Slavery

[Badmiker]

Is the existence of slavery in the Empire deeply offensive, a misunderstood social mechanism, or just a bit of game colour?

As I understand it, slavery in the Empire is a form of national service / conscripted labour / welfare system. Brings a whole new meaning to Elite universe(al) credits. If so, there should be the option to voluntarily enter into slavery. If you want to buy something or pay off a debt/fine then you should be able to enter into a slavery agreement with a faction or powerplay. You would be bound to them: only doing missions for them, until the debt is paid off. There would be massive penalties if you broke the agreement: massive notoriety, fines etc. You could end up having sold everything just running mission on foot.

As well as reflecting a bit of Elite lore, it would allow struggling cmdrs to access things which would otherwise be out of their reach. For example; after buying an Imperial Cutter I struggled to buy 8A shields, I would have been happy to spend a couple of weeks running missions to get them.

Alternatively: Imperial slavery is truly offensive and has no place being given such prominence in the game.

 

[Ettanin]

as a slave you would lose ALL your possessions, including ships, suits, weapons, etc.

Not possible in the sense of lore.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Imperial slavery is really indentured servitude, and is more about paying off a debt you can't repay. To get it into the game you'd need somehow be able to declare yourself an Imperial citizen (which could be done via the ranks perhaps, or PP allegiance) and when it all goes belly up you have an alternative to the loan you get on rebuy.

In effect it would be like having an NPC pilot, in that a % of your income repays the debt.

 

[Factabulous]

Hello again old topic

 

[Northpin]

Is the existence of slavery in the Empire deeply offensive, a misunderstood social mechanism, or just a bit of game colour?

No. No (well, maybe for you it is a misunderstood social mechanism). Yes

As I understand it, slavery in the Empire is a form of national service / conscripted labour / welfare system. Brings a whole new meaning to Elite universe(al) credits. If so, there should be the option to voluntarily enter into slavery. If you want to buy something or pay off a debt/fine then you should be able to enter into a slavery agreement with a faction or powerplay. You would be bound to them: only doing missions for them, until the debt is paid off. There would be massive penalties if you broke the agreement: massive notoriety, fines etc. You could end up having sold everything just running mission on foot.

Not quite so, it's a form of indentured servitude used to repay debts.
You cannot do that because you are an independent pilot within the ranks of the Pilots Federation. Basically a distinct and different layer with the game (completely separated from the factions, powers and superpowers)

Imperial Slavery is a regulated form of indentured servitude, and Imperials are quick to point out that Imperial Slaves are often better cared for and rewarded than their free, working-class counterparts in the Federation. Having an unpaid debt is seen as utterly dishonorable in Imperial society, and so an honorable Imperial citizen naturally feels obligated to sell themselves into Imperial Slavery if they have exhausted all other options. Imperial Slaves voluntarily contract themselves out for a predetermined amount of time to earn money to pay debts that they could not otherwise clear or to support their families. Alternatively, Imperial Slaves can buy their freedom using their "tithe", or may earn early release from service by performing admirably in their duties or as a reward for long and loyal service.

Imperial Slaves are guaranteed basic human rights and may exercise free will and self-determination, but still have substantially less freedom than regular Imperial citizens. Despite this, being an Imperial slave is considered more socially acceptable than allowing oneself to languish in debt. The typical Imperial Slave will willingly return to servitude in the event they are forcibly freed before their contract ends, and depending on the circumstances of their premature liberation, they may have no other alternative way to survive anyway. Upon concluding their contract, Imperial Slaves are given new employment and temporary welfare assistance by a registered organization to help them re-acclimatize to citizenship.

Imperial society emphasizes both status and honour, and while it is acceptable to flaunt one's wealth, mistreating people, including Imperial Slaves, is considered highly undignified and shameful.

Alternatively: Imperial slavery is truly offensive and has no place being given such prominence in the game.

It's part of the lore. You cannot be a slaver nor subjected to slavery.
However, you can be an atrocious murderer. Does that make you feel any better?

 

[Ski'Thor]

Played 6 years, has a 2 digitl billion credits amount, wants to go into slavery to pay a dept you can't pay...
Well... what have you done? Killed the emperor's first born? Had fun with the emperor's partner in marriage?

Out of the players perspektive, every Commander seems to be well educated, having all possibilities in space and is able to buy and fly ships, even handling a crew of 1 to 3 people on board and is also able to hold a carrier with more people.

But it is ok, because this is Space Souls, not Dark Souls. In latter you can choose to be a beggar, but still be able to kill the 4 Lords of cinder, lothric and Kiln of the first flame.

You would simple need a whole new game
And even if, why would anybody even wants to play a salve? Do you think it is hot and steamy like in "Spartacus", sex with everyone, everwhere and a naked Lucy Lawless? I doubt! Playing a slave would only make sense, if you are a fan of self-torture.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Played 6 years, has a 2 digitl billion credits amount, wants to go into slavery to pay a dept you can't pay...
Well... what have you done? Killed the emperor's first born? Had fun with the emperor's partner in marriage?

