Selling cosmetics

[NW3]

Frontier Development isn't the only company selling lots of cosmetics for a non-free-to-play game in their store.

From Ars Technica:

...more and more publishers seem to be realizing that [cosmetic sales] can also be layered on top of games that already charge players a standard price up front. On the one hand, you can't blame publishers for taking advantage of the opportunity to take in so much continued revenue after launch (especially if and when it's just cosmetic content that isn't necessary to enjoy the base game).

https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/03/analysis-for-honor-unlocks-cost-730-or-5200-hours/

Now will those who've been complaining that FD is the only company doing this please stop? (Fat chance.)

Of course, the comparison isn't quite the same. FD doesn't let you grind for cosmetics; the grind is part of the game itself.

 

[AsukaZ]

I Read the article, very interesting.

I'd say there's a difference between pure cosmetics and paying for advantages / steps up in a game. I hope FD don't go down that path even if they might find it lucrative, The number of complaint threads about earning ratios and the big three I'm sure many people would be happy to hand over cash for shortcuts in this game. It just seems a bit cheep, you know, where's the journey ?

Deus ex went down that path eh ? That's a shame, I enjoyed ex machina.
If it's a AAA game that suggests I pay more to avoid the 'Included Grindy Path' I think I'd rather keep my money thanks.

 

[NW3]

I'd say there's a difference between pure cosmetics and paying for advantages / steps up in a game. I hope FD don't go down that path even if they might find it lucrative

I agree. Luckily, FD has said they'd never sell pay-to-win stuff, only cosmetics. The problem (for some people) is that most the cosmetics cannot be earned in-game and must be purchased.

 

[maxpayne]

FDev has put so much resource to these cosmetics but not on the game itself.

Yes, keep buying the ship kits and skins. You will see how the game will become.

 

[Faybs]

FDev has put so much resource to these cosmetics but not on the game itself.

Yes, keep buying the ship kits and skins. You will see how the game will become.

Gr8 b8 m8. I r8 8/8.

Look at the number of skins in the frontier store, then look at the patch notes for 2.3, or 2.2, or any other update in the past two years, and tell me again how FDev spends more time in cosmetics than on the game.

 

[AsukaZ]

... The problem (for some people) is that most the cosmetics cannot be earned in-game and must be purchased.

It's a money making exercise, no doubt about that.

If they offered them purchasable in game it would have to be quite high so as not to devalue them on the store in which case they could open themselves to the accusation of 'Pay to avoid grind' like Deus Ex. Maybe as rewards for certain things.

I think FD are doing it right, that is to say I'm happy with their business model, optional cosmetic items that confer no real in game benefit other than looking good.

FDev has put so much resource to these cosmetics but not on the game itself.

Yes, keep buying the ship kits and skins. You will see how the game will become.

Better resourced I imagine.

 

[Kayweg]

Just another front caving in and consumers retreating.
"Others do it too, so it's ok"
Next step, it becomes common practice, and publishers probe for the next weakness to exploit.
Enough "aye sayers" around to back them up.

 

[Qohen Leth]

"...more and more publishers", which ones? Hey journalist, fancy avoiding the vagueness?

 

[Winterwalker]

Just another front caving in and consumers retreating.
"Others do it too, so it's ok"
Next step, it becomes common practice, and publishers probe for the next weakness to exploit.
Enough "aye sayers" around to back them up.

This misses the point though that cosmetic sales are entirely 'progressive'?

In other words the revenue gained by the game company doesn't need to be included in the expansion/season/game pass, so that price can be made more affordable. Secondly, if you're short on cash you don't need to buy the cosmetics anyway.

If you like the game (whichever game you're talking about) if it helps your immersion, or if you want to see the game's features develop, then there really isn't any logical argument (I can think of) for begrudging the developers as many revenue streams as they can find, to fund the game. With a pool of cash behind them, devs can resource more programmers?

tldr; I don't get it -1.

 

[Kayweg]

This misses the point though that cosmetic sales are entirely 'progressive'?

In other words the revenue gained by the game company doesn't need to be included in the expansion/season/game pass, so that price can be made more affordable. Secondly, if you're short on cash you don't need to buy the cosmetics anyway.

If you like the game (whichever game you're talking about) if it helps your immersion, or if you want to see the game's features develop, then there really isn't any logical argument (I can think of) for begrudging the developers as many revenue streams as they can find, to fund the game. With a pool of cash behind them, devs can resource more programmers?

tldr; I don't get it -1.

I'm not against selling vanity items in principle.
As for benefitting future development or keeping games affordable.
How much of the savings were passed on to consumers then, when most games stopped shipping as a boxed product ?
No more production costs for dvd, packaging and user manuals, no more storage capacity needed, no physical distribition costs, no more retailers getting their share, plus various wages from those activities saved.
You saw game prices plunge all of a sudden ?
I didn't.
In fact, in almost all cases digital versions retail at a higher price than boxed versions.
I mean, really ?!
I'm no socialist, ok ? People should be free to enjoy their economic success, no problem at all.
But there's a fine line between a legitimate thrive for financial success and outright greed.
And the gaming industry seems to have developed a habbit of repeatedly crossing that line.

