Powerplay Pirates in Powerplay

[glojo]

Here we go with yet another thread on the boring topic of pirates within the Powerplay part of this excellent game, BUT……

I take my hat off to the skilful pirates that only play in OPEN…

My thoughts are that Powerplay should only ever be played in open play and we should all be proud of what we do and how we play when in open as any mistake can be fatal.

Pirates in real life would NEVER take on a much stronger force, they indeed might hunt down their prey and deal with it before any type of defensive force can be bought to bear.

In this game I have met a small number of pirates in this open play that have very skilfully evaded confrontation, and if I have been lucky enough to interdict them… they have avoided battle… well done to them and I salute the skills they have in evading a possible much stronger force.

Sadly however the huge significant number of these so called pirates are nothing but cowards and bullies…. I say this after due consideration and engaging brain before typing fingers. I have seen multiple so called pirates simply appearing right under my nose in resource sites, conflict zones, resistance pockets etc. etc. These pirates have appeared whilst there were players outside these locations and clearly the pirates are using ‘Solo’ or ‘Private’ to travel from ‘A’ to ‘B’ and then very so called ‘bravely’ coming out into open play…. Cowards that are afraid to play in open. If these brave souls want to hide in these private groups then stay there, stay in these nursery groups and play your own game, but if you want to play with the big boys then should you play with the big boys and play in open? How sad that I am the soul human player in the headquarters system of these pirate factions, I stay there for a few hours hoping to confront these pirates but it is usually a complete waste of time....

Instead of the skull and cross bones, should the pirate flag be based on the lines of a Kentucky fried chicken flag?

I am not suggesting you take on impossible odds, I am however suggesting you talk to some of the highly skilled players that are pirates and they play a very skilful game that brings fun, excitement and a challenge to powerplay.

To the ‘BMW’ pirate we met last night……. Well played sir and I look forward to our next encounter.

To the so called pirates that skulk away in private and solo…… chat with your partners and learn how to master the dark arts employed by the experts.

 

[hermattila]

U should look around expansion system or we r at undermining as well in HQ don't see much player as they just deliver marked slaves and going to back to the control system to the next round....it's just all about the right time in the right system...also merit grinders play solo for every PP NOT JUST PIRATES....

 

[glojo]

Thank you very much for the constructive reply and the group of players I have the privilege of being with all play in open no matter what we are doing, be that undermining, or even trading (we protect our traders)...

If we undermine any faction, we do this in open as we are damaging a system belonging to an enemy and to do that in solo where that faction cannot defend or do anything about that undermining is to me.... The act of a coward and sadly it highlights my point.

We should all play in open and if we undermine our enemy, then we should be proud of what we do and not hide where we cannot be attacked. Hitting, or undermining someone with their hands tied behind their back (in solo or private) takes no skill and is no type of challenge.

I just wish Frontier got their act together and made Powerplay a decent side story to this game and make it only playable in Open.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I just wish Frontier got their act together and made Powerplay a decent side story to this game and make it only playable in Open.

Frontier designed and implemented Powerplay (and Community Goals before that) to be played by all players, in all modes and now all platforms. We all experience and affect the same shared galaxy state after all.

 

[fergal]

Here we go with yet another thread on the boring topic of pirates within the Powerplay part of this excellent game, BUT……

Power Play has nothing to do with piracy.
If you are getting pirated by players that's just part of Elite Dangerous.

I'd check out the community goals to look for pirates.


You should post in the solo vs open thread, I think they are on their third one, after filling 2 threads.

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

Frontier designed and implemented Powerplay (and Community Goals before that) to be played by all players, in all modes and now all platforms. We all experience and affect the same shared galaxy state after all.

There in lies the rub.

We don't share the same galaxy, even though we share the same galaxy state. Anyone can create their own temporary Galaxy and actions in that bubble effect the greater Galaxy.

