General Gameplay Reworked Panic States

SharpToe

SharpToe
Your Feature Request / Idea
Panic states need to be shortened. Dinosaurs will go into panic state and remain in panic state for far to long. They also need to be shortened for the reason that often times the catalyst for the panic state will be gone and they continue to remain in a panic state to the point where it affects other mechanics.

Example:A T-rex will roar or walk by a pack/herd/group of dinosaurs. The dinosaurs then go into panic state. Dinosaurs in pack/herd/group run towards and around T-rex prolonging their panic state. Dinosaurs run away from T-rex but panic state remains even though T-rex is gone. Dinosaurs run so far away from T-rex and pack/herd/group to the point that it affects dinosaurs food,water,social requirement, and herding for a pack/herd/group thus a dinosaur breakout commences.

Solution: T-rex passes by a pack/herd/group. The dinosaurs run away from T-rex and panic state ends and dinosaurs rejoin their respective pack/herd/group and go back to eating,drinking, and herding.

In short panic states last too long due to whatever catalyst that caused them. Whether that be a T-rex, helicopter or whatever have you to the point that they affect the dinosaur's requirements such as but not limited to food,water,social, hearding etc.

Thank You Frontier for your hard work.
 

Stutter11

S
God yes please!!!!! It's especially annoying because I often put small carnivores with large carnivores in the same enclosure for the sake of being efficient with space but the small carnivores end up becoming low of health because it's almost as if they exists in an eternal state of panic and thus can't eat.
 

Alphacenturion

Alphacenturion
I keep my carnivores separate so I don't really experience this issue but I do know that every time my rangers go and resupply the feeders all the herbivores start panicking. Even when the rangers have left they will continue to panic unless I move away to a different part of the island. Now that may be a bug but I think especially with herbivores rangers shouldn't startle them unless they are vaccinating the animal which would obviously cause panic.
 

MarcWP

M
I was just about to say, if your animals panic, you aren't taking care of them properly.

I keep small carnivores with large carnivores as well, but I've never encountered any problems. I just make quite big enclosures...
 

SharpToe

SharpToe
If your not encountering this problem are you mixing large herbivores with large carnivores in open enclosures? I prefer the ecological preserve type build for my Isla Nublar Sandbox, and this where I see it taking place. Not because it's Isla Nublar but because this is where I enclose large carnivores with all my herbivores. So I can say with 100% certainty that this occurs. This has occurred when I didn't section off Isla Nublar and it was just one big enclosure, and it still occurs now that I have sectioned Isla Nublar off into quadrants.

Each quadrant has 1 to 2 large carnivores in it with herbivores. Quadrant 1 has two Allosaurus'. Quadrant 2 has one Carnotaurus. Quadrant 3 has one T-rex and one Metriacanthosaurus. Quadrant 5 has one Suchomimus and one Baryonyx. In each of these quadrants the herbivores react to the carnivores in the exact way I described. This preserve I created is actually my second version. In my first version the herbivores reacted the same way. Only after hours of gameplay to understand the dinosaur AI I realized that the large carnivores are drawn to the herbivores(especially if they're in large clusters). Even with the most recent patch 1.6 and the ability to turn combat off, the large carnivores will still migrate to where the herbivores are. Now theres nothing wrong this, they go where the food is. Its how the herbivores react and their continued panic status after the carnivore is gone is whats annoying.

I did find a way to prevent my herbivores from staying in a near perpetual panic state by placing my meat feeders as far away from herbivore herds and groups. If not and the meat feeders are placed near them they STAY in panic state and the carnivores do nothing but harass the herbivores. With this your herbivores aren't mentally insane all the time, but instead only act kinda stupid by running towards and around the thing that wants to eat them which is still a problem.
 

Stutter11

S
MarcWP said:
I keep small carnivores with large carnivores as well, but I've never encountered any problems. I just make quite big enclosures...
Click to expand...

I should've specified, but I was more referring to challenge mode, where being efficient with space and money is a must. As a result, these mixed enclosures probably aren't as big as the ones you make, but I think they're still big enough to where my small carnivores shouldn't be constantly panicking, and that's my problem.
 

SharpToe

SharpToe
Stutter11 said:
I should've specified, but I was more referring to challenge mode, where being efficient with space and money is a must. As a result, these mixed enclosures probably aren't as big as the ones you make, but I think they're still big enough to where my small carnivores shouldn't be constantly panicking, and that's my problem.
Click to expand...


Thats ok. I was just giving a description of my "ecological" enclosures so you can replicate them and see the issues I described in my post.
 

Alan_Grady

Alan_Grady
I totally agree with the OP, so 5 stars here too.

In fact, I'm still working on a review/Ai suggestion v2.0, and this comes one of the top issues.

