Horizons PVP is Sparse, Boring, or Grief Driven - How about a Competitive 1v1 - 4v4 Mode

[Ozram]

Isn't arena with tiny little ships that can't be engineered? I'm talking about using our ships that we have engineered in open and solo play.

I'd love a testing ground where you could pic your ships, mods and builds then have at it with other players.

 

[Krieger]

Alrighty.
Now, this is naturally only my opinion, but what you described is the grinder's take on Elite and I think it's WRONG. Yes, if you make your gameplay about gaining ranks and earning money for ships, then you're right - you will reach a point where there's "Nothing else to do" for you. I think that's really sad and I totally understand why people turn to ganking or leave the game completely (which is the lesser of the two evils, imho) at that point.

Me personally? Elite is a second life for me. I do a bit of everything and there will always be another trade route to try, another ship to master, another module to engineer, another pristine ring to mine, another exploration trip to undertake. I never had to stack missions to "get somewhere", never had to look for a specific material I "needed" and get frustrated by RNG...

And when I do get a feeling that I reached most of the goals I had, I can always clear and start a new adventure.

You can say that telling you that your way (well, grinder's way, don't take it personally) is wrong and mine is right is opinionated and patronizing.
But where you play 300 hours, get bored and turn to hurting other people, because it's the "only fun you can get from the game at that point" and I played over 3500 hours and NEVER ran out of things to entertain me, then yes, I feel I have the right to say my way is better.
And I can also say that Elite isn't about PvP at all.

No offense but reading your and Pharmacist's description of your respective play styles I'm inclined to see Pharmacist's as the achiever's view of Elite (working towards a milestone and then asking: what's next?) and your playing style as the grinder's view of Elite (repeating all activities the game offers and enjoying it each time).

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Yea, however it would be nice to have that option from within the menu or maybe even the station at the CG.

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So there is no competition in a FDL vs a FDL, no competition in choosing your own weapons or playstyle, no competition in engineering a ship. Did I miss something or is this your point?

Nope, engineers blew it totally out of whack. I don't see any way to have balanced combat without people agreeing to some RoE beforehand.

 

[MarcusKross]

How about making PvP how Braben described it?

"PvP should be rare and meaningful"

No?

 

[Krieger]

How about making PvP how Braben described it?

"PvP should be rare and meaningful"

No?

Yeah, that remark by him really got my hopes up that PvP in Elite would be more than Unreal Tournament in space. But I gave up hope a long time ago.

 

[Pharmacist]

Nope, engineers blew it totally out of whack. I don't see any way to have balanced combat without people agreeing to some RoE beforehand.

I think you are pretty far off the ball. If you engineer a FDL with all beam lasers and engine focused distributor, I wouldn't call that imbalance when going up against a different FDL with multicannons and charge enhanced; I would call that engineering incompetence. Engineers didn't "blow anything out of whack" they raised the skill cap with the need to design a ship that makes sense when combined with a certain playstyle. If you don't have the capacity to engineer a ship then yes, you will likely lose vs someone who has the capacity to properly engineer. Anyways the bottom line of this Arranged PVP is to test your engineered build that hopefully you are proud of, vs someone else's engineered build to gain some insight on how effective your design is when accompanied with the playstyle that complements it.

 

[Para Handy]

Two things -

1 - go play arena

2 - What has this to do with Horizons (or don't you want your thread to disappear in D D forum)?

 

[Ozram]

I think you are pretty far off the ball. If you engineer a FDL with all beam lasers and engine focused distributor, I wouldn't call that imbalance when going up against a different FDL with multicannons and charge enhanced; I would call that engineering incompetence. Engineers didn't "blow anything out of whack" they raised the skill cap with the need to design a ship that makes sense when combined with a certain playstyle. If you don't have the capacity to engineer a ship then yes, you will likely lose vs someone who has the capacity to properly engineer. Anyways the bottom line of this Arranged PVP is to test your engineered build that hopefully you are proud of, vs someone else's engineered build to gain some insight on how effective your design is when accompanied with the playstyle that complements it.

I love doing that. I do feel FD pushish experimentation though. It'd be nice to have a "test" arena where there are no engie requirements. I enjoy nonstandard builds but it means I rarely have the patience to have a fully effective ship. I've had to compromise what I enjoy with what is possible under these constraints. Most of my combat ships are "barely passable". They are heaps of fun and will win vs low level pvp encounters but don't stand a chance against a competent pilot in a proven build.

 

[Deleted member 115407]

Alrighty.
Now, this is naturally only my opinion, but what you described is the grinder's take on Elite and I think it's WRONG. Yes, if you make your gameplay about gaining ranks and earning money for ships, then you're right - you will reach a point where there's "Nothing else to do" for you. I think that's really sad and I totally understand why people turn to ganking or leave the game completely (which is the lesser of the two evils, imho) at that point.

Me personally? Elite is a second life for me. I do a bit of everything and there will always be another trade route to try, another ship to master, another module to engineer, another pristine ring to mine, another exploration trip to undertake. I never had to stack missions to "get somewhere", never had to look for a specific material I "needed" and get frustrated by RNG...

And when I do get a feeling that I reached most of the goals I had, I can always clear and start a new adventure.

You can say that telling you that your way (well, grinder's way, don't take it personally) is wrong and mine is right is opinionated and patronizing.
But where you play 300 hours, get bored and turn to hurting other people, because it's the "only fun you can get from the game at that point" and I played over 3500 hours and NEVER ran out of things to entertain me, then yes, I feel I have the right to say my way is better.
And I can also say that Elite isn't about PvP at all.

Rep++

 

[Pharmacist]

Two things -

1 - go play arena

2 - What has this to do with Horizons (or don't you want your thread to disappear in D D forum)?

Arena doesn't appeal to me, I want to use my own ship designs in arranged PVP from within the game. And to my complete understanding, you can only engineer with horizons content. Are you suggesting Elite Dangerous has no room to improve and that the multiplayer content should remain constricted to o7's in chat as you pass people in supercruise or dock at a station?

 

[Para Handy]

Arena doesn't appeal to me, I want to use my own ship designs in arranged PVP from within the game. And to my complete understanding, you can only engineer with horizons content. Are you suggesting Elite Dangerous has no room to improve and that the multiplayer content should remain constricted to o7's in chat as you pass people in supercruise or dock at a station?

The "Engineer" argument would suggest the Engineers forum would it not.

You can PvP all you want as far as I am concerned, I have not gone in Open since "Engineers" made it so unbalanced and I won't ever again I suppose. (I don't even pew-pew with the AI.)

Are there not PvP groups (I have no idea)? Surely like-minded pew-pew hardballs can arrange to have a melee somewhere already, you don't need F D to organise it for you.

P.S Yes of course E D can and should improve, evolve and develop and there are loads of Multiplayer features coming along. Unfortunately, Engineers makes any prospect of increased participation in Open Play minimal - I suspect a new type of "Private Group" structure will emerge.

 

[Hexcaliber]

In simple terms, no thank you; the inclusion of CQC outside the game universe was bad enough. Far too many good games have been wrecked by the inclusion of stupid arena style combat, nothing kills off open pvp quicker.

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Unfortunately, Engineers makes any prospect of increased participation in Open Play minimal - I suspect a new type of "Private Group" structure will emerge.

Nonsense, nor is there any need for a change to private groups; the bulk of the games community is already split between private and solo, that is why open play is minimal.