Petition: Personal Land and Manufacturing in Elite: Dangerous Horizons

Thor Kline

T
As you all know, in November of 2012, David Braben and others began a Kickstarter which produced Elite: Dangerous, the second installation of the Elite saga. Today, the game stands at a crossroads. Horizons is allowing players to land on moons and planets for the first time, and alien life is being discovered. The active community is organizing voyages across the reaches of space, and searching for hypothetically solid places to build a new civilization. But what next?

Missions have added immeasurable depth to the galaxy, but what happens when you leave inhabited space? Views and discoveries are great, but we are limited today to being nomads.

We have no land. We have nothing we can call "ours" except for the ship we are currently flying and any we might have stored - in a locker not owned by us.

We propose that we stand together to show Frontier that we want something called property. We want to buy land. We want to manufacture our own ships using resources we purchase or mine. We want to build groups and rent storage. We want to build our own structures on planets, or our own star ports. We want to own things.

We want to, for example, build up a resource cache on a far away planet, construct a manufacturing module, and produce a life support system to sell to stations owned by a faction. We want to purchase manufacturing rights from Faulcon DeLacy of the Anaconda and start a company to produce Anacondas cheaply. We want manufacturing missions to produce certain modules or ships or SRVs for space stations to sell. All this and more.

Frontier is a great developer. David Braben and his team are constantly adding new things to Elite. Much if not all of what has been mentioned above is on the Frontier "to-do list."

But if you believe that Frontier should focus on this aspect of the game, to have a purpose in the game - a personal stake in the universe above all other developments, then please sign the petition. Thank you and safe flying!

https://www.change.org/p/frontier-developments-plc-personal-land-and-manufacturing-in-elite-dangerous
-CMDR Thor Kline
 

Aleksej

Aleksej
Personally, I do not want this in the game, as such I would avoid using "we" or "our", i.e. giving your opinion as the opinion of the whole community.
 
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eza

E
I think the "we" in the OP makes sense in that it's meant to be a petition.
Petitions will begin with "we the undersigned," before the demands.
Anyone who agrees will simply add their name.

Obviously, this being a forum, that won't actually happen, and instead people will spend time pulling apart the OP...

Errm, but back on topic, yes some sort of ownable stuff would be great, but either it will be permanent and indestructible, which would be rubbish (player-owned building spam all over the place), or it would be be destroyable by people in other game modes, which would also be rubbish ("why did a player I can't see just destroy my base?").

So it's something that needs more thought put into how it would actually work in practice, given the practical limitations which exist.
 

MaraJade

MaraJade
Oh, perhaps we could build Rollercoasters!
spacecoaster.jpg
 

Karl Marx

Karl Marx
This would seriously help immersion and add to player cooperation on a scale that isn't even imaginable in the game currently. As such: Signed.
 

Bacalao

Bacalao
Yes, I would love to be able to "stake a claim", but not for me personally, for a minor faction, the way it works now but with more automation and freedom for individuals and players to control.
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I want to buy a ship that is basically a very small outpost, but a very large ship (just a big brick of a ship), fly it out to the middle of nowhere the other side of the bubble with several dozens of NPCs and a small vessel attached, find a system and place the big ship in orbit around some gas giant with a ring system. Then as the player I mine and collect materials from planets to "feed" the station, which grows as they fabricate new modules. Occasionally to progress I may need to make the long, long trek back to the bubble to pick up something we can't make on our own. e.g. computer components, more NPCs, progenitor cells and other meds to thwart sickness and prolong lifespans as well as allow us to begin to fabricate our own technology. Eventually the station becomes self sustaining (won't collapse if I abandon it) and as a player I just augment it's progress. One day, a year or two down the road I've got a coriolis class station on the other side of the bubble and outposts in a dozen surrounding systems, thousands of NPCs that have either been born or that I've ferried in go about their lives in a new, distant, tiny bubble across the galaxy free from the empire, federation and alliance. As a player I can then shift to influencing their greater political structure to form the beginning of a new superpower, or I can just continue their expansion into other systems by developing new outposts and existing economies.
-
This would of course require immense amounts of effort from a single player, and at that progress would be slow. Larger player groups could do more, faster. All around the galaxy small pockets of humanity spring up, dozens of different governments, maybe some try to take over or eliminate other "bubbles", maybe they try to go back and influence the Sol bubble. Maybe an explorer happens upon an abandoned outpost, something some commander left and it imploded, just a husk. He can salvage parts or pick up where it was left off.
-
It is heading that direction but I do not believe players should ever be able to directly control system or station assets outside of their ships. There are more mechanics we don't have yet, like population fluctuation and automated expansion of any kind, but it will come in some form or another. As far as manufacturing shipyards and specific ships....eh, no thanks, again, this should all be influenced by the players, but not directly controlled.
 

