Newcomer / Intro Shooting System Authority Vessels by mistake

Caty_Feila

Caty_Feila
Sometimes I'm in the middle of a battle and I carve a deep gouge on the back of a police Viper by mistake and he doesn't say anything.
Other times, my target throws chaff at my face and I end up landing one single "Pew!" with a class 1D pulse laser on a police Anaconda and I get a bounty on my head and the entire galaxy is shooting at me.

What's the threshold?
 

Faded Glory

Faded Glory
A couple of things. Shots to shield, unless from a powerful weapon are often not enough to trigger a bounty. However, any shot that hits the hull will get you wanted.

Your status with the faction of the ship you hit can also make a difference, so if you are allied they can be more tolerant - you may see a comms message to the effect to watch where you are shooting.
 

Caty_Feila

Caty_Feila
When I shot the Viper I guess it had the shields offline because I could see my laser carving a gouge and it didn't say anything.
On the other hand, when I shot the Anaconda I could see the blue waves of the shield and yet I got a bounty.
That's why I am wondering.
 

Faded Glory

Faded Glory
Well, that's definitely odd. Originally, any shot to an un-targeted non wanted ship or any ship that you hadn't scanned yet would get you wanted, shielded or not. Many people complained and conditions for friendly fire were relaxed to what I wrote above.

It may well be to do with your reputation with the faction(s) in the system, perhaps even your superpower rep also, but I'm definitely surprised that you were able to hit an un-shielded ship and get away without an assault bounty. :)

There is supposedly a 'damage' threshold for shots to shields, but I don't believe we know what it is, mainly it means that a shot by a size 1 pulse laser would be less likely to trigger it (not in you case obviously) than by a size 4 beam laser!

Thresholds may have been relaxed even more over time, the game is definitely more forgiving these days, perhaps even to allowing hits to a hull, but if they have been then it has never been announced in any patch notes. :)
 

d8veh

d8veh
It's best to stop shooting when they chaff.

If you accidentally have a police ship or any innocent ship targeted when you shoot it, you get an instant bounty on you, even with a single pulse from a single pulse laser. Apart from that, it's difficult to make exact rules. I did some tests that showed you could land a fair burst on a police Anaconda, and all you get is a warning.

If you do shoot the police or any innocent ship to become wanted, you must act immediately. Put 4 pips to engines and 2 to shields and start boosting away from the cops and out of the RES or wherever you are to get clear of mass-lock, then get your FSD going. It's best to jump to target another system to jump to, which prevents you from getting mass-locked by any ships chasing you. If you're not taking much damage or nobody is chasing you, you can jump into super-cruise, then plan where to go to. If you're quick, you will always get away. Every second counts.

When you get into supercruise or jump somewhere else, find the nearest low security system with a station, where you will find an interstellar factor who will clear your bounty, so that you can go back to what you were doing.

Here's an old video, that shows all that, including how to get away. Turn up the sound. Only the first 3 minutes is relevant because they changed what happens with bounties after that.
Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3BmDRoUsKo
 
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wetwire

wetwire
(Puts tape over @Caty_Feila 's firing trigger ) "Stop shooting law enforcement"

trigger-discipline-importance-e1552265744118.png
 
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Faded Glory

Faded Glory
wetwire said:
(Puts tape over @Caty_Feila 's firing trigger ) "Stop shooting law enforcement"
Click to expand...

You know, I'm not sure anymore.

FD have been raising the tolerances for friendly fire for quite some time, you no longer have to complete scans of ships, and if you shoot one that turns out to be wanted, even though you don't know it, there's no bounty any more. Perhaps they've quietly removed FF from the game? Haven't seen any threads lately complaining about dumb ships flying through lasers, and I can't remember the last time I even got a FF comms warning, let alone a bounty - other than from my SLF, and they should know better, but they do like to chatter at you.

