With such vast areas near the bubble permit locked, can we please have a filter?
If there is a filter somewhere, where is it?
If there is a filter somewhere, where is it?
Please Add Permit Locked Filter
- Thread starter Greasetrap42
- Start date
- Generally filters on the left, actions on the right.
- Mouse hover shows pop-up description.
- It is cryptic at first. I admit my screen shot looks like vomit. Not too bad when you get used to it.
- Some of the icons are deactivated because I selected a permit locked system. Can't plot a route to it, etc.
- My suggestion is to add the filter to the existing security filters.
Frontier have made quite a few updates to the galaxy map over the years and as long as the game is continued to be developed I'd be sure they're not 100% done with it yet. I'm not saying that they may have their reasons to not do it but I also think that it also entirely possible that it's just not been a high enough priority in the queue of things to incorporate up till this point.
"400 billion stars to visit - except all the ones you can't".
That may be the case, however they had added and changed the filters multiple times while the this request has sat there, for instance adding the Thargoid areas to the filters, it would be relatively simple to also add the restricted areas to the filters, unless there was some underlying reason not to.
The answer may be this, that adding the restricted areas to the filters changes the way they could use them in the future. For instance to find out if a restricted area has been changed in some way to allow access would simply be a matter of checking the filters and seeing what's changed, that would remove any process of discovery through in game events and clues and ongoing story line events. For instance say the devs decided to open up a Thargoid world or number of them on the edge of the Col 70 sector for ground combat, effectively letting players take the combat home to the Thargoids, and placed hints of this in the in game events of the Thargoid war so that players can find out about it organically. With a filter players would simply check the filters, find out a previously locked area has been opened, and all rush there regardless of any clues, hints or paths supplied to players in game.
This has happened in the past when players have short circuited what may have been interesting story lines by using other methods to find things that would otherwise not be easily found. For instance long forgotten maybe now or never known by many new players, but we who were there can't forget the discovery of Jaques Station in a manner that probably wasn't meant to happen, by a player accidentally stumbling across a human civilisation marker near the core. That wasn't meant to happen, the first players who arrived there, myself among them, found the station didn't even have the correct name when we first arrived, just some generic marker, the entire thing wasn't ready for players and there was most likely a complex story line all set up for us to follow.
There was also the accidental hint the devs gave about the location of the first Guardian ruins discovered in the galaxy that probably also short circuited a story line. So I suspect the devs don't want that to happen again if they can help it and don't want a permit locked area say on the other side to the galaxy suddenly pop us as no longer permit locked when there is a long and involved story line all ready to guide players there.
This is all speculation of course, but the devs have added and changed the filters a number of times over the years, and at any of those they could have easily added a permit locked filter, but they haven't, so there must be some reason other than just priority, if we haven't got it by now we probably aren't ever getting it.
I think you explain it very well as to why Frontier would decide not to add a permit filter to the map. It would make it too easy to trawl the galaxy map toggling it on and off to look for changes visually that would otherwise require star by star examination, though even so, it would still be a pretty insane task to attempt, but on the doable side of insane lol. I do recall the whole Jacques station thing, though I was likely still pottering about in my T-6 trying to save up for a Python.
People are pretty smart, I wouldn't rule out some players with a bit of knowledge setting up some automatic system that would make it quite easy to check whenever they wanted.
you will never get routed through a permit locked system even with no filter.
... what you actually want is better routing so it doesn't give up in a tight area. Maybe make the options plotting options 'Economy / Fast / Training Wheels'
... what you actually want is better routing so it doesn't give up in a tight area. Maybe make the options plotting options 'Economy / Fast / Training Wheels'
If they want to remove a permit lock they could just hand players the permit after doing some action instead of stealth-removing it and waiting for people to discover it randomly in a roundabout way.
Even having a filter to show systems with permits you don't have on the galaxy map would help players route around the Col 70 permit bubble manually. I think it is actually a major hassle and the occasional story event that requires routing past it usually frustrates many newer players.
That's not how permit locked systems work out in the black, that's not what they are there for. Sure that's how they work in the bubble, but if you are starting a storyline regarding some permit locked systems the other side of the bubble, you don't get given permits for those because they don't have access conditions, they are just locked away from players, unlike the bubble systems like Sol and Shinrarta which have access conditions. But they don't give players permits for what may be thousands of systems anyway, can you imagine how useful that would be in your ship list of obtained permits. And besides, that would just negate any storyline the devs are trying to run, players see mysterious permit access licences suddenly pop up what are they going to do? Yes, race there as fast as they can.
You do know there are locked systems the other side of the core right? 40kly+ away from the bubble.
