Please change how the insurance/loan mechanic works.

TRLOS · Aug 23, 2015

I've just had an extremely unfortunate day today. I've lost 80 Million Credits within 20 minutes by having my ship constantly destroyed by AI ships.

The Scenario:
It's taken me just over 8 months to grind enough to buy the Python and put some decent modules into it and was running fine up till now. Then all of a sudden today, I come up against a wing of 3 ships who managed to take down my shield and destroy the my ship within 60 seconds. Unfortunately, I didn't have enough for insurance and a loan was taken out. I leave spaceport and drop back into the resource site and almost immediately get whaled on by an Imperial Clipper. Obviously I couldn't rebuy the ship or take another loan so its back to square 1 with the sidewinder.
What is worse: It has put me back at LHS3447 which is so far into my enemy's powerplay territory, that it would be virtually impossible to make it out and back into friendly powerplay territory alive. So what is the point ?

To be honest, I doubt I would get back into the grind until Elite Dangerous Horizons gets released.
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a whinge about coming up against OP AI ships or how I was able to get taken out so easily when I was normally able to win previous such battles. But for a game, it is extremely demoralizing to be taken so far back and have over 8 months of gameplay wiped out so quickly.

Perhaps the Devs might take this into consideration and alter the insurance/loan mechanic. Introduce a staged loan system where instead of having a 2.5m credit limit, increase it to 10m and alter the loan repayments accordingly.
For Example:
1m credit loan will mean repayments of 20% of your earnings
2m credit loan will mean repayments of 30% of your earnings
3m credit loan will mean repayments of 40% of your earnings
4m credit loan will mean repayments of 50% of your earnings
5m credit loan will mean repayments of 70% of your earnings
8m credit loan will mean repayments of 90% of your earnings
10m credit loan will mean repayments of 100% of your earnings

At least this way, it gives players who have only just recently purchased bigger ships (and don't have the insurance money) to get more than 1 chance at continuing the game if they get destroyed.
Also, if they want to keep the current loan structure the way it is, at least offer the sidewinder at the system you last landed at.... not 500ly away in your enemy's powerplay territory with a ship that doesn't stand a chance of surviving.

If the Developers want to get more people involved in the game, they need to find ways of keeping their current player based interested and active.
Like I said, because of this particular situation I doubt I would ever get back into ED until Horizons comes out. It makes me wonder how many other players have been in similar situations and have slowed their gameplay because of it.

Kigre · Aug 23, 2015

You should have done some safe delivery missions, perhaps even sold off some modules you might not need just to bank up few more insurances. Its that simple.

K4szt4N · Aug 23, 2015

Wait, what was the first rile of Elite: Dangerous?? Ahhhh now I remember - DON'T FLY SHIPS YOU CAN'T AFFORD AND ALWAYS HAVE AT LEAST 3X OF SHIP'S INSURANCE + 3X FULL CAGROHOLD OF WHAT YOU ARE CARRYING IN CASH + HAVE A BACKUP SHIP.
Was it something like that or did I missed something?

Elpapo · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
Then all of a sudden today, I come up against a wing of 3 ships who managed to take down my shield and destroy the my ship within 60 seconds.

Then, why the hell you did not ran away, eh? You thinked you might win this time? Probly yes, since you said you aint had probs with them... While you was on Loan, ONLY thing you should to do instead going into RES, is find some backyard trade route and stick to it, until you have enough for few insurances.

Back in Sidey? Serves you right. L2P.

Frontas. Dont change anything with loans, its not needed. While ago, we had only 100k loan and yet many lived with it. Now, they got 25x more of that, still few's cant handle with it? Haha.

ForeverN00b · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
I've just had an extremely unfortunate day today. I've lost 80 Million Credits within 20 minutes by having my ship constantly destroyed by AI ships.

The Scenario:
It's taken me just over 8 months to grind enough to buy the Python and put some decent modules into it and was running fine up till now. Then all of a sudden today, I come up against a wing of 3 ships who managed to take down my shield and destroy the my ship within 60 seconds. Unfortunately, I didn't have enough for insurance and a loan was taken out. I leave spaceport and drop back into the resource site and almost immediately get whaled on by an Imperial Clipper. Obviously I couldn't rebuy the ship or take another loan so its back to square 1 with the sidewinder.
What is worse: It has put me back at LHS3447 which is so far into my enemy's powerplay territory, that it would be virtually impossible to make it out and back into friendly powerplay territory alive. So what is the point ?

