Principal solution to botting problem

Botting is undefeatable in principle as the machine can and will surpass human intelligence, except two cardinal ways, that is by using another AI or empowering human with external processing to bump him on an AI's level.

For all I know, Unit01 can be my next president.

For a case of this game, I myself can automate every aspect of it, given how simplistic they are, despite being a mediocre programmer.

Any preventive measure will only stall bot creators. If you can come up with any which can principally check-mate this problem(not just delay), I would like to hear it. So far I've seen none that even I could not overcome.

Main reasons for bot affects being so severe in this game is that bot has more time to function than an average player. And as well as the fact that, with the help of the bots, one person can affect the state of things as hard as ten people do.

Thus...
the only way to principally defeat this issue is to add bots in-game.
In form of NPCs which you can provide with ships to do stuff for you. So everyone would be empowered to protect his or community's interests. From bots.

Breaking point to understanding this notion is the fact that again, the main limitation of player, again, is the time available to play.

Worthy to mention that I understand that bots can enter the new level to become a virus which attacks PP or BGS and buys new ships [and uses them to attack PP or BGS and to buy new ships]. A reasonable limit on NPC controlled ships number per account, about ten, will fix it. No less than five (kills empowerment part) but no more than twenty (I dunno). Accounts cost money. Moreover, people could be able to apply to FDev to be approved for a personal increase of the limit and exclusive functionality for voluntary game moderation purposes.

Thing is, having just mentioned voluntary moderators is sort of enough and is more productive than giving everyone 15 ships. But FDev might experience quite an excessive amount of applications for this position. I myself have interest in such position, and by all means, I would never abuse it for stupid things like arranging 50x50 pink Imperial Cutter battles for the glory of the spectacle, which I would not make a Youtube video of, with the addition of the famous "It's ok to be Imperial" military march.

On the more serious note, please refrain posting any objection which contains notions on "removing" PP or BGS. And refrain from posting replies with keywords such as "flying your own ship" and "this game is not for you" without providing any other solution to the problem in them.


This suggestion is a highly theoretical one. Exept maybe moderation part.
Game have a long way to ge before this game will be able to support such functions. Yet again, if this game will never have all of those things, it would mean that it will die earlier.

Main problem of Garrisons in WoW is not them themselves, but the fact that they were implemented in such way that it this made feel Darksouls-y, as if other players are no more than NPCs. And notions of this are already in the game, given amount of Admirals, which command nothing but their Rear.
 
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Botting is undefeatable in principle as the machine can and will surpass human intelligence, except two cardinal ways, that is by using an AI or empowering human with external processing to bump him on an AI's level.

For all I know, Unit01 can be my next president.

For a case of this game, I myself can automate every aspect of it, given how simplistic they are, despite being a mediocre programmer.

Any preventive measure will only stall bot creators. If you can come up with any which can principally check-mate this problem, I would like to hear it. So far I've seen none that even I could not overcome.

Main reasons for bot affects being so severe in this game is that bot has more time to function than an average player. And as well as the fact that, with the help of the bots, one person can affect the state of things as hard as ten people do.

Thus...
the only way to principally defeat this issue is to add bots in-game.
In form of NPCs which you can provide with ships to do stuff for you. So everyone would be empowered to protect his or community's interests. From bots.

Breaking point to understanding this notion is the fact that again, the main limitation of player, again, is the time available to play.

Worthy to mention that I understand that bots can enter the new level to become a virus which attacks PP or BGS and buys new ships [and uses them to attack PP or BGS and to buy new ships]. A reasonable limit on NPC controlled ships number per account, about ten, will fix it. No less than five (kills empowerment part) but no more than twenty (I dunno). Accounts cost money. Moreover, people could be able to apply to FDev for a personal increase of the limit and exclusive functionality for voluntary game moderation purposes.

Thing is, having just mentioned voluntary moderators is sort of enough and is more productive than giving everyone 15 ships. But FDev might experience quite an excessive amount of applications for this position. I myself have interest in such position, and by all means, I would never abuse it for stupid things like arranging 50x50 pink Imperial Cutter battles for the glory of the spectacle, which I would not make a Youtube video of, with the addition of the famous "It's ok to be Imperial" military march.

On the more serious note, please refrain posting any objection which contains notions on "removing" PP or BGS. And refrain from posting replies with keywords such as "flying your own ship" and "this game is not for you" without providing any other solution to the problem in them.

There are many players with alt accounts who would happily pay to automate them.
 