Case in point: a Faction cannot defend/prevent a system from being undermined because the opposition can always go to Solo or Private and avoid being stopped by loyal forces as they try to undermine the system. A Faction cannot prevent the fortification of a system by blockading it and preventing fortification goods from being delivered, or forcing the fortifying Faction to obtain and sustain Space Superiority in the system (and probably surrounding systems) to protect the freighters.

Huge missed opportunity there to increase the interactions, and give the opportunity to meet strategic goals through tactical operations.

Solo players should be able to grind merits for their ranking, but those merits should not impact the BGS.

 

[SixxGunnz]

You forget PC and Consoles share the same universe but can not instance in the same game. I play in a group of 80+ that PP heavily all in open on the consoles but rarely see any opposition.

 

[glojo]

What a nice debate with folks offering opposing opinions and no one being rude.... Thank you.

I accept that Frontier wants Powerplay to be accessible to all players but has this arrangement punished those that play in 'open'?

Those that play with immunity from attack can do what they want, where they want, when they want with absolutely zero risk of being attacked by a human player.

If ANYONE believes an NPC is as good as the human, they are sadly mistaken. Those players that only fly, or only commute in private are missing a significant part of the game.

If Frontier want Powerplay open to all, then howabout we choose whether we want to play in private and if so there would be a seven day cooling off period if I opt to go into open play? During this seven day peroid I can fly with my friends, partake in operations with my friends in open but for those seven days, my account regarding merit growth is frozen. I CANNOT earn or generate merits, likewise if I opt to move from open into private, the same would apply. For seven days I could not generate ANY merit points and once that cool down period is over, I can then play normally and NOTHING I did during those seven days would effect fortifying, undermining or expansion.

The player that plays on the console....
I believe your actions effect the universe throughout the game including both the Mac and PC and yes, I also believe you are correct in so far as we cannot interact!! Is Frontier asking too much?

Going off at a tangent
Since 1.3 I am frequently being attacked by ships that never turn red on my radar screen and having four or five sidewinders doing this was okay but now I sometimes have all types of ships doing this and that is NOT funny... The silly 10 credit repair we all see and cannot get rid of...... Should Frontier fix the game before adding even more things that will without a doubt have things in them that will add to the list?

Make Powerplay a joy to play and iron out all the major issues BEFORE introducing Horizons (Will that happen, or will the money generating Horizons be introduced and all the ensuing problems it will most definitely bring)

C'mon you Pirates, get your backsides into open and show us those amazing skills that I know some of you have...... The banter we have between us is brilliant. The remarks about my inability to catch you brings a huge smile to my face.... MUCH RESPECT

 

[Robert Maynard]

We don't share the same galaxy, even though we share the same galaxy state. Anyone can create their own temporary Galaxy and actions in that bubble effect the greater Galaxy.

Each instance, regardless of game mode, would be a "temporary galaxy" in that case. Not all players can exist in one instance - therefore not all players in Open, in the same place, will necessarily be able to see each other.

I accept that Frontier wants Powerplay to be accessible to all players but has this arrangement punished those that play in 'open'?

As Powerplay has no requirement for PvP there is no direct "punishment" for players in Open. Some relevant quotes from Frontier:

Will at any time solo and private group play be separated into a different universe/database from open play? It's kind of cheap that you can be safe from many things in solo, like player blockades and so on, and still affect the same universe.

No.

Michael

Thanks for that clarity Michael.

Are you in a position to confirm that group switching between the three game modes will remain as a feature of the game?

We're not planning on changing that.

Michael

Hi Micheal

I know you said that solo/group and open will always use the same universe, can you also say that there will be no specific perks in playing in one mode over another? i.e bigger profit from trading in open or bigger bounties?

None are planned at the moment.

Michael

According to some members of the community, Solo players should have a limited or no effect on Powerplay - or, alternatively, playing in Open should offer Powerplay bonuses. Is this something you are considering?

No. For us Solo, Groups and Open are all valid and equal ways to play the game.