Troa Barton

Troa Barton
Bacalao said:
Yes, I would love to be able to "stake a claim", but not for me personally, for a minor faction, the way it works now but with more automation and freedom for individuals and players to control.
-
I want to buy a ship that is basically a very small outpost, but a very large ship (just a big brick of a ship), fly it out to the middle of nowhere the other side of the bubble with several dozens of NPCs and a small vessel attached, find a system and place the big ship in orbit around some gas giant with a ring system. Then as the player I mine and collect materials from planets to "feed" the station, which grows as they fabricate new modules. Occasionally to progress I may need to make the long, long trek back to the bubble to pick up something we can't make on our own. e.g. computer components, more NPCs, progenitor cells and other meds to thwart sickness and prolong lifespans as well as allow us to begin to fabricate our own technology. Eventually the station becomes self sustaining (won't collapse if I abandon it) and as a player I just augment it's progress. One day, a year or two down the road I've got a coriolis class station on the other side of the bubble and outposts in a dozen surrounding systems, thousands of NPCs that have either been born or that I've ferried in go about their lives in a new, distant, tiny bubble across the galaxy free from the empire, federation and alliance. As a player I can then shift to influencing their greater political structure to form the beginning of a new superpower, or I can just continue their expansion into other systems by developing new outposts and existing economies.
-
This would of course require immense amounts of effort from a single player, and at that progress would be slow. Larger player groups could do more, faster. All around the galaxy small pockets of humanity spring up, dozens of different governments, maybe some try to take over or eliminate other "bubbles", maybe they try to go back and influence the Sol bubble. Maybe an explorer happens upon an abandoned outpost, something some commander left and it imploded, just a husk. He can salvage parts or pick up where it was left off.
-
It is heading that direction but I do not believe players should ever be able to directly control system or station assets outside of their ships. There are more mechanics we don't have yet, like population fluctuation and automated expansion of any kind, but it will come in some form or another. As far as manufacturing shipyards and specific ships....eh, no thanks, again, this should all be influenced by the players, but not directly controlled.
Click to expand...
If I hadn't just repped you I'd do it again here.
 

Mohrgan

Mohrgan
I stand by the concept that Commanders cannot own anything bigger than a ship, or an SRV. That's it. No bases, stations, nor campgrounds on any planets. It's just a conviction I have. Keep the foundation of E: D; "One Pilot, One Ship".
 

ratchet5000

R
Vasious said:
Karl Marx signing up to private ownership of land and the means of production?
Click to expand...
It's human nature to want just look at "communist" countries like China or Vietnam. North Korea though, is in a world of its own :D And even then you could argue nk is actually an oligarchy where everything is owned by the elites.
 
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Thor Kline

T
Bacalao said:
Yes, I would love to be able to "stake a claim", but not for me personally, for a minor faction, the way it works now but with more automation and freedom for individuals and players to control.
-
I want to buy a ship that is basically a very small outpost, but a very large ship (just a big brick of a ship), fly it out to the middle of nowhere the other side of the bubble with several dozens of NPCs and a small vessel attached, find a system and place the big ship in orbit around some gas giant with a ring system. Then as the player I mine and collect materials from planets to "feed" the station, which grows as they fabricate new modules. Occasionally to progress I may need to make the long, long trek back to the bubble to pick up something we can't make on our own. e.g. computer components, more NPCs, progenitor cells and other meds to thwart sickness and prolong lifespans as well as allow us to begin to fabricate our own technology. Eventually the station becomes self sustaining (won't collapse if I abandon it) and as a player I just augment it's progress. One day, a year or two down the road I've got a coriolis class station on the other side of the bubble and outposts in a dozen surrounding systems, thousands of NPCs that have either been born or that I've ferried in go about their lives in a new, distant, tiny bubble across the galaxy free from the empire, federation and alliance. As a player I can then shift to influencing their greater political structure to form the beginning of a new superpower, or I can just continue their expansion into other systems by developing new outposts and existing economies.
-
This would of course require immense amounts of effort from a single player, and at that progress would be slow. Larger player groups could do more, faster. All around the galaxy small pockets of humanity spring up, dozens of different governments, maybe some try to take over or eliminate other "bubbles", maybe they try to go back and influence the Sol bubble. Maybe an explorer happens upon an abandoned outpost, something some commander left and it imploded, just a husk. He can salvage parts or pick up where it was left off.
-
It is heading that direction but I do not believe players should ever be able to directly control system or station assets outside of their ships. There are more mechanics we don't have yet, like population fluctuation and automated expansion of any kind, but it will come in some form or another. As far as manufacturing shipyards and specific ships....eh, no thanks, again, this should all be influenced by the players, but not directly controlled.
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I was thinking of. My original post was vague on purpose, but I do believe that claiming space as part of a minor faction should be implemented and become a major part of the game.

