Quick question regarding thrusters an 'optimal mass'

To my mind, the wording of optimal vs maximum mass makes me think it should work as follows:

1) As long as you are below the optimal mass you see no benefit from using higher rating thrusters of the same class (e.g. 4B with optimal mass 385T will gain you nothing over 4D with optimal mass 315T if your ship and all modules only weighs 300T, it'll just needlessly use more power [and actually weigh a fair bit more for the module itself]).

2) Between the optimal and maximum mass, the responsiveness of the ship to both acceleration/braking and turning in any axis gradually drops, as you get further from optimal and closer to maximum. Possibly maximum speed also gets lower. So in cargo ships you need to account for what your mass might be with a full hold (or deal with the fact that the ship doesn't respond as well fully laden), but with pure combat/exploration ships with no cargo space you can run it right to the line of 'optimal'.

3) Beyond maximum mass the ship would not actually be able to move, so the game will not allow you to fit thrusters which have a maximum mass lower than the current ship weight (can you fit the thrusters first and then later on install modules that push you over the limit and get stuck?).

The thing is, i've seen people advocating a very different opinion, saying that even if your ship weighs only 300T you would see a significant improvement in turning responsiveness/radius etc by going from a 4D (315T optimal) to a 4A (420T optimal) set of thrusters. I've done a bit of googling but have failed to find a definitive source either way, so I was hoping someone in the community (or one of Frontier's staff) could tell me how it works at current. Is there any benefit to using higher rated thrusters than you currently have if you are below the optimal mass of your current thrusters?
 
It would be nice to get an official statement on how the code was written, what is intended and what actually happens. Simply put, how does it work. I guess I wont hold my breath.
 
I think there's a negligible improvement. I had my viper's boost up to 412 with A3 thrusters. I forget what the max speed without boost was, but it was slightly higher than the stock loadout. Maybe I'm thinking about it wrong because I'm tired, but it seems to me if there was no benefit to buying higher class thrusters while keeping your weight down then your max/boost speeds could never go above what they are with the stock loadout.
 
Higher class an rated thruster increses also max speed. So if you want to have max speed besides maneuvrability you have to buy higher rated and class thruster, right?
 
A bit of a wall of text I'm afraid but it might give some insight into thrusters, the data is from two months back but I believe there's been some small changes but in general the trend is fairly similar, essentially you can just notice the improved agility between E/D and A class thrusters, back when I collected this data the NPC's weren't much of a threat and a D class thruster was fine but with the improved AI I found I needed an A class in my Cobra to keep them on target.



Cobra Mk3 (180 T hull)

E4 thrusters mass 10T max 2 pip speed 213m/s
D4 thrusters mass 6T max 2 pip speed 218m/s
C4 thrusters mass 10T max 2 pip speed 215m/s should be around 225m/s I reckon (now fixed)
B4 thrusters mass 16T max 2 pip speed 231m/s
A4 thrusters mass 10T max 2 pip speed 239m/s


Eagle (50 T hull)

E3 thrusters mass 5T max 2 pip speed 211m/s
D3 thrusters mass 2T max 2 pip speed 216m/s
C3 thrusters mass 5T max 2 pip speed 214m/s should be around 220m/s I reckon
B3 thrusters mass 8T max 2 pip speed 225m/s
A3 thrusters mass 5T max 2 pip speed 233m/s


Eagle (50 T hull)

E2 thrusters can't fit
D2 thrusters mass 1T max 2 pip speed 199m/s
C2 thrusters mass 2.5T max 2 pip speed 206m/s
B2 thrusters mass 4T max 2 pip speed 205m/s
A2 thrusters mass 2.5T max 2 pip speed 210m/s


Sidewinder (25 T hull)

E2 thrusters mass 2.5T max 2 pip speed 160m/s
D2 thrusters mass 1T max 2 pip speed 163m/s
C2 thrusters mass 2.5T max 2 pip speed 162m/s
B2 thrusters mass 4T max 2 pip speed 170m/s
A2 thrusters mass 2.5T max 2 pip speed 175m/s


There appears to be some anomalies with thrusters in general, especially the class 2 on the Eagle where it's around 25% faster that the Sidewinder but the ship is twice the mass.