Is there planned to be any defense against the possibility that player created minor factions could be destroyed with no possible recourse through Private Groups or Solo play?

From the initial inception of the game we have considered all play modes are equally valid choices. While we are aware that some players disagree, this hasn't changed for us.

Michael

 

[glojo]

Hi Robert,
thank you so much for attempting to clarify the stance of Frontier, an unexpected but MUCH appreciated gesture.

No. For us Solo, Groups and Open are all valid and equal ways to play the game

This is something I definitely do NOT understand.

The amount of influence any minor power can generate per 24hrs is I believe capped at just 3%?? I accept this figure might be inaccurate but only by a small degree.

If a minor power wants to increase its influence it can mount patrols and prevent any other faction from entering its system to undermine it.... That to me is part and parcel of the game. we increase our influence whilst at the same time preventing 'pirates'
from undermining... Good strategy and in keeping with Powerplay. I am saying pirates in an attempt to keep on topic but we all accept anyone can undermine any faction.

Because the powerplay is capped at such a low percentage it is extremely easy to nulify and increase in influence but if we have a full time patrol of ships dedicated to stop any acts of what I will term sabotage, then the minor power can expand BUT.......

For us Solo, Groups and Open are all valid and equal ways to play the game

Those playing in any type of private group can defeat any attempt at growth by simply undermining whilst in a private group?????

How many players have given up on Powerplay? I know my old group have, and I know of multiple other groups who have all also given up.

What is the point of Powerplay? what is the point of building a beautiful sandcastle and then have an undetectable boot simply flatten it in front of your eyes?

This is Frontier's game, they make the rules, we have to play to those rules.

I totally 100% accept that pvp does not have to be a part of Powerplay.

From the initial inception of the game we have considered all play modes are equally valid choices. While we are aware that some players disagree, this hasn't changed for us.

Michael

I accept that and fully understand what is said BUT... In my own personal opinion if someone wants to undermine a system they should accept they are trying to undo the hard work done by others and there should be a means to defend that hard work. If we do not want pvp then do not enter the kitchen, If you do enter the kitchen then accept what you are doing has consequences. that reply comes across as heartless and translates as 'who cares how hard you work, it can be sabotaged and there is NOTHING you can do about it??????

I say that because no one but no one has ANY idea who does the undermining....

Well done Frontier for explaining that and I guess it highlights what a waste of time powerplay really is?

 

[fergal]

What you are missing glojo, is that PvP is something that can happen in Elite Dangerous, but none of the game is centered around it, and no part of the game requires it.

If a system is getting undermined, you counteract this by fortifying.

If a minor factions influence is rising, you counteract this by doing mission for a competing minor faction to raise their own influence.

There is no reward for PvP other than the experience itself.

 

[glojo]

What you are missing glojo, is that PvP is something that can happen in Elite Dangerous, but none of the game is centered around it, and no part of the game requires it.

If a system is getting undermined, you counteract this by fortifying.

If a minor factions influence is rising, you counteract this by doing mission for a competing minor faction to raise their own influence.

There is no reward for PvP other than the experience itself.

Hopefully I have NEVER, ever suggested PVP is in anyway connected to the rise and fall regarding influence in Powerplay??

I fear however that you might be overlooking the very relevant fact..... Influence in powerplay is capped at a very small percentage per day. I stand to be corrected when I say it is less than 3%

If we do 3% of work, it is very easy for this to be undermined by players only playing in solo, or private. In plain English, a large alliance of perhaps 100 players, all working their socks off, both increasing their influence and also blockading it from intruders... Is COMPLETELY POWERLESS to prevent a small number of players only playing in private from undermining all that work.

I find that wrong and I accept others disagree and to those that disagree..... what do you suggest we do to increase our influence please?

Getting back on topic..

This morning I interdicted a pirate flying a vulture, we were having a great fight until another pirate turn up in a ferdelance... My shields were low, the vultures shields were gone but sadly the ferdelance got behind me and within seconds...poof... I was dead!

