PvP Ok, I´ll stay in Open. Now I dont want to run all the time :)

Treptower Park

T
With the help of some kind gentlemen on these very forums I had a blast flying in Open. Built my Asplorer and Python so they´ll survive alpha strike and been working on my evading skills since then. Got away from some shieldless Couriers, Monstervettes & iClippers. FSD disruption is still a problem. Cost me a couple rebuys. As did going Silent Running accidentally a couple times. Keybinding gone for now [noob]

Since I started to dislike being chased away from the HazRes in Nu Tauri last night, I had the crazy idea of trying to shoot back.
Decided to rebuild my PvE Vulture. She looks like that right now:

https://eddp.co/u/X6Xxn78r

Reason is, the rebuy is not too significant. She´s agile & packs a punch. And her name is B!tchslap [heart]
And thats exactly what I want her to do. Drop in, dance around, do some damage and beeline out :)
This is mostly for combat practice. And practice I do need. I´m a gimbal-monkey with the occasional poor FAoff attempt.
And in hairy situations I tend to lose orientation. Fixed is not an option atm.

I heard phasing sequence damages the hull even with shields up? That´d be exactly my cup of tea. How would that work?
I wont be destroying well flown midrange ships anytime soon. But I´d like to sting a little. Catch my drift?

What would you do? (Primarily weapon-wise. But countermeasures to FSD disruption and overall defence are very welcome too!)

Edit: Oh, and I´d be grateful if you could refer me to a friendly & lively XBox PvP group. Or add me on XBL. If you wanna dance around a bit.

Edit_2: Here´s what I have availble in Mats&Data right now https://inara.cz/cmdr-cargo/92164/

I´m lazy, I know :( Do you see anything useful I could do with what I have and a couple surface mining sessions?
 
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d8veh

d8veh
Phasing sequence won't do enough damage to even an NPC, let alone an alpha PvP ship. Something like drag munitions might be better, but you can't have it with lasers. Their ships can normally out-run missiles, so it's not easy to get them with that either. I think you'd have a better chance with an iCourier with enhanced drives. the speed is fundamental to deal with these guys. A vulture can work, but you need to be really good with it.
 

Treptower Park

T
d8veh said:
Phasing sequence won't do enough damage to even an NPC, let alone an alpha PvP ship. Something like drag munitions might be better, but you can't have it with lasers. Their ships can normally out-run missiles, so it's not easy to get them with that either. I think you'd have a better chance with an iCourier with enhanced drives. the speed is fundamental to deal with these guys. A vulture can work, but you need to be really good with it.
Click to expand...

Yeah, thats the plan: Git gud wit it [yesnod] I might upgrade to an FDL, but thats a rather mid-term goal.

The iCourier is not an option. Tried it. Did not like it.
 
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ALGOMATIC

Banned
A
If you want to fight back and not just run you need a pvp outfitted ship. For beginner FDL will do even all gimbaled, get 3 MCs and 2 missiles/hounds while flying 4-0-2 fa on. FAS is also a good option but a bit more advanced where pip management is a must.
Anyhting else you will be destroyed in.
 

Treptower Park

T
ALGOMATIC said:
If you want to fight back and not just run you need a pvp outfitted ship. For beginner FDL will do even all gimbaled, get 3 MCs and 2 missiles/hounds while flying 4-0-2 fa on. FAS is also a good option but a bit more advanced where pip management is a must.
Anyhting else you will be destroyed in.
Click to expand...

You mean along these lines? https://eddp.co/u/8SasXNcs
Thats too expensive for me right now. I tend to avoid the grind.
Lets say I´ll stay with hit´n run for now.
 

d8veh

d8veh
I use an Imperial Eagle. They can't get anywhere near it, but on the downside, it can't do any serious damage to their ships either.
 