Maybe Caty accidentally targeted the Anaconda in the heat of battle and that's why she got an assault bounty. Something definitely seems to have changed if she was able to hit a system authority hull and not get a bounty.
 

wetwire

wetwire
Faded Glory said:
You know, I'm not sure anymore.

FD have been raising the tolerances for friendly fire for quite some time, you no longer have to complete scans of ships, and if you shoot one that turns out to be wanted, even though you don't know it, there's no bounty any more. Perhaps they've quietly removed FF from the game? Haven't seen any threads lately complaining about dumb ships flying through lasers, and I can't remember the last time I even got a FF comms warning, let alone a bounty - other than from my SLF, and they should know better, but they do like to chatter at you.

Maybe Caty accidentally targeted the Anaconda in the heat of battle and that's why she got an assault bounty. Something definitely seems to have changed if she was able to hit a system authority hull and not get a bounty.
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That's fair
I too have not seen a warning or bounty from friendly fire in quite some time.
SLF's; yeah they attract more problems then they fix, told my hired crew to go sit in the station and think about what they have done.
Most recent combat ventures i have been doing where in compromised nav beacons so no real security to get in the way. So i'm not in a good position to verify friendly fire thresholds.
 
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Faded Glory

Faded Glory
wetwire said:
That's fair
I too have not seen a warning or bounty from friendly fire in quite some time.
SLF's; yeah they attract more problems then they fix, told my hired crew to go sit in the station and think about what they have done.
Most recent combat ventures i have been doing where in compromised nav beacons so no real security to get in the way. So i'm not in a good position to verify friendly fire thresholds.
Click to expand...

I've been doing quite a lot of pirate lord assassinations, also pirate massacre missions, and quite often there are security ships there. Not that I often got FF bounties, but it just occurs to me that I haven't even seen warnings lately, not that I think I have necessarily hit a friendly, but for sure there's times it could have happened.
 

Sapyx

Sapyx
I saw a friendly fire warning in a conflict zone just yesterday. Haven't been to a beacon/RES recently to check there.

The other thing you have to watch out for is their eventual death. Just as you get credit (and the bounty) for landing some shots on a Wanted target that eventually explodes, even some half a minute after you last landed a shot on it, you can likewise get the blame if someone whom you shot at eventually dies by someone else's hand. The warning or fine can suddenly escalate to murder/bounty.

That's why, if you hit a cop (or an ally in a conflict zone) and they let you live, you've got to get out of Dodge (or the instance) ASAP.
 

Banger_uk

Banger_uk
does that also effected jumping to the enemy system, and targeting them has they are wanted .but no cr for the kill.

never had a police/system defence vessel after me, or is that i flying a sidewinder and they took pity on me:)
accidently ganked a npc into the side of a station,no fines,landed at dock.
 

Caty_Feila

Caty_Feila
I did not target system security ships.
Those that I shot accidentally were not targeted. I know the difference between green and orange.

They were situations in which it was a heated battle involving several ships from both sides.
The Viper crossed my sight suddenly from the side while I was shooting at my target and got hit by my beam laser.

The Anaconda was behind my target when my target suddenly chaffed and got one single shot of my pulse laser the moment that the chaff was launched.
It was not like the target was chaffing for a long time and I was stubbornly shooting at it with my gimbal weapons flying all around.

So yes, friend fire is a thing but it seems they relaxed the threshold as sometimes you can hit police ships and not even get a warning.

I also had a case in which there were several pirates shooting a pirate Anaconda. Yes I am sure the Anaconda was wanted, I scanned it.
I waited for a while to see if the police would join in but they didnt.
When the anaconda was about to die, I couldn't resist and joined in and shot it until it died.
I got the reward for killing the wanted pilot and then soon afterwards, I got a message saying I murdered someone whose name was different than the name of the pilot. So I supposed he was a passenger in the anaconda. I got a bounty on my head and had to flee.
I was playing solo mode so all the ships around were NPCs.
 

aRJay

aRJay
Caty_Feila said:
I did not target system security ships.
Those that I shot accidentally were not targeted. I know the difference between green and orange.