To be honest, I doubt I would get back into the grind until Elite Dangerous Horizons gets released.
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a whinge about coming up against OP AI ships or how I was able to get taken out so easily when I was normally able to win previous such battles. But for a game, it is extremely demoralizing to be taken so far back and have over 8 months of gameplay wiped out so quickly.

Lol you were in a Python and you got worked by an NPC Imperial Clipper!? Lolololol.

Seriously, it's hard to feel bad for you at this point.

Maybe take a break from combat and try rares trading or exploring.

Knot2clever · Aug 23, 2015

Elite Dangerous is dangerous because 98% of the time it's safe and can even be a little boring (there I said it).

But the remaining 2% it can be extremely dangerous. Bit off more than you could chew, without the funds to support your reckless play and you got creamed.

How's about you just accept your predicament because of your own stupidly.

Komotz · Aug 23, 2015

I figure it this way, if you're planning on buying a ship that's expensive then save up double the amount of the cost of the ship and use your old ship while you fit out your new one. Throwing all your money into one thing without any kind of pillow is just asking to be bankrupt, especially in a game where one wrong button press can send you boosting into the inside of a station.

CaptainKremmen · Aug 23, 2015

As a note to others reading this, it only takes 15 seconds to spool up your frameshift drive when jumping to another star system... and there is no mass disruption delay from other ships.

If you think you'll be dead in 60 seconds, that gives you 45 seconds to think about leaving, and 15 to actually leave.

Drink! · Aug 23, 2015

I lost my big ship once and learned my lesson. I did't make a post about it, I didn't ask FD to make the game easier. I made sure to have money or fly a cheaper ship.

Right now I have 773k in the bank and a T9 and Python docked. I'm currently flying a Adder (for the CG) and Courier for missions, bounties, and merit. It would be stupid for me to take my T9 or python out right now. Especially take my python to a area that not only has enemies, but the same location I just died.

Zelos1983 · Aug 23, 2015

I don't get why people fly without insurance AND THEN moan about the consequences. Especially non-beginners.
+ don't run away from a fight when they have much to loose and little/nothing to gain
+ deliberately enter a danger zone instead of playing it safe

Alex Brentnall · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
1m credit loan will mean repayments of 20% of your earnings
2m credit loan will mean repayments of 30% of your earnings
3m credit loan will mean repayments of 40% of your earnings
4m credit loan will mean repayments of 50% of your earnings
5m credit loan will mean repayments of 70% of your earnings
8m credit loan will mean repayments of 90% of your earnings
10m credit loan will mean repayments of 100% of your earnings

Thoughts on suggestion:
I thought it already worked something like this but your total loan amount is dictated by your Elite rankings?
I'd agree the system may need to be a bit more explicit in that "You die without insurance you go to a sidewinder" but I disagree that any changes need to be made to the system. I have been kicked to a sidewinder once, I have also been kicked to my backup ship once. The first time I learnt about keeping a backup ship, the second time I learnt to keep lots of spare cash. It's just I learnt that at Cobra and Clipper level respectively rather than Python.

And the popcorn thoughts on your actions spoilered below:

In any case I had a similar experience getting creamed by multiple ships (Insert wings broke CMDR's without friends line

). I sold my Clipper, bought a Cobra to get me to a station where my Asp was stored and then I went exploring. Came back 40mil credits richer and re-bought my Clipper.
Basically what im saying is that we had the same experience, it's how we each responded to it that differed. I personally went for the low risk route where even if I lost my Asp on the exploration trip I still had 50mil in cash in my pocket to re-buy or even buy a whole different ship.

It's like saying you are betting £100 every spin at roulette, you loose 2 in a row and go down to £100 left. Do you:
A) Bet that last £100
B) Bet £10
You chose high risk high rewards and unfortunately lost.

Edit: Further thoughts
8 months to Python? That's probably either a very low game-time per week or you did it all by mining. Get involved with some community goals. There's some going on right now that you can get into the top 5% (20million credit reward) with probably about 5 hours effort then another 2-3 hours over the coming monday/tuesday/wednesday to keep the top 5%. Even getting in top 60% in all 3 currently running will set you well on your way back to that Python.
The 3 currently going are quite good for smaller ships, if you can afford even a C grade Cobra you can easily get to the higher tiers in them so I'd advise to get straight on the horse and check those out.

Evil · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
I've just had an extremely unfortunate day today. I've lost 80 Million Credits within 20 minutes by having my ship constantly destroyed by AI ships.