Botting is undefeatable in principle as the machine can and will surpass human intelligence, except two cardinal ways, that is by using another AI or empowering human with external processing to bump him on an AI's level.

For all I know, Unit01 can be my next president.

For a case of this game, I myself can automate every aspect of it, given how simplistic they are, despite being a mediocre programmer.

Any preventive measure will only stall bot creators. If you can come up with any which can principally check-mate this problem(not just delay), I would like to hear it. So far I've seen none that even I could not overcome.

Main reasons for bot affects being so severe in this game is that bot has more time to function than an average player. And as well as the fact that, with the help of the bots, one person can affect the state of things as hard as ten people do.

Thus...
the only way to principally defeat this issue is to add bots in-game.
In form of NPCs which you can provide with ships to do stuff for you. So everyone would be empowered to protect his or community's interests. From bots.

Breaking point to understanding this notion is the fact that again, the main limitation of player, again, is the time available to play.

Worthy to mention that I understand that bots can enter the new level to become a virus which attacks PP or BGS and buys new ships [and uses them to attack PP or BGS and to buy new ships]. A reasonable limit on NPC controlled ships number per account, about ten, will fix it. No less than five (kills empowerment part) but no more than twenty (I dunno). Accounts cost money. Moreover, people could be able to apply to FDev to be approved for a personal increase of the limit and exclusive functionality for voluntary game moderation purposes.

Thing is, having just mentioned voluntary moderators is sort of enough and is more productive than giving everyone 15 ships. But FDev might experience quite an excessive amount of applications for this position. I myself have interest in such position, and by all means, I would never abuse it for stupid things like arranging 50x50 pink Imperial Cutter battles for the glory of the spectacle, which I would not make a Youtube video of, with the addition of the famous "It's ok to be Imperial" military march.

On the more serious note, please refrain posting any objection which contains notions on "removing" PP or BGS. And refrain from posting replies with keywords such as "flying your own ship" and "this game is not for you" without providing any other solution to the problem in them.

Your OTHER post in which you requested the game play itself for you directed me here :)
So here's my 2 cents:

1. You watch way too much sci-fi (possibly on netflix, while you're circling around stars trying to get your Corvette to maia)

2. You're not a 'mediocre programmer', but rather just a teen / young adult who maybe wrote some scripts or web applications at some point :)

Else you'd know that AI is not taking over our universe just yet.. and fighting bots isn't really a 'losing battle' as you claim. The moment you actually start fighting them instantly starts diminishing their head-start.
And that's pretty much the thing.. Frontier isn't really fighting them atm imo.. at least that's probably what I would've done in their place as well.

Simply because bots aren't a major issue for ED yet (and yes, that includes the Soholia incident as well). The galaxy is still big... most people never even see them.. they can only do so much.. and the effects are only felt by a small set of the playerbase (the ones who do PP or care about their factions). From a business point of view it's not worth it to devote major resources to that, until it becomes more important than say... working on their next content to accomplish their 'vision' :) And if someone buys several copies of the game to run their bots, that's all good for now, more income never hurts, right?

Don't get me wrong.. I'm not saying they don't care, they probably do and they probably get annoyed every time they hear about people using bots (I would too, if it would be my work they're making a mess of), but as long as they can 'settle' things with a couple of support tickets and temporary bans here and there, we're not really talking about a problem.

And just for the record, anti-cheat methods exist, there are even complete companies devoted to providing a ready-made anti-cheat "frame" for games and some of them actually work :) Now obviously ED is a slightly different beast as their engine is in-house and their data is all up there in the 'clouds' scattered across like 5-6 different types of database providers and tens of rented servers all over the place. But if they saw a real destructive potential from bots I'm pretty sure they would be more than capable of creating their own layer of anti-cheat, at the cost of slightly increasing the minimum specs of the game (which they might not want) and occasionally conflicting with lots of legit software (I'm looking at you T.A.R.G.E.T.) - which again would be inconvenient, but could be fine-tuned ofc. But like I said.. why bother when you can simply solve the current 'bot crisis' with a few emails here and there from customer service and a couple of bans.

As a disclaimer I'd like to add that I do not claim I know anything about what they're doing, why they're doing it or how they're doing it lol.. this is purely guesswork and I've no idea what I'm talking about :)

Cheers!

P.S. U sure you don't want something like football manager or sims instead? you really seem to want to automate everything and just 'manage' them in some fancy pay-to-win mobile game type of way... just saying..
 
