Realistic Gunner, please

[flanker1985]

I haven't been play as a gunner until yesterday.
And I just realised our gunner view turned this first person simulation game into a EVE game.
Can we have realist gunner view please.


My suggestion is that we position 2 cameras, 1 on the top of the ship, 1 below the ship. A gunner can remotely use those cameras to direct their gun.


Seriously, the current gunner camera just doesn't fit in a simulation game and looks majorly out of place.
At least give us the option to use the realistic gunner cam.

 

[Tai Fiction]

I agree that it is strange to have a third-person view on a simulation game. Although, its quite understandable as it is most effective way to use as a Gunner.

Adding gunner cameras can be a nice looking feature. Somewhat similar idea when going turret mode on a SRV, so it can keep the game more toward simulator type.

 

[TheFririshBoy]

For a game that is mostly about simulation and "realism" it's not normal to have this 3rd person view when in a turret. I was actually as Tai said, an srv type of view in the first place and no 3rd person or outside view for the moment. I would be really nice and immersive to have a first person view.

 

[flanker1985]

Like this, one camera on top of the ship which can rotate 360 degrees, and one below with the same principle.

 

[psyantologist]

With such a perspective, having no control over the ships movements while being subject to the visual impression will make you motionsick very quickly. It will be a nice rollercoaster ride, yes, sure - but it won't work to play the gunner.

 

[flanker1985]

With such a perspective, having no control over the ships movements while being subject to the visual impression will make you motionsick very quickly. It will be a nice rollercoaster ride, yes, sure - but it won't work to play the gunner.

No, it won't. Because you are relatively static to the ship. So to yourself, you are not moving at all. At the same time, gunner's focus point is on the target not the background. Therefore, there should have any motion sickness.

Have you ever played the expansion of the first "Call of Duty" game? The first mission was you on a B-17 as a gunner. I haven't heard anyone complain anything about motion sick. Beside, I have stated that "At least give us the option to use the realistic gunner cam". If you don't like it, just switch it to "unrealistic mode".

I do know some people who can't play "first person shooting" game and suffer for motion sickness when play all first person shooting games. They can just use the "unrealistic mode".

 

[psyantologist]

No, it won't. Because you are relatively static to the ship. So to yourself, you are not moving at all. At the same time, gunner's focus point is on the target not the background. Therefore, there should have any motion sickness.

Have you ever played the expansion of the first "Call of Duty" game? The first mission was you on a B-17 as a gunner. I haven't heard anyone complain anything about motion sick. Beside, I have stated that "At least give us the option to use the realistic gunner cam". If you don't like it, just switch it to "unrealistic mode".

I do know some people who can't play "first person shooting" game and suffer for motion sickness when play all first person shooting games. They can just use the "unrealistic mode".

Yes, it will.
The whole skybox will swirl around as the helmsman operates the ship - more than you are used to from a B-17, mind you. Much more. And you have no horizon. That makes a big difference. But, yeah, knock yourselves out with the option!

 

[flanker1985]

Yes, it will.
The whole skybox will swirl around as the helmsman operates the ship - more than you are used to from a B-17, mind you. Much more. And you have no horizon. That makes a big difference. But, yeah, knock yourselves out with the option!

I don't think you know what you are talking about. In your logic, my co-pilot should feel this "motion sickness" as well since he/she has no control of the ship, but they don't. In fact, I have been playing DCS and IL-2 semi-professionally in the past 12 years, and sometimes as gunner, I have never experienced any of your "motion sickness", nor have I heard anyone else who has.

No horizon means even more blurry back ground, means less "motion sickness". Skybox will be ignored during the play as the gunner's focus is either on the ship or the target. (besides, you so called "skybox" is just a blackground with some white dots anyway)

If you have a visual nerve issue, that is OK. But please don't presume everybody else has the same issue as you.
True motion sicknesses are usually caused by G force or other motions. The "motion sickness" you called is rather just a nerve issue where some people's visual nerve can't adjust focus fast enough to fit a 3D image and can't differentiate the simulated range and the true range. In that instance, a confusion is created in your nerve system as your brain is trying hard to come to an explanation of what you are seeing, thus overload your nerve, which cause headache.

