because people who take part in open source are also putting a lot of effort in. And I don't see this as competition from open source particularly if you translating material that would have never ever been translated.

I guess we need to wait and see.

Oh, I love your book

 

[Darren Grey]

I hope we'll eventually see something like the Frontier Gazetteer, perhaps in an in-game encyclopaedia a bit like Mass Effect has.

 

[JeffRyan]

It is interesting that when people know documents exist, they want to read them. The publication for the Silmarillion was born out of such a clamour and as many people cite it as a work of genius as those who cite it as a piece of tedium.

Heh, you brought up the Silmarillion the last time we discussed this. And then, same as now I pointed out I'm one of the people who owns and loves not only the Silmarillion and the Unfinished Tales, but also the History of Middle-Earth, all 12 volumes.

I get your point though, but I'm one of those people who absolutely loves history. Real or feigned, I like to know the details of the worlds I temporarily live in. I suppose in some ways it would be better if I didn't know those guides existed.

And I expect book sales to pick up a) When the physical books are actually available and b) as you say when the game is released. I think you're also hurt right now by the fact that a lot of the hardest core that would have bought them on release are already backers of the various projects and have them in some form 'for free'.

 

[Allen Stroud]

Even something similar to what Star Citizen has done or like it was presented in Gazetteer, anything would be better than nothing.

There isn't nothing available. The Frontier Gazetteer and the FFE newsletter journals are available for free. There is a whole plethora of previously published work also available. Granted, some things have been revised from both to establish the canon for the new game, but there's enough in those documents to give people a real flavour.

Oh, I agree 100% but that is why where official fiction fails to fill the gaps open source should step in. It's not going to devalue excellent work you and other people have done. I also cannot agree with open source devaluing any effort because people who take part in open source are also putting a lot of effort in. And I don't see this as competition from open source particularly if you translating material that would have never ever been translated.

I think you might be making a couple of assumptions. 1) About what was or wasn't open source from the current work done and 2) that the material will never be translated.

I have said the guidebook material would make for a good history guide, but it would need re-writing into the right journalese. However, Frontier make the decisions on that.

Oh, I love your book

Thanks. You can probably tell from the chapter end inserts the kind of style I'd consider bringing to the guides.

Heh, you brought up the Silmarillion the last time we discussed this. And then, same as now I pointed out I'm one of the people who owns and loves not only the Silmarillion and the Unfinished Tales, but also the History of Middle-Earth, all 12 volumes.

I did, but not quite in the same way. I know your view on this Jeff and totally get it. I wouldn't have got involved in the project if I hadn't (originally) had a similar mind for the background.

I get your point though, but I'm one of those people who absolutely loves history. Real or feigned, I like to know the details of the worlds I temporarily live in. I suppose in some ways it would be better if I didn't know those guides existed.

Who knows what will be brought out? Ultimately not even those holding the keys to the gates. We need to see what generates a demand.

And I expect book sales to pick up a) When the physical books are actually available and b) as you say when the game is released. I think you're also hurt right now by the fact that a lot of the hardest core that would have bought them on release are already backers of the various projects and have them in some form 'for free'.

Indeed, I hope so to and don't begrudge the development model at all. However, when you're the writer and you haven't seen any return for eighteen months of your free time, you can perhaps see how the demand for more is both encouraging (great you like what I do) and also a dilemma.

Unfortunately, I'd give away all of my work for free if I could, just because I know people love the original material as much as I do.

 

[JeffRyan]

You can probably tell from the chapter end inserts the kind of style I'd consider bringing to the guides.

That sounds like you just volunteered.

MICHAEL!

 

[Darren Grey]

Heh, you brought up the Silmarillion the last time we discussed this. And then, same as now I pointed out I'm one of the people who owns and loves not only the Silmarillion and the Unfinished Tales, but also the History of Middle-Earth, all 12 volumes.

Same here! I think I mentioned to Allen once that the Silmarillion is my favourite book and he said "oh right" in that slightly surprised and disapproving way It was a tough read first time, but after a few reads and a thorough read of the History books I got a real appreciation of the massive epic that lay behind the unfinished story. A bit like the tree that Niggle was always trying to draw...

 

[JeffRyan]

Same here! I think I mentioned to Allen once that the Silmarillion is my favourite book and he said "oh right" in that slightly surprised and disapproving way It was a tough read first time, but after a few reads and a thorough read of the History books I got a real appreciation of the massive epic that lay behind the unfinished story. A bit like the tree that Niggle was always trying to draw...

I still tear up at just the thought of Niggle finding his tree. I hope Ronnie found his.

 

[Allen Stroud]

That sounds like you just volunteered.

MICHAEL!

Michael already knows what additional work I would do and has an idea of (some) of the work I've already done.

 

[Sloma]

(...) I think you might be making a couple of assumptions. 1) About what was or wasn't open source from the current work done and 2) that the material will never be translated. (...)

1. My assumption wouldn't treat any current work as open source rather as a tool if it makes sense and I only mean Guidebooks when I say this. If it's going to be used further as a foundation to create more work it makes perfect sense to treat it like this, however bad this name sounds. Having this in mind I would rely only on good will gesture of the authors / publishers / developer or all of them together to release it later at some point in time. Unless all this material is going to be modified and released in different form then it can't be treated like that. I can only speculate about the their character as I've never seen them, you're right.
2. Well, you're right I only speculate but it would be fantastic if I was wrong with my assumptions