This was the case with the odyssey alpha permit / kingfisher recently I guess, but the permit list doesn't have to show all the individual systems in a permit locked area - I don't think the Pilots Fed permit works that way for example.
It's not worth sacrificing usability that affects players participating in current or recent by Elite standards storyline POI's for some hypothetical chance that a permit locked area could be slightly more stealthily unlocked. Especially when it's extremely unlikely we'll get any new content drop large enough to fill them.
While I agree that such a filter for the whole galaxy would give too much away in terms of story and general mystique, how about this: a filter for permit locked systems that have access conditions, only within the bubble. For example, after coming back from an exploration trip, it would be nice to see where to sell millions of exploration credits to get allied with a faction that issues a permit for a specific system.
To be more clear to those reading this thread, there are various permit locked systems throughout the ED galaxy.
- Some are single systems permit locked for ingame gameplay political purposes. Cmdrs can unlock these.
- Some are regions of space, blocked from cmdrs for unknown reasons for many many years. (since the game began?)
- Some are regions of space, blocked recently presumably for game/story development puposes.
- Permit blocked systems are not a secret on the gal map. A cmdr does not need to travel to them to reveal them. Simply click on a system.
- There is a vast permit locked region of space significantly larger than the bubble right beside the bubble in a highly trafficked location. This blocks the approach to the bubble from that entire direction.
Its not tough to bookmark and monitor permit blocked systems. A cmdr does not need to travel to them... ever. Simply click on a system in the gal map. Currently if someone wants to "monitor" these systems to see if some have become "opened up for new story" they can easily do so. If someone wants to make this a hobby its not difficult. The lack of a filter is not much of a hindrance.
As stated above, permit locked systems are not a secret. They are just a nuisance for cmdrs that would rather avoid them.
I have never been to Hyponia (33,000 Ly from Sol) but I can easily verify it is still permit locked without leaving the bubble.
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Permit locks are a lazy mechanic to start with. A "restricted" system should just be marked as such, with warnings that you take your risk going there. In the bubble, security should kick you out, you should be frozen out of services. But that would require a working security system and Frontier have been resistant to that for years.
Dangerous, out of reach places should be hard to get to because of exploration mechanics...if only we had some of those.
Frontier - "We didn't think anyone would just fly to Sag*A"
Dangerous, out of reach places should be hard to get to because of exploration mechanics...if only we had some of those.
Frontier - "We didn't think anyone would just fly to Sag*A"
Permit locks are a lazy mechanic to start with. A "restricted" system should just be marked as such, with warnings that you take your risk going there. In the bubble, security should kick you out, you should be frozen out of services. But that would require a working security system and Frontier have been resistant to that for years.
The problem is it's hard to see what FDEV could replace them with out in the black that wouldn't tie them into some sort of future scenario that may not fit with what they eventually decide to do.
I mean we can compare to other MMO's, for instance LOTRO and The Angle of Mitheithel, before opeing it you could basically walk all around the edges and be blocked by rivers, unclimbable mountains and just invisible walls and you couldn't really see much in there, which of course gives them the opportunity to put towns and villages wherever they need or want, set the landscape how they want etc, but by basically leaving it all as just unknown they weren't constrained by pre-existing lore or story lines.
In the restricted areas FDEV could have just made them so dangerous anyone who entered the area was just destroyed, preceded by warnings of course, but this doesn't really make it any different than locking the area, you still couldn't go there or explore etc, but now they have the pre-existing scenario they have to explain away as to why the area has suddenly become, well, not that dangerous anymore. You may suggest that's not a problem, but the number of times I have seen criticism of "handwavium" to explain something away lends me to think this would be a problem for some players.
You could of course argue that the aliens that existed there suddenly changed their mind and decided to let us in, which then constrains FDEV to an already existing lore that needs explaining, or not...hence handwavium, suddenly the aliens decided not to be hostile anymore! But by simply leaving the areas as blank FDEV are free to change whatever they intend to do with the areas any time they want without being constrained by already existing scenarios, meybe depending on how the current Thargoid storyline progresses, maybe they decide they need an entirely new race to progress the storyline etc.
I shall happily outline my full exploration game design for them if they offer me a job. Really, I can even WFH for this, no need to be in Cambridge. Ideas travel! Not that I haven't already dumped many of them here over the years. Can't be donkeyed repeating myself.
I shall happily outline my full exploration game design for them if they offer me a job. Really, I can even WFH for this, no need to be in Cambridge. Ideas travel! Not that I haven't already dumped many of them here over the years. Can't be donkeyed repeating myself.
We all have ideas, I have dumped a few here over the years, first starting with some decent procedural bio generation, but whatever they decide to do will be based on what they want to do in the end, it may be affected in minor ways by the community, but it is their baby after all!