Martian Successor

Martian Successor
Treptower Park said:
With the help of some kind gentlemen on these very forums I had a blast flying in Open. Built my Asplorer and Python so they´ll survive alpha strike and been working on my evading skills since then. Got away from some shieldless Couriers, Monstervettes & iClippers. FSD disruption is still a problem. Cost me a couple rebuys. As did going Silent Running accidentally a couple times. Keybinding gone for now [noob]

Since I started to dislike being chased away from the HazRes in Nu Tauri last night, I had the crazy idea of trying to shoot back.
Decided to rebuild my PvE Vulture. She looks like that right now:

https://eddp.co/u/X6Xxn78r

Reason is, the rebuy is not too significant. She´s agile & packs a punch. And her name is B!tchslap [heart]
And thats exactly what I want her to do. Drop in, dance around, do some damage and beeline out :)
This is mostly for combat practice. And practice I do need. I´m a gimbal-monkey with the occasional poor FAoff attempt.
And in hairy situations I tend to lose orientation. Fixed is not an option atm.

I heard phasing sequence damages the hull even with shields up? That´d be exactly my cup of tea. How would that work?
I wont be destroying well flown midrange ships anytime soon. But I´d like to sting a little. Catch my drift?

What would you do? (Primarily weapon-wise. But countermeasures to FSD disruption and overall defence are very welcome too!)

Edit: Oh, and I´d be grateful if you could refer me to a friendly & lively XBox PvP group. Or add me on XBL. If you wanna dance around a bit.

Edit_2: Here´s what I have availble in Mats&Data right now https://inara.cz/cmdr-cargo/92164/

I´m lazy, I know :( Do you see anything useful I could do with what I have and a couple surface mining sessions?
Click to expand...
Phasing sequence bleeds some damage directly to the hull but it doesn't hit modules for example. You'll be causing them the hassle of having to repair their hull eventually but you won't be doing them a serious amount of damage at all. It's definitely a harrasser tactic, which is what you're looking for but keep in mind most opponents will have chaff and they'll have your shields down before you can really bother them as the phasing sequence effect lowers your overall damage.

Loadout-wise for the Vulture:
- Shields
I would recommend Bi-weave shields with a Thermal resistance mod to balance out the resistances and roll for a bonus to either broken recharge rate or active regen rate. The Vulture is a nimble fighter rather than a shield tanker, it's like a mini-FAS. It has a tough hull and plays well to being able to avoid fire and tank a little while your shields come back up, which essentially gives you a small rechargeable health pool.

- Armour
Reactive with a thermal resistance mod. Mod the hull reinforcements for heavy duty and you'll have good resistances across all 3 damage types.

- Defensive Utilities
Double chaff to confuse gimbals. Double point defense to guard against missiles and have more of a chance against packhounds.

You haven't set your power priorities in the coriolis build. Not sure if intended or not but just in case here is how your power priorities should be set for maximum efficiency:

ZbXmM7e.png


I've gone ahead and made 2 variants out of your original build which will make your Vulture more suited for PvP engagements.

Frag Canon Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/LrWkmqZU

One of the only weapons that work just as well in PvP when gimballed. Frags are quite the effective shield and hull killers in a world where PvPers all mod for equal damage resistances across the board. I've put the Double Shot mod on both for maximum DPS with bonus weapon effects: Drag Munitions (to mess with your opponent's manouverability. Keep in mind it doesn't affect their boosting ability) and Corrosive (to shred the hull). You could also go with dazzle shell to confuse gimbals instead of corrosive.

Advanced Plasma Accelerator Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/MrYsBMWk

The premiere Vulture build. This is one of the most effective and powerful Vulture weapon builds in PvP and very good at killing Big ships. The APAs both have the efficient mod and Target Lock Breaker. If you can keep your shots on target you will completely neutralise any missiles and gimballed/turreted weapons of your opponent as every hit with TLB makes them lose lock on. Opponents with fixed weapons will be largely unnaffected by losing their lock on but it still means they'll have to retarget your modules every time. It's possible to use normal Plasmas as well if you don't have APAs but it'll be less efficient at laying down a constant barrage of the target lock breaker effect.

Hope that helps you out.
 