No problems, jump into a new ship and carry on the fight.

Within minutes the Ferdelance was located and I had revenge in my mind.

The ship was interdicted, shields blasted away and guess what!!! Yup yet another combat logger. These folks scream like billy-o when folks combat log with them but time and time again we experience this. Yes they commute in private and yes I dislike that but this is one issue, powerplay is another.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Hopefully I have NEVER, ever suggested PVP is in anyway connected to the rise and fall regarding influence in Powerplay??

You seem to here:

My thoughts are that Powerplay should only ever be played in open play and we should all be proud of what we do and how we play when in open as any mistake can be fatal.

Why else suggest that Powerplay should be Open play only?

 

[badtrip]

What a nice debate with folks offering opposing opinions and no one being rude.... Thank you.

I accept that Frontier wants Powerplay to be accessible to all players but has this arrangement punished those that play in 'open'?

Those that play with immunity from attack can do what they want, where they want, when they want with absolutely zero risk of being attacked by a human player.

If ANYONE believes an NPC is as good as the human, they are sadly mistaken. Those players that only fly, or only commute in private are missing a significant part of the game.

If Frontier want Powerplay open to all, then howabout we choose whether we want to play in private and if so there would be a seven day cooling off period if I opt to go into open play? During this seven day peroid I can fly with my friends, partake in operations with my friends in open but for those seven days, my account regarding merit growth is frozen. I CANNOT earn or generate merits, likewise if I opt to move from open into private, the same would apply. For seven days I could not generate ANY merit points and once that cool down period is over, I can then play normally and NOTHING I did during those seven days would effect fortifying, undermining or expansion.

The player that plays on the console....
I believe your actions effect the universe throughout the game including both the Mac and PC and yes, I also believe you are correct in so far as we cannot interact!! Is Frontier asking too much?

Going off at a tangent
Since 1.3 I am frequently being attacked by ships that never turn red on my radar screen and having four or five sidewinders doing this was okay but now I sometimes have all types of ships doing this and that is NOT funny... The silly 10 credit repair we all see and cannot get rid of...... Should Frontier fix the game before adding even more things that will without a doubt have things in them that will add to the list?

Make Powerplay a joy to play and iron out all the major issues BEFORE introducing Horizons (Will that happen, or will the money generating Horizons be introduced and all the ensuing problems it will most definitely bring)

C'mon you Pirates, get your backsides into open and show us those amazing skills that I know some of you have...... The banter we have between us is brilliant. The remarks about my inability to catch you brings a huge smile to my face.... MUCH RESPECT

OK you are right, on the other hand you are wrong!

I wont count myself as a pvp'er.
I dont like to get in interaction against human players because i suck at it.
But sometimes i do.
In pp no undermining cmdr should get hostile territory on his own!
That would be foolish. They all should go in wings interacting each other.
And the opposing side always does the same.

Man do you really think that under that circumstances, the intredictions and the evasions that happen there... leave something there from powerplay??
This Friday i played hide and seek for approximately 4 hour with just 500 merits.. and at last got killed!

And by the way, Thursday morning, when the cycle was done, i did the first ever fortifying in my faction and undermined a bit.
How come does a power have %100 fortified star systems on Thursday morning?
Is that fair?

I believe that if he system do this fortifying by itrs own with NPC's which noones ever sees, then the players in solo and privates have the right to do so.
Noone has to be an elite expert pvp'er and one has to play that hide and seek game!
In my opinion, the adrenalin the excitement was perfect.
At the end of the day you may only return with 200 merits. (for 5 hours or so)
would you guys have that patience??

And by the way, there might be undermining ppl who are not intrested to get in combat with human players, those who like to be in interaction with thier wings!
I believe this game is so much complicated and getting credits is not easy.
People should respect each other and should not attack each other who are not intrestedin pvp just because they are pledged to the other powers...