Additionally I measured some 360 degree pitch rotations to gauge the agility benefits between D and A grade thrusters, figures are approximate ;)

Eagle D3 middle of the blue band 100m/s 360 degree pitch 8 - 8.5 seconds

Eagle A3 below middle of the blue band 100m/s 360 degree pitch 8 seconds

Eagle A3 middle of the blue band 112m/s 360 degree pitch 7 - 7.5 seconds

So upgrading from an 18k thruster to a 500k one increases maximum speed by 17m/s (around 8%) and improves pitch rate by perhaps 10 -12%.

Each thruster grade adds approximately 3 - 4% extra speed and 3-4% better agility, the speed really isn't the big issue, however subjectively I can just detect the 10% difference between a D3 and an A3 thruster on the Eagle, 3 - 4% not a chance LOL.
 
The default Cobra's thrusters optimal mass exceed it's mass even with cargo. Get a feel for the default thrusters then switch to As and tell me you can't feel the difference.

For bonus points, try a default unladen Vulture with 4D and then 5A thrusters. the 4D's optimal mass hits the unladen mass exactly.
 
Can't be bothered linking the official info about this yet again, there's plenty of former threads about it if you search.

However...

Running at the "optimal" weight gives you the "as designed" flight characteristics for the ship.

Heavier than optimal, you get worse flight characteristics. Lighter than optimal you get better flight characteristics. Can't even fit them if you're over maximum.

Info officially posted from Mike Evans, one of the games designers.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

And now I can be bothered ...

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=128838&p=1973909&viewfull=1#post1973909
 
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I know it's a wall of text but....

"Each thruster grade adds approximately 3 - 4% extra speed and 3-4% better agility, the speed really isn't the big issue, however subjectively I can just detect the 10% difference between a D3 and an A3 thruster on the Eagle, 3 - 4% not a chance LOL."

IMO there needs to a better spread of thruster performance say 6 - 7% rather than the 3 - 4% I'd estimated or a higher performance range (military grade?) that expand the ship performance parameters in a similar fashion, I haven't checked these figures with the current game build but I'm fairly sure the A thruster Cobra top speed is up 2 m/s or so, perhaps ED have already expanded the thruster parameters a little.
 
I know it's a wall of text but....

"Each thruster grade adds approximately 3 - 4% extra speed and 3-4% better agility, the speed really isn't the big issue, however subjectively I can just detect the 10% difference between a D3 and an A3 thruster on the Eagle, 3 - 4% not a chance LOL."

IMO there needs to a better spread of thruster performance say 6 - 7% rather than the 3 - 4% I'd estimated or a higher performance range (military grade?) that expand the ship performance parameters in a similar fashion, I haven't checked these figures with the current game build but I'm fairly sure the A thruster Cobra top speed is up 2 m/s or so, perhaps ED have already expanded the thruster parameters a little.

The bigger the performance range possible the harder it gets to balance. Re the Eagle, 'feeling' the improvement between D rated and A rated thrusters on an already extremely maneuverable ship is tough. Make the same upgrade on a T9 and you will most definitely notice.
 
Can't be bothered linking the official info about this yet again, there's plenty of former threads about it if you search.

However...

Running at the "optimal" weight gives you the "as designed" flight characteristics for the ship.

Heavier than optimal, you get worse flight characteristics. Lighter than optimal you get better flight characteristics. Can't even fit them if you're over maximum.

Info officially posted from Mike Evans, one of the games designers.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

And now I can be bothered ...

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=128838&p=1973909&viewfull=1#post1973909

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=47014&p=837944&viewfull=1#post837944 also ;)
 
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