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CptXabaras

CptXabaras
Martian Successor said:
Phasing sequence bleeds some damage directly to the hull but it doesn't hit modules for example. You'll be causing them the hassle of having to repair their hull eventually but you won't be doing them a serious amount of damage at all. It's definitely a harrasser tactic, which is what you're looking for but keep in mind most opponents will have chaff and they'll have your shields down before you can really bother them as the phasing sequence effect lowers your overall damage.

Loadout-wise for the Vulture:
- Shields
I would recommend Bi-weave shields with a Thermal resistance mod to balance out the resistances and roll for a bonus to either broken recharge rate or active regen rate. The Vulture is a nimble fighter rather than a shield tanker, it's like a mini-FAS. It has a tough hull and plays well to being able to avoid fire and tank a little while your shields come back up, which essentially gives you a small rechargeable health pool.

- Armour
Reactive with a thermal resistance mod. Mod the hull reinforcements for heavy duty and you'll have good resistances across all 3 damage types.

- Defensive Utilities
Double chaff to confuse gimbals. Double point defense to guard against missiles and have more of a chance against packhounds.

You haven't set your power priorities in the coriolis build. Not sure if intended or not but just in case here is how your power priorities should be set for maximum efficiency:

https://i.imgur.com/ZbXmM7e.png

I've gone ahead and made 2 variants out of your original build which will make your Vulture more suited for PvP engagements.

Frag Canon Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/LrWkmqZU

One of the only weapons that work just as well in PvP when gimballed. Frags are quite the effective shield and hull killers in a world where PvPers all mod for equal damage resistances across the board. I've put the Double Shot mod on both for maximum DPS with bonus weapon effects: Drag Munitions (to mess with your opponent's manouverability. Keep in mind it doesn't affect their boosting ability) and Corrosive (to shred the hull). You could also go with dazzle shell to confuse gimbals instead of corrosive.

Advanced Plasma Accelerator Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/MrYsBMWk

The premiere Vulture build. This is one of the most effective and powerful Vulture weapon builds in PvP and very good at killing Big ships. The APAs both have the efficient mod and Target Lock Breaker. If you can keep your shots on target you will completely neutralise any missiles and gimballed/turreted weapons of your opponent as every hit with TLB makes them lose lock on. Opponents with fixed weapons will be largely unnaffected by losing their lock on but it still means they'll have to retarget your modules every time. It's possible to use normal Plasmas as well if you don't have APAs but it'll be less efficient at laying down a constant barrage of the target lock breaker effect.

Hope that helps you out.
Click to expand...

Last option is what i'm sporting on my Heavy modded Vulture. Double APA are a lot of fun. On two fire groups. One fire them both, the second alternate them (primary and secondary fire buttons). I prefer the second actually, it allow for a constant stream of Plasma projectiles. Both efficient, both with TLB.
 

jasonbarron

jasonbarron
Martian Successor said:
Phasing sequence bleeds some damage directly to the hull but it doesn't hit modules for example. You'll be causing them the hassle of having to repair their hull eventually but you won't be doing them a serious amount of damage at all. It's definitely a harrasser tactic, which is what you're looking for but keep in mind most opponents will have chaff and they'll have your shields down before you can really bother them as the phasing sequence effect lowers your overall damage.

Loadout-wise for the Vulture:
- Shields
I would recommend Bi-weave shields with a Thermal resistance mod to balance out the resistances and roll for a bonus to either broken recharge rate or active regen rate. The Vulture is a nimble fighter rather than a shield tanker, it's like a mini-FAS. It has a tough hull and plays well to being able to avoid fire and tank a little while your shields come back up, which essentially gives you a small rechargeable health pool.

- Armour
Reactive with a thermal resistance mod. Mod the hull reinforcements for heavy duty and you'll have good resistances across all 3 damage types.

- Defensive Utilities
Double chaff to confuse gimbals. Double point defense to guard against missiles and have more of a chance against packhounds.

You haven't set your power priorities in the coriolis build. Not sure if intended or not but just in case here is how your power priorities should be set for maximum efficiency:

https://i.imgur.com/ZbXmM7e.png

I've gone ahead and made 2 variants out of your original build which will make your Vulture more suited for PvP engagements.

