While playing, I've noticed that for the most part, NPC's and their respective factions don't seem to have any sort of goals, resources or purposeful behavior behind them. You jump into a USS and there is a funeral procession, traveling at the snails pace of ~110m/s in the middle of nowhere, going nowhere, and for no reason. They're not actually moving to a destination, or trying to accomplish something of their own. They are simply placed there, purely for the players benefit. If the player did not arrive, and if the math did not work in such a way that it was decided that it would spawn their scenario, those NPC's may as well not exist.
Similarly, factions for the most part don't seem to exist independently of the player. For instance, this whole thing with Lugh. We take generic missions accompanied by stock text that, when completed, yields a screen with a blue upwardsy arrow signifying an increase in faction influence/reputation for the Crimson State, and a red frowny arrow for the Feds depending on which kind of mission it is. Repeat the action a few hundred times and voila, the quota has been met and a formally stable system has decided in the course of a few days that civil war is in order, down with the Federation bourgeois and in with the Crimson Whoever proletariat!
These factions have no personality, no human face, and the players actions thus far only serve to add to an invisible quota. Running guns to a faction, for instance, doesn't actually put guns in that factions hands, it just raises their influence by 0.01%, you could have been smuggling custard or anything else, it doesn't really matter. That's what I mean by how it feels so disconnected at the moment. There's no organic participation or witnessing of events for the player to care about, or to have chain reactions such as running guns, the rebels are better equipped for a better fight, the rebels thus win, and begin gaining ground etc. It's represented by a small % increase/decrease which, at a certain point, begins spawning conflict zones which are essentially just areas for typical mmo mobs to spawn in. There's never that big, exciting pivotal showdown between the Feds and the Crimson State.
So, I suppose what I was hoping for was something a bit more... organic, alive, and independent of the player. Something which could produce exciting, special events instead of spawning a randomly chosen scenario from a small pool of them.
Perhaps kind of like an A.I in a grand strategy game, managing its interests and dynamically forming alliances, breaking them, waging war, raising taxes, constructing fleets, pursuing resources, having limited resources in the first place, having a limited population, having varying government structures etc. which we as players could interact with meaningfully. In a way, I guess you could kind of think of it like an invisible game of CK2 dictating what happens.
In simple terms, the Crimson State and its power wouldn't just be represented by a simple percentage, but more like:
Persistent important faction NPCs/officials (structure changes depending on government type) which have their own duties, and if killed (they can only be killed once and it would be hard!) have significant effects:
-King Ted
-Viscount Bob
-Grand Treasurer Trevor
-Admiral Brody
-etc
Territory:
- "Knight Dock" - Lugh 5 - Wealthy, very large industrial station
- "Read Gateway" - Lugh 7 - Wealthy, very large industrial outpost
- "Seega Port" - Lugh 8 - Wealthy, very large industrial outpost
- "Maclean Hub" - Lugh 11 - Wealthy, industrial outpost
Population in controlled territory (a % can be potentially conscripted):
3 billion
Popular support:
32%
Daily/weekly/monthly revenue (through trading, mining, taxes etc):
2 billion credits
Daily/weekly/monthly expenditures (buying ships, repairs, payments etc):
1.3 billion credits
Treasury:
20 billion credits
Military Personel:
14 million
Space fleet:
-2 Dreadnaught/generic capital ship (STOLEN/CAPTURED)
-60 Anacondas
-23 Type 9 supply ships
-30 ASPs
-100 Cobras
-120 Vipers
-300 Eagles
-500 Sidewinders
-20 Federal Fighters (STOLEN/CAPTURED)
At which point the A.I would manage their resources as best as it can, allocate its military where it makes sense etc, similarly to how the A.I does it in certain strategy games. For obvious reasons, tracking each NPC individually would be a pain in the butt, but I think there are ways to make each NPC you kill/interact with have interesting effects on a broader scale.
Poorly thought out, but you probably get the gist of it. Anyway, with something vaguely along those lines, I think it would help mitigate that problems I've been having where it just feels like NPC's don't actually do anything or have a purpose, and how factions just seem to at this point be names that you complete missions for until 0% turns into 51%, spawning conflict zones until that faction is the new boss. It would make it so much more rewarding to destroy one of their small number of Anacondas, that doesn't just respawn, forcing them to spend either a ton of money, or to cope without it. It's just something I've been mulling over my head over gamma.
Is something like this already in the game, will it be, is it stupid and too complicated for what Elite is?
Additionally, some posts from the previous Gamma thread that I found helpful:
And
http://puu.sh/dv1pY/77477460eb.png
Similarly, factions for the most part don't seem to exist independently of the player. For instance, this whole thing with Lugh. We take generic missions accompanied by stock text that, when completed, yields a screen with a blue upwardsy arrow signifying an increase in faction influence/reputation for the Crimson State, and a red frowny arrow for the Feds depending on which kind of mission it is. Repeat the action a few hundred times and voila, the quota has been met and a formally stable system has decided in the course of a few days that civil war is in order, down with the Federation bourgeois and in with the Crimson Whoever proletariat!
These factions have no personality, no