They were situations in which it was a heated battle involving several ships from both sides.
The Viper crossed my sight suddenly from the side while I was shooting at my target and got hit by my beam laser.

The Anaconda was behind my target when my target suddenly chaffed and got one single shot of my pulse laser the moment that the chaff was launched.
It was not like the target was chaffing for a long time and I was stubbornly shooting at it with my gimbal weapons flying all around.

So yes, friend fire is a thing but it seems they relaxed the threshold as sometimes you can hit police ships and not even get a warning.

I also had a case in which there were several pirates shooting a pirate Anaconda. Yes I am sure the Anaconda was wanted, I scanned it.
I waited for a while to see if the police would join in but they didnt.
When the anaconda was about to die, I couldn't resist and joined in and shot it until it died.
I got the reward for killing the wanted pilot and then soon afterwards, I got a message saying I murdered someone whose name was different than the name of the pilot. So I supposed he was a passenger in the anaconda. I got a bounty on my head and had to flee.
I was playing solo mode so all the ships around were NPCs.
Click to expand...
A single passenger seems unlikely maybe it was the Anacondas SLF pilot.
 

Tungshep

Tungshep
d8veh said:
If you do shoot the police or any innocent ship to become wanted, you must act immediately. Put 4 pips to engines and 2 to shields and start boosting away from the cops and out of the RES or wherever you are to get clear of mass-lock, then get your FSD going. It's best to jump to target another system to jump to, which prevents you from getting mass-locked by any ships chasing you. If you're not taking much damage or nobody is chasing you, you can jump into super-cruise, then plan where to go to. If you're quick, you will always get away. Every second counts.
Click to expand...

I think it's actually a shame you can't pick more sustained fights with authority vessels. In the original, 80s Elite, you could really take down a lot of them before being overwhelmed by reinforcements. In ED, I think you can do battle with regular forces, but probably not for long. As for Void Rangers, which I sometimes have to deal with: Those guys are a pest -- they immediately shoot torpedoes with Reverberating Cascade at you, and your shields are toast. Module broken, 0%, no recharge. So when you hear the message, "This area is on lockdown," you REALLY need to get out.
 

d8veh

d8veh
Faded Glory said:
You know, I'm not sure anymore.

FD have been raising the tolerances for friendly fire for quite some time, you no longer have to complete scans of ships, and if you shoot one that turns out to be wanted, even though you don't know it, there's no bounty any more. Perhaps they've quietly removed FF from the game? Haven't seen any threads lately complaining about dumb ships flying through lasers, and I can't remember the last time I even got a FF comms warning, let alone a bounty - other than from my SLF, and they should know better, but they do like to chatter at you.

Maybe Caty accidentally targeted the Anaconda in the heat of battle and that's why she got an assault bounty. Something definitely seems to have changed if she was able to hit a system authority hull and not get a bounty.
Click to expand...
It still hapens, just like before. If you stay there long enough, you'll get a bounty against you sooner or later. All sorts of circumstances can happen that you have no control over. Sure, trigger discipline helps, but it doesn't prevent eventual bounties against you.
 

Faded Glory

Faded Glory
d8veh said:
It still hapens, just like before. If you stay there long enough, you'll get a bounty against you sooner or later. All sorts of circumstances can happen that you have no control over. Sure, trigger discipline helps, but it doesn't prevent eventual bounties against you.
Click to expand...

That's fine, I was simply wondering aloud due to the fact that Caty managed to hit a hull and didn't get a bounty. Personally I haven't had a FF bounty for ages, not that I spend a huge amount of time in RES, just doing pirate massacre missions and pirate lord assassinations where quite often system security are present, but I'm actually pleased to hear they are still a thing.

@Caty_Feila Ship launched fighter.
 
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