On another note, I think players should be able to personally be able to build in certain non-essential parts of the universe on such things as minor moons - with a permit purchased on a monthly basis from the controlling major and or minor faction. Every month before the time expires, the player would have to renew. If a player was inactive for longer than a month, their property would be forfeited and can be taken by another CMDR as illegal salvage or illegal goods. Any land that is owned by a player is automatically protected to a certain degree - no one can completely destroy their settlement. However, some things can be salvaged by raids much like the bases we currently have.

For example, a player may set up a personal mining station. The whole mining station, if the "rent" is payed, would not be able to be damaged, but certain mining shafts and structures can be destroyed and their loot taken. Of course, these structures would be highly automated. It would self heal, and resources would be stored in the reserves of the station. Some may have landing pads and have typical "spaceport services" for ships, all this would be purchased separately and added on.

If the "rent" ceased to be paid, a bounty would be placed on your head inversely proportion to the time the structure has been left vacant if you chose to destroy it or claim the land containing it as your own.

This whole idea allows for minor factions to build cities and colonies for mining or planetary control, and for players far out of human civilization to have waypoints, storage, and acquire much needed resources.
 

Thor Kline

T
eza said:
I think the "we" in the OP makes sense in that it's meant to be a petition.
Petitions will begin with "we the undersigned," before the demands.
Anyone who agrees will simply add their name.

Obviously, this being a forum, that won't actually happen, and instead people will spend time pulling apart the OP...

Errm, but back on topic, yes some sort of ownable stuff would be great, but either it will be permanent and indestructible, which would be rubbish (player-owned building spam all over the place), or it would be be destroyable by people in other game modes, which would also be rubbish ("why did a player I can't see just destroy my base?").

So it's something that needs more thought put into how it would actually work in practice, given the practical limitations which exist.
Click to expand...

Yes, we as in I consider myself not alone in this conviction, and for such a petition it is appropriate. Thank you.

As for as your comment on destructible / not destructible - consider the existing bases and structures that litter the worlds and moons. They are destructible, but yet not. That is what I was thinking of. There are currently smaller structures such as mining facilities on planets. Certain modules of the facility can be destroyed to gain loot or to achieve a mission, but not its entirety. I am thinking of user owned farms, mines, hangars where they can keep all their ships, guarded by drones and defense turrets, walls, and the like. Buildings that can be added on to, built module by module. And as I mentioned in another comment, the land itself would be a very small portion (maybe 1km radius) of a moon or planet, and a hefty monthly fee paid to the controlling faction. Thus the entire galaxy would not get littered with these structures, they can be removed in the case of inactive players, and only certain locations that are not very well traveled would qualify for this.
 

CMDR Crumpeteer

CMDR Crumpeteer
eza said:
Errm, but back on topic, yes some sort of ownable stuff would be great, but either it will be permanent and indestructible, which would be rubbish (player-owned building spam all over the place), or it would be be destroyable by people in other game modes, which would also be rubbish ("why did a player I can't see just destroy my base?").

So it's something that needs more thought put into how it would actually work in practice, given the practical limitations which exist.
Click to expand...

This is why I would go with simply allowing players to rent/purchase existing property to use as personal space, rather than building wherever they want. I'd really like to own a room on a space station, and it would be cool if some missions required you to contact individuals in person at someone else's residence.
 
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