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As much as I want NPC wingmen, the solution to the botting problem isn’t “You get a bot. You get a bot! Everybody gets a bot!”

The solution is for Frontier to take cheating in this game seriously. I was surprised to learn they actually do some monitoring their meta-data, but the fact that it takes a credit exploit going viral to trigger it and give them enough information to figure it out is consistent with their lackadaisical approach to cheating to date.

Also, this stinks of pay to win. Some people have more than one account, I have two myself, one of which I obtained to participate in races when my main account is far from the Bubble.
 
Your OTHER post in which you requested the game play itself for you directed me here :)
So here's my 2 cents:

1. You watch way too much sci-fi (possibly on netflix, while you're circling around stars trying to get your Corvette to maia)

2. You're not a 'mediocre programmer', but rather just a teen / young adult who maybe wrote some scripts or web applications at some point :)

Else you'd know that AI is not taking over our universe just yet.. and fighting bots isn't really a 'losing battle' as you claim. The moment you actually start fighting them instantly starts diminishing their head-start.
And that's pretty much the thing.. Frontier isn't really fighting them atm imo.. at least that's probably what I would've done in their place as well.

Simply because bots aren't a major issue for ED yet (and yes, that includes the Soholia incident as well). The galaxy is still big... most people never even see them.. they can only do so much.. and the effects are only felt by a small set of the playerbase (the ones who do PP or care about their factions). From a business point of view it's not worth it to devote major resources to that, until it becomes more important than say... working on their next content to accomplish their 'vision' :) And if someone buys several copies of the game to run their bots, that's all good for now, more income never hurts, right?

Don't get me wrong.. I'm not saying they don't care, they probably do and they probably get annoyed every time they hear about people using bots (I would too, if it would be my work they're making a mess of), but as long as they can 'settle' things with a couple of support tickets and temporary bans here and there, we're not really talking about a problem.

And just for the record, anti-cheat methods exist, there are even complete companies devoted to providing a ready-made anti-cheat "frame" for games and some of them actually work :) Now obviously ED is a slightly different beast as their engine is in-house and their data is all up there in the 'clouds' scattered across like 5-6 different types of database providers and tens of rented servers all over the place. But if they saw a real destructive potential from bots I'm pretty sure they would be more than capable of creating their own layer of anti-cheat, at the cost of slightly increasing the minimum specs of the game (which they might not want) and occasionally conflicting with lots of legit software (I'm looking at you T.A.R.G.E.T.) - which again would be inconvenient, but could be fine-tuned ofc. But like I said.. why bother when you can simply solve the current 'bot crisis' with a few emails here and there from customer service and a couple of bans.

As a disclaimer I'd like to add that I do not claim I know anything about what they're doing, why they're doing it or how they're doing it lol.. this is purely guesswork and I've no idea what I'm talking about :)

Cheers!

P.S. U sure you don't want something like football manager or sims instead? you really seem to want to automate everything and just 'manage' them in some fancy pay-to-win mobile game type of way... just saying..

Yes, I've made myself unclear. Sorry about that, was a bit too tired.

This suggestion is of a very theoretical sort. Game have a long way to go before being able to support it.
 
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As much as I want NPC wingmen, the solution to the botting problem isn’t “You get a bot. You get a bot! Everybody gets a bot!”

The solution is for Frontier to take cheating in this game seriously. I was surprised to learn they actually do some monitoring their meta-data, but the fact that it takes a credit exploit going viral to trigger it and give them enough information to figure it out is consistent with their lackadaisical approach to cheating to date.

Also, this stinks of pay to win. Some people have more than one account, I have two myself, one of which I obtained to participate in races when my main account is far from the Bubble.

Firstly, I look forward to your opinion on time-constraining AP in game.

Secondly, this suggestion have highly theorethical character. And those moderators do not have to pay anything, they would have to apply and be approved for that position, as well as report their activity.

For "everyone getting a bot" part, this game have a long way to go. And sadly, pace in which it moves to that state, makes me sad. Endgame is reached by a lot of players already. And it is not because of exploits only, I've made enough money to get a Vette with a reacitve hull while grinding rep, by doing it in a Vulture and doing some assasination missions to alleviate boredom. This took me about a week of relaxed playing. That happened before 3.0 arrived.

Main problem of Garrisons in WoW is not them themselves, but the fact that they were implemented in such way that it this made feel Darksouls-y, as if other players are no more than NPCs. And notions of this are already in the game, given amount of Admirals, which command nothing but their Rear.
 
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