Frag Canon Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/LrWkmqZU

One of the only weapons that work just as well in PvP when gimballed. Frags are quite the effective shield and hull killers in a world where PvPers all mod for equal damage resistances across the board. I've put the Double Shot mod on both for maximum DPS with bonus weapon effects: Drag Munitions (to mess with your opponent's manouverability. Keep in mind it doesn't affect their boosting ability) and Corrosive (to shred the hull). You could also go with dazzle shell to confuse gimbals instead of corrosive.

Advanced Plasma Accelerator Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/MrYsBMWk

The premiere Vulture build. This is one of the most effective and powerful Vulture weapon builds in PvP and very good at killing Big ships. The APAs both have the efficient mod and Target Lock Breaker. If you can keep your shots on target you will completely neutralise any missiles and gimballed/turreted weapons of your opponent as every hit with TLB makes them lose lock on. Opponents with fixed weapons will be largely unnaffected by losing their lock on but it still means they'll have to retarget your modules every time. It's possible to use normal Plasmas as well if you don't have APAs but it'll be less efficient at laying down a constant barrage of the target lock breaker effect.

Hope that helps you out.
Click to expand...

CptXabaras said:
Last option is what i'm sporting on my Heavy modded Vulture. Double APA are a lot of fun. On two fire groups. One fire them both, the second alternate them (primary and secondary fire buttons). I prefer the second actually, it allow for a constant stream of Plasma projectiles. Both efficient, both with TLB.
Click to expand...

The first time I saw this particular build was when Rinzler published this vid. Basically guaranteed to make gimbal/turret reliant big three driver lose their minds:
[video=youtube;Sz15kfjzGy4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz15kfjzGy4[/video]
 

Deleted member 115407

D
Who were those gentlemen? They sound like nice fellas!

I'm glad you're enjoying yourself, OP. It's fun to git gud, huh!? :D

Man, I wish I were half as gud as I think I am ;)
 

RagingxPenguin

R
Glad you've embraced the game in its whole.

People really are missing out in my opinion. Player interaction has so much to offer. It can provide some pretty edge of the seat moments.
 

Han_Zen

Han_Zen
jasonbarron said:
The first time I saw this particular build was when Rinzler published this vid. Basically guaranteed to make gimbal/turret reliant big three driver lose their minds:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sz15kfjzGy4
Click to expand...

The video is interesting. Aside from the fact that a Vulture with PAs is a deadly combo, it shows the problem of PvP and 'big ships'.

This Corvette takes a constant stream of plasma for 4 minutes, before the player decides it's not fun anymore and logs out. I'm pretty sure this was a legal menu log. The Corvette was not in a real critical condition, so there was not reason to pull the plug illegally.

The Corvette could probably have logged out, even if the timer was a full minute. Big and some medium ships with full combat build are so strong that there is not practical way to prevent menu logging.

No timer fix can deal with this, without making the function unpractical for casual PvE players. At the same time the big ships needs to be strong, to have a role in combat at all.

I think FD are aware of this issue and have decided to move in a direction where death has less and less consequence. Devaluing the credit economy even further and having materials as the real currency, will achieve this. Only explorers full of data will have much to lose.

Is this a good solution to make PvP less of a sideshow for the devoted congregation or are there better ways?
 

ALGOMATIC

Banned
A
Its just that maneuverability is more important than raw dps. That's why med ships dominate the scene, because if you cant hit anything, your big ship dps is useless.
I guess fdev wanted to reward skill because flying evasively is much more difficult than face tanking and holding the fire button.
 

Treptower Park

T
Martian Successor said:
Phasing sequence bleeds some damage directly to the hull but it doesn't hit modules for example. You'll be causing them the hassle of having to repair their hull eventually but you won't be doing them a serious amount of damage at all. It's definitely a harrasser tactic, which is what you're looking for but keep in mind most opponents will have chaff and they'll have your shields down before you can really bother them as the phasing sequence effect lowers your overall damage.