Just for short tips:

  • Entering forest area should, almost inmediately if the forested area is big enough, reset the panic state.
  • There should be different levels of "panic", specially given the many and different stimuli that could trigger it: mortal dangers such as predators (or the ones perceived as such, as the ACU helicopter's approach) should trigger the higher, more contagious and long-lasting ones (the real panic able to cause Stampedes, in my future post) while lesser alarming stimuli such as strong noises, fights between kins within a herd outburst right beside the subject, or thunder should only cause "alarm". This "alarm" would work in a similar way to the stress bar, growing steadfast the longer the offending stimuli is present, both reducing comfort and increasing the chances of a genuine panic attack.
 

Pixelated Sparkster

Pixelated Sparkster
I fully agree. I also experience this with territorial fights, which is why I always place 1 dinosaur less then the social max. That the dinosaur that loses gets to a panic state and it chain reacts to every herbivore in the enclosure. It should just be the loser that panics and non of the other dinosaurs should be bothered by that panic.

As well as having small carnivores and giant herbivores not panic as much. They seem to be the specific kinds dinosaurs that need to be adjusted in their panic state the most. Where small carnivores should not panic from the "medium" sized carnivores (Carnivores that are smaller than allosaurus should not panic the small carnivores at the very least). And the giant sauropods should not panic from all dinosaurs except the large carnivores (Allosaurus and up). Dreadnoughtus should also not panic to a fault to give it character. It could still get killed by the indominus rex but they still don't panic.
 

SharpToe

SharpToe
Thank you Alan_Grady and Pixelated Sparkster!!! I worked really hard on this post so people could understand exactly what I was presenting to them!! Thank you!!!
 

JohnMiller1132

JohnMiller1132
This is the latest news regarding the panic implementation.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...eat-or-drink?p=7393283&viewfull=1#post7393283

They confirm that panic can be spread across species, across adjacent enclosures, and when available space is too small (Yes, MarcWP is right in this case).

Personally, I’m okay with this implementation. I think it’s fairly realistic but I do hope future tweaking of this spreading behavior will be reviewed very carefully as the slightest adjustment in the wrong direction may cause total havoc to people parks. Also, the release note of the update should states the details more explicitly as it causes confusion and wasted my time as I misunderstood it as a bug (as it only happens after 1.6, not after the herding 1.5)

Anyways, I’m quite disappointed with how they deal with bug reports, first they missed my post for over a month (asking something I already provided a month ago) and then treating bug reporters like an enemy. I didn’t even intend to contest their decision. I was just confused as I wasn’t informed properly of the changes. I’m totally done with this game, this company, the customer service part of it.
 

SharpToe

SharpToe
JohnMiller1132 said:
This is the latest news regarding the panic implementation.

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...eat-or-drink?p=7393283&viewfull=1#post7393283
Click to expand...

I read it but i dont agree. The issues I brought up are not covered it their response. A Brachiosaurus should not panic at the site of a Metriacanthosaurus. The herbivore is too big for it to "realistically" cause it to be afraid.

Shared panic states and spreading the panic state is stupid and should go. Especially given the number of times people have said the dinosaurs at times wont eat or drink and die because of lack of consuming food. Thats because of prolonged, overly long, and perpetual panic states. I literally spend hours and I am very comfortable in saying that I spend more time look at the dinosaurs interact than the devs.
For example when in comes to herding, when a dinosaur gets separated from the herd/pack due to a panic state its social requirement will go down and you will have a breakout. However if they ran back to their herd/pack you would not have that problem.

What is happening in development is that the team managed to get the dinosaurs to follow a leader without really looking at the effects of the new ai and its system they put in. Basically they said "WE GOT IT!!" and didn't do any other testing, and all the effects of said ai and system are just by products and we have to be happy with it. The reason I know and see the flaws is because I'm playing the game at its utmost. Which I have stated before is playing the Isla Nublar sandbox as a nature/ecological preserve so the problems come forth.

Trust me I understand your frustration JohnMiller1132. Frontier "says" their listening to the community but if you go anywhere where said community is posting(reddit, facebook, here) you are going to see three request over and over; Nature decoration, more building/land customization, and raptor skins. But has frontier made any attempt to say "Hey we see everybody keeps asking for the same thing that we can actually do so you know what your wishes are going to be granted!!". No instead we get radio silence. Nothing. If they did these things it would help them 100%. But I think everyone knows that if they dont start implementing these request the the small undercurrent of people saying this game is dead. The game WILL ACTUALLY DIE.
 

TitanKaiju75

TitanKaiju75
I ABSOLUTELY agree that the Panic behavior needs to be improved. The improvements I was thinking of are:

1: Panic state lasts, at most, half as long as it does currently.
2: Panic state can only be spread to dinosaurs of the same species.
3: After a Territory dispute, the loser of the confrontation cannot spread the Panic state to any other dinosaur, even if they're the same species.
 
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