 

[Hooplah]

X-plane 10 is a huge money pit with add-on scenery, plug-in subscriptions from actual FAA approved navigation databases and aircraft costing $60 or higher. Massing a fleet one can easily spend $2500 or more not including custom flight controls which can add thousands more. Helo controls can easily hit $1200. Compared to ED we're getting off cheap but in fairness X-Plane is a serious flight simulation versus a game. XP PvP has live players in traffic around an airport and a live traffic controllers directing them! We could learn from that.

Meanwhile lots of games in the Apple Store for iPads etc can be downloaded for free then easily cost $100 to add pay-to-win additions. Much more can be spent in the Frontier Store with no pay-to-win additions. We're getting ripped off!

Just kidding with a little satire thrown in but given the cosmetics have no effect in the game lowering the prices some would be appropriate. Still it is capitalism with a what the market can bear approach. The good news is that we have the freedom to choose.

 

[CMDR CPT. Boris]

i would never pay for cosmetics, unless the game is called "Elite Dangerous"

 

[Bran Tse Mallory]

i would never pay for cosmetics, unless the game is called "Elite Dangerous"

+1 Virtual Rep

ESO does this too, has done for a long time too. You buy the game then you get to buy your clothes/mount unless your happy with the donkey and rags the game provides - actually that game does have some nice armours in it already.

There are a large number of games that are running this way. What is important is not to allow them to put P2W items in the store, if they did we'll know who to blame... and it's not Tj!

 

[Kayweg]

+1 Virtual Rep

ESO does this too, has done for a long time too. You buy the game then you get to buy your clothes/mount unless your happy with the donkey and rags the game provides - actually that game does have some nice armours in it already.

There are a large number of games that are running this way. What is important is not to allow them to put P2W items in the store, if they did we'll know who to blame... and it's not Tj!

I'm rather familiar with ESO, and currently subbed (optional).
Yes, the variety of armor styles and in-game cosmetic options is vast.
A system many other games could do with a slice of, including ED.
At the same time, ESO is seeing one of the biggest controversies currently going on.
Having always stated that subscribers will have access to all DLC content, they recently announced that the upcoming Morrowind content wiill have to be bought seperately.
Their reasoning ?
Morrowind isn't DLC, it's a "chapter".
So, just call it something else and wind your way out of previous commitments ?
It's this sort of behaviour that ticks people off.

 

[Thetele]

So at the greedy scale Frontier is in same place as EA and Ubisoft? Nice to hear that community agrees on that. I am pretty shocked that its good thing that players think being on same level with EA and ubisoft, which both most claim to be the worst game publishers.

 

[CMDR CPT. Boris]

So at the greedy scale Frontier is in same place as EA and Ubisoft? Nice to hear that community agrees on that. I am pretty shocked that its good thing that players think being on same level with EA and ubisoft, which both most claim to be the worst game publishers.

The difference I see between EA/Ubi and FD is that FD do not publish a new Elite every 2 years.
As long as the game is still in development and have the "10 years plan", i'm pretty ok with buying stuff on the store.

 

[m0rl0ck]

The way you spend your money says something. If it says "I want to be treated like an idiot" they will line up around the block to take it.

 

[NeilF]

Luckily, FD has said they'd never sell pay-to-win stuff, only cosmetics.

Don't forget multi-crew is potentially opening a form of "pay to win"...? You can buy a second (or third account) and sit AFK players in your main account's ship and get additional pips.

ie: Would you rather farm a RES with a 4-0-2 configuration, or 50% or a 100% more weapon energy? Would you rather be chased by a pirate (or gankers) with 0-4-2 or 50 to 100% more weapon energy?

When asked about this in a live stream, Sandro seemed fairly dismissive of the concern?

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...additional-single-power-distribution-pip-quot

 

[Skyjack]

Frontier is nothing on the greed scale. Yearly major expansions are fair, store items don't affect gameplay. FDev is nowhere near the screwup that is Deus Ex (except for one decision, the tagged-on arcade modes which logically cannot outdo PS4 native arcade games and hence lead to very limited success both in ED and DXMD). Please. Deus Ex is hyper-consolised pay-to-win with balance explicitly tuned to include store items (the equivalent of entire paywalled ships) for optimum experience - the end result of that wisdom being a legendary franchise with millions of fans axed because of lukewarm reception. At this point it is extremely unfair to compare FDev to that or imply they will be making the same mistake when nothing, literally, says they will.

 

[VR jefranklin18]

Frontier is nothing on the greed scale. Yearly major expansions are fair, store items don't affect gameplay. FDev is nowhere near the screwup that is Deus Ex (except for one decision, the tagged-on arcade modes which logically cannot outdo PS4 native arcade games and hence lead to very limited success both in ED and DXMD). Please. Deus Ex is hyper-consolised pay-to-win with balance explicitly tuned to include store items (the equivalent of entire paywalled ships) for optimum experience - the end result of that wisdom being a legendary franchise with millions of fans axed because of lukewarm reception. At this point it is extremely unfair to compare FDev to that or imply they will be making the same mistake when nothing, literally, says they will.

Indeed. The hyperbole about FD's "greed" is quite endearing as it is so blown out of proportion.