Out of the players perspektive, every Commander seems to be well educated, having all possibilities in space and is able to buy and fly ships, even handling a crew of 1 to 3 people on board and is also able to hold a carrier with more people.

But it is ok, because this is Space Souls, not Dark Souls. In latter you can choose to be a beggar, but still be able to kill the 4 Lords of cinder, lothric and Kiln of the first flame.

You would simple need a whole new game

You can rack up billions in bounties very, very easily. As an example- 500 sec kills = 1.5 billion in bounties owed, along with 500,000 or so in SP bounties. Thats like just over a week of hardcore BGS work in the old versions.

 

[Ski'Thor]

You can rack up billions in bounties very, very easily. As an example- 500 sec kills = 1.5 billion in bounties owed, along with 500,000 or so in SP bounties. Thats like just over a week of hardcore BGS work in the old versions.

Ok, that's a point.
But you can still manage to pay these things without the need of beeing a slave in the imperial economy.

 

[Northpin]

You can rack up billions in bounties very, very easily. As an example- 500 sec kills = 1.5 billion in bounties owed, along with 500,000 or so in SP bounties. Thats like just over a week of hardcore BGS work in the old versions.

Ok, that's a point.
But you can still manage to pay these things without the need of beeing a slave in the imperial economy.

Yea, but in this case you are not a law abiding imperial citizen, but a common criminal. A murderer
And the penalty is death.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Ok, that's a point.
But you can still manage to pay these things without the need of beeing a slave in the imperial economy.

And if you are out in open and let your guard down one mistake can lead to you being killed very easily.

Obviously its an edge case because FD don't encourage this sort of live fast or die trying gameplay (instead molding everyone into safe grandads) but if it were more prevalent (or going bankrupt through trade mishaps, and not keeping up on your ship repair bills) such servitude would be a useful gameplay tool.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Yea, but in this case you are not a law abiding imperial citizen, but a common criminal. A murderer
And the penalty is death.

And what if these were all Fed, indy or Kale Muncher kills? The Empire does turn a blind eye to crimes in rivals territory (or at least should).

If it were the case you'd be a privateer by proxy, and be on the Empires leash.

 

[Ski'Thor]

Yea, but in this case you are not a law abiding imperial citizen, but a common criminal. A murderer
And the penalty is death.

Death in the sense of FDev or death in the sense of reality?
I mean, never tried it, but are your "punishment" entries are also removed when you get killed?

Sorry for not knowing, but I've never been killed while have a bounty on me

 

[Ski'Thor]

And if you are out in open and let your guard down one mistake can lead to you being killed very easily.

Obviously its an edge case because FD don't encourage this sort of live fast or die trying gameplay (instead molding everyone into safe grandads) but if it were more prevalent (or going bankrupt through trade mishaps, and not keeping up on your ship repair bills) such servitude would be a useful gameplay tool.

This would be nice, but the majority wouldn't like it.
There are not many games where you are sent to prison for your crimes, even in Skyrim it was very easy to avoid or get out of prison.

 

[Northpin]

And what if these were all Fed, indy or Kale Muncher kills? The Empire does turn a blind eye to crimes in rivals territory (or at least should).

yea, but in this case your debts (bounties) would be with the Feds, not with the Empire.
As far as you would be concerned, as an imperial citizen, you'd have no debt. But the Fed would have bounties on you, and the bounty hunters would try to kill you and collect the bounty

 

[Rubbernuke]

yea, but in this case your debts (bounties) would be with the Feds, not with the Empire.
As far as you would be concerned, as an imperial citizen, you'd have no debt. But the Fed would have bounties on you, and the bounty hunters would try to kill you and collect the bounty

You miss the point- it serves the Empires interests to keep you in dept killing Feds because you then become the ultimate disposable tool.

 

[CMDR Yates]

as a slave you would lose ALL your possessions, including ships, suits, weapons, etc.

Not possible in the sense of lore.

Not impossible. You could just be using suits, ships and tools provided by your "employer", and you'd be forced to work to a strict task-list, missing out on free-roaming gameplay.

 

[Rubbernuke]

This would be nice, but the majority wouldn't like it.
There are not many games where you are sent to prison for your crimes, even in Skyrim it was very easy to avoid or get out of prison.

Its why I said FD cultivated a game for grandads. Its far too easy to accrue wealth fast and legally. If crime paid but had harsh penalties you'd then create a need for ways to escape or mitigate that lifestyle- either through servitude, powerplay etc or simply being cunning.

 

[GroG79]

I like the idea of enrolling into (imperial) Slavery. Only thing standing in the way is credits are easy.. This would need a change to the core of the game

Flying a cutter/vette while being a slave would be weird

 

[Ski'Thor]

I like the idea of enrolling into (imperial) Slavery. Only thing standing in the way is credits are easy.. This would need a change to the core of the game

Flying a cutter/vette while being a slave would be weird

Well, there are many forms of slavery.
"Today a slave, tomorrow CEO again"

 

[CMDR Yates]

There's a potential dovetailing here where military service, security service, criminal sentences and imperial servitude could all be implemented using the same type of framework, as either a punishment, or willingly for those looking for a slightly more structured, goal-oriented, game-directed approach in the Elite galaxy.