What I can suggest to you is to force yourself to play FPS games which make you headache. The longer you play in those condition, they more you are use to it. I have a few friends who previously got headache from FPS games. But they force themselves to play longer and longer and eventually they no longer get headache anymore. Except for one, who refuse to play. But like I said, There is no shame in getting a headache, but please don't presume everyone else are like you.

 

[Hydrino]

I don't think you know what you are talking about. In your logic, my co-pilot should feel this "motion sickness" as well since he/she has no control of the ship, but they don't. In fact, I have been playing DCS and IL-2 semi-professionally in the past 12 years, and sometimes as gunner, I have never experienced any of your "motion sickness", nor have I heard anyone else who has.

No horizon means even more blurry back ground, means less "motion sickness". Skybox will be ignored during the play as the gunner's focus is either on the ship or the target. (besides, you so called "skybox" is just a blackground with some white dots anyway)

If you have a visual nerve issue, that is OK. But please don't presume everybody else has the same issue as you.
True motion sicknesses are usually caused by G force or other motions. The "motion sickness" you called is rather just a nerve issue where some people's visual nerve can't adjust focus fast enough to fit a 3D image and can't differentiate the simulated range and the true range. In that instance, a confusion is created in your nerve system as your brain is trying hard to come to an explanation of what you are seeing, thus overload your nerve, which cause headache.

What I can suggest to you is to force yourself to play FPS games which make you headache. The longer you play in those condition, they more you are use to it. I have a few friends who previously got headache from FPS games. But they force themselves to play longer and longer and eventually they no longer get headache anymore. Except for one, who refuse to play. But like I said, There is no shame in getting a headache, but please don't presume everyone else are like you.

I think we owe the new camera suite to gunner role as FD previously was dead-set against these types of camera views (interesting development, maybe other flip-flops will happen in the future).

FD already addressed this 'manned turret' issue. With an HMD it would be nausea inducing for many (I won't say all, of course). FD also said they looked at gunner in turret like SRV implementation and it was too difficult to track and hit targets in most cases, confusing in many cases, and not enough fun to be viable for them to implement in their opinion.

In most atmospheric flight sims with a viable gunner role the maneuvers are less violent and varied or the gunner will face similar issues. Again, I don't say it cannot be done or wouldn't be fun in some situations, just that FD already addressed the idea and to them the majority of combat situations saw the issues outweigh the "immersion" or whatever from a more classic WWII gunner idea.

Maybe if the "Gunner" role had radar screens and such and was not given an SRV turret view it would be more viable, and more in-line with what other work-stations might involve. But not sure how "fun" that would be on a small ship (Cap ships probably a different story, more weapons and more strategic decisions to make).

 

[flanker1985]

I think we owe the new camera suite to gunner role as FD previously was dead-set against these types of camera views (interesting development, maybe other flip-flops will happen in the future).

FD already addressed this 'manned turret' issue. With an HMD it would be nausea inducing for many (I won't say all, of course). FD also said they looked at gunner in turret like SRV implementation and it was too difficult to track and hit targets in most cases, confusing in many cases, and not enough fun to be viable for them to implement in their opinion.

In most atmospheric flight sims with a viable gunner role the maneuvers are less violent and varied or the gunner will face similar issues. Again, I don't say it cannot be done or wouldn't be fun in some situations, just that FD already addressed the idea and to them the majority of combat situations saw the issues outweigh the "immersion" or whatever from a more classic WWII gunner idea.

Maybe if the "Gunner" role had radar screens and such and was not given an SRV turret view it would be more viable, and more in-line with what other work-stations might involve. But not sure how "fun" that would be on a small ship (Cap ships probably a different story, more weapons and more strategic decisions to make).

Tracking target is easy. There are a lot of ways to do it.
For example, you already mentioned the radar screen.
My suggestion is that to add another tracker arrow to it. So every time after you lock on a target, an arrow appear and point to the nearest direct you need to move to get to your target. We also need a ship status indicator so we can see which direction our gun is pointing relative to the ship.

"not enough fun to be viable for them to implement in their opinion"???
Says who??? A few people in the designing team?? I know a lot of people who want realistic gunner mode.

"flight sims with a viable gunner role the maneuvers are less violent"???
Have you tried in a Pe-2 or Pe-3 or a Tu-2 as an rear gunner???

I really hope they can implement the realistic gunner mode. I have many friends who are interested in it. They would join my team if there is a realistic gunner mode since they don't like piloting.