 

[badtrip]

Hopefully I have NEVER, ever suggested PVP is in anyway connected to the rise and fall regarding influence in Powerplay??

I fear however that you might be overlooking the very relevant fact..... Influence in powerplay is capped at a very small percentage per day. I stand to be corrected when I say it is less than 3%

If we do 3% of work, it is very easy for this to be undermined by players only playing in solo, or private. In plain English, a large alliance of perhaps 100 players, all working their socks off, both increasing their influence and also blockading it from intruders... Is COMPLETELY POWERLESS to prevent a small number of players only playing in private from undermining all that work.

I find that wrong and I accept others disagree and to those that disagree..... what do you suggest we do to increase our influence please?

Getting back on topic..

This morning I interdicted a pirate flying a vulture, we were having a great fight until another pirate turn up in a ferdelance... My shields were low, the vultures shields were gone but sadly the ferdelance got behind me and within seconds...poof... I was dead!

No problems, jump into a new ship and carry on the fight.

Within minutes the Ferdelance was located and I had revenge in my mind.

The ship was interdicted, shields blasted away and guess what!!! Yup yet another combat logger. These folks scream like billy-o when folks combat log with them but time and time again we experience this. Yes they commute in private and yes I dislike that but this is one issue, powerplay is another.

You know i think about this situation?

If a person is attacked from behind (even in sc) and has no intention to pvp'ing ...

combat logging should be acceptable!!
Bu if i drop willingly and start a fight, if i participate it then it shouldn't happen!

Unfortunately most of the Fer De Lance's that i have seen are attacking from behind. even in a RES site i have seen one of them attack to a cmdr pledged the same power just for his 14k credits.
Thats the reason whenever i see the FDL i keep looking my sensors..

Note: You might think im a combat logger, you're so wrong! Yesterday i was killed on Haz RES site.. by a pirate??? pledged my same power....

 

[Antoniius]

You could prevent some of these issue just granting negative merits when doing something "against" your Power, like killing an allied. Anyway fixing PP isnt easy at all, it is o flawed from the roots, that it requires a very hard work.

 

[badtrip]

You could prevent some of these issue just granting negative merits when doing something "against" your Power, like killing an allied. Anyway fixing PP isnt easy at all, it is o flawed from the roots, that it requires a very hard work.

How can you even tell the software which action is willingly or done unpurposely?
Or when you should get those negative merits?

 

[glojo]

Lots of constructive observations and I 100% agree with the player that believes Powerplay is broken.

Folks query how a system can be fortified in a day??

If we look at what is required to fortify a system, the answer is simple. Some of these locations only need 2k of merits and if twenty players work together they only need 100 merits each to do that. If they are rank 5 then they get 50 free points every 30 minutes but undermining generates LOADS of points.. 3 players in a wing... Interdict just three wings of three ships is that 810 points? 30 points per ship times three players equal ninety time three ships in the wing equals 270 points per wing time three

Team work is the answer and to the player ho states it is exhilarating to play in open.... I totally agree and I also totally agree that we should play in whatever mode we want,but NOT interact... No one has come up with anything close to a sensible reason as to why it's a good idea to allow this... Frontier simply say these are the rules and that's the way it will be played.. We can only have a maximum of 3% influence which can EASILY be countered when players are unreachable..

Enough rambling for tonight

 

[Deleted member 102790]

Deleted..

 

[Robert Maynard]

.... I also totally agree that we should play in whatever mode we want,but NOT interact... No one has come up with anything close to a sensible reason as to why it's a good idea to allow this... Frontier simply say these are the rules and that's the way it will be played..

The single shared galaxy state - experienced and affected by all players in all game play modes - has been a part of the stated game design for over three years now. This has now been expanded to include other platforms - the first of these is the Xbox One. PC/Mac players will not encounter Xbox One players in-game. Therefore, regardless of game mode, PC/Mac players will not be able to directly oppose Xbox One players (and players on any subsequent platforms that can't cross-play).