The Scenario:
It's taken me just over 8 months to grind enough to buy the Python and put some decent modules into it and was running fine up till now. Then all of a sudden today, I come up against a wing of 3 ships who managed to take down my shield and destroy the my ship within 60 seconds. Unfortunately, I didn't have enough for insurance and a loan was taken out. I leave spaceport and drop back into the resource site and almost immediately get whaled on by an Imperial Clipper. Obviously I couldn't rebuy the ship or take another loan so its back to square 1 with the sidewinder.
What is worse: It has put me back at LHS3447 which is so far into my enemy's powerplay territory, that it would be virtually impossible to make it out and back into friendly powerplay territory alive. So what is the point ?

To be honest, I doubt I would get back into the grind until Elite Dangerous Horizons gets released.
Don't get me wrong, this isn't a whinge about coming up against OP AI ships or how I was able to get taken out so easily when I was normally able to win previous such battles. But for a game, it is extremely demoralizing to be taken so far back and have over 8 months of gameplay wiped out so quickly.

Perhaps the Devs might take this into consideration and alter the insurance/loan mechanic. Introduce a staged loan system where instead of having a 2.5m credit limit, increase it to 10m and alter the loan repayments accordingly.
For Example:
1m credit loan will mean repayments of 20% of your earnings
2m credit loan will mean repayments of 30% of your earnings
3m credit loan will mean repayments of 40% of your earnings
4m credit loan will mean repayments of 50% of your earnings
5m credit loan will mean repayments of 70% of your earnings
8m credit loan will mean repayments of 90% of your earnings
10m credit loan will mean repayments of 100% of your earnings

At least this way, it gives players who have only just recently purchased bigger ships (and don't have the insurance money) to get more than 1 chance at continuing the game if they get destroyed.
Also, if they want to keep the current loan structure the way it is, at least offer the sidewinder at the system you last landed at.... not 500ly away in your enemy's powerplay territory with a ship that doesn't stand a chance of surviving.

If the Developers want to get more people involved in the game, they need to find ways of keeping their current player based interested and active.
Like I said, because of this particular situation I doubt I would ever get back into ED until Horizons comes out. It makes me wonder how many other players have been in similar situations and have slowed their gameplay because of it.

So you knew the consequences of going out w/o insurance but you still did it, heh, egg on face much ?

metatheurgist · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
I've just had an extremely unfortunate day today. I've lost 80 Million Credits within 20 minutes by having my ship constantly destroyed by AI ships.

The Scenario:
It's taken me just over 8 months to grind enough to buy the Python and put some decent modules into it and was running fine up till now. Then all of a sudden today, I come up against a wing of 3 ships who managed to take down my shield and destroy the my ship within 60 seconds. Unfortunately, I didn't have enough for insurance and a loan was taken out.

Stopped reading right here. Nothing to see here, move along, move along.

micky1984 · Aug 23, 2015

It truly is the difference between good pilots and average pilots knowing when to disengage and fight another day

M.E.A.T · Aug 23, 2015

I agree that insurance mechanics need to be changed. You should buy insurance for each ship and pay it upfront. The current setting is too lenient.

@OP i doubt you will find anyone sympatize with your loss here. None from me neither.

Lowievisser · Aug 23, 2015

I think the isnurance need to go.

Dead should be lost stuff.

whining has get it to 600.000 loan, so keep whining and tey raise it more

Chann3l · Aug 23, 2015

I think it should go the other way and they should add interest on loans. You should always have a spare ship. The reason you start in the sidewinder at lhs3447 is because you didn't buy a second placeholder ship closer.

hanks01 · Aug 23, 2015

"It's taken me just over 8 months to grind enough to buy the Python"

and

"To be honest, I doubt I would get back into the grind until Elite Dangerous Horizons gets released."

Whilst you have my sympathy on the loss, if you think the whole game is a grind then why are you playing? Surely it's a bit forward to suggest changes on a game that you view as a grind and, I assume by extension, thus don't really enjoy?

Lunchmoney · Aug 23, 2015

TRLOS said:
Unfortunately, I didn't have enough for insurance and a loan was taken out.

I think your problems started here.

el_tel · Aug 23, 2015

The only change I'd like with insurance is to make it so you pay a premium up-front, which covers you for x amount of credits for y light years of travel. Different level of insurance give you different levels of cover, with a weighting applied depending on how many claims on previous policies you've made.

Ya'know... like REAL insurance.