Loadout-wise for the Vulture:
- Shields
I would recommend Bi-weave shields with a Thermal resistance mod to balance out the resistances and roll for a bonus to either broken recharge rate or active regen rate. The Vulture is a nimble fighter rather than a shield tanker, it's like a mini-FAS. It has a tough hull and plays well to being able to avoid fire and tank a little while your shields come back up, which essentially gives you a small rechargeable health pool.

- Armour
Reactive with a thermal resistance mod. Mod the hull reinforcements for heavy duty and you'll have good resistances across all 3 damage types.

- Defensive Utilities
Double chaff to confuse gimbals. Double point defense to guard against missiles and have more of a chance against packhounds.

You haven't set your power priorities in the coriolis build. Not sure if intended or not but just in case here is how your power priorities should be set for maximum efficiency:

https://i.imgur.com/ZbXmM7e.png

I've gone ahead and made 2 variants out of your original build which will make your Vulture more suited for PvP engagements.

Frag Canon Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/LrWkmqZU

One of the only weapons that work just as well in PvP when gimballed. Frags are quite the effective shield and hull killers in a world where PvPers all mod for equal damage resistances across the board. I've put the Double Shot mod on both for maximum DPS with bonus weapon effects: Drag Munitions (to mess with your opponent's manouverability. Keep in mind it doesn't affect their boosting ability) and Corrosive (to shred the hull). You could also go with dazzle shell to confuse gimbals instead of corrosive.

Advanced Plasma Accelerator Variant:
https://eddp.co/u/MrYsBMWk

The premiere Vulture build. This is one of the most effective and powerful Vulture weapon builds in PvP and very good at killing Big ships. The APAs both have the efficient mod and Target Lock Breaker. If you can keep your shots on target you will completely neutralise any missiles and gimballed/turreted weapons of your opponent as every hit with TLB makes them lose lock on. Opponents with fixed weapons will be largely unnaffected by losing their lock on but it still means they'll have to retarget your modules every time. It's possible to use normal Plasmas as well if you don't have APAs but it'll be less efficient at laying down a constant barrage of the target lock breaker effect.

Hope that helps you out.
Click to expand...

Hey cool! Thanks heaps. Thats very useful info. Never thought about using the power priorities this way. Do you have more of these sheets floating around? Found the Adle Armada´s guide to building an PvP ship. I´ll leave it here for future reference:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4_nhy1CKrnCUUpCZDZqVXRtOWc/view

Built the Fragslap from your suggestions: https://eddp.co/u/tcNec2eh

In PvE she is ridiculous fun and does exactly what her name says. Fly in, deliver the volleys, drop out, reload, recharge shields, drop back in. I even have a couple G5 rolls for the Frags in my pocket. With premium ammo synthesized this is the ultimate slap. Need to work on the rest of the built a bit and dont have too much time on my hands but I can see a silver lining.
 

Deleted member 115407

D
Treptower Park said:
Hey cool! Thanks heaps. Thats very useful info. Never thought about using the power priorities this way. Do you have more of these sheets floating around? Found the Adle Armada´s guide to building an PvP ship. I´ll leave it here for future reference:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4_nhy1CKrnCUUpCZDZqVXRtOWc/view

Built the Fragslap from your suggestions: https://eddp.co/u/tcNec2eh

In PvE she is ridiculous fun and does exactly what her name says. Fly in, deliver the volleys, drop out, reload, recharge shields, drop back in. I even have a couple G5 rolls for the Frags in my pocket. With premium ammo synthesized this is the ultimate slap. Need to work on the rest of the built a bit and dont have too much time on my hands but I can see a silver lining.
Click to expand...


Check this guy out, everybody! Now that is how you git gudder.
 

TiltControls

TiltControls
Martian Successor said:
Phasing sequence bleeds some damage directly to the hull but it doesn't hit modules for example.
Click to expand...

You can shoot out the canopy with phasing, that's it. It's actually a really good tactic for an opponent that uses fixed on a shieldtank build. Some well placed shots will pop the canopy and they'll be struggling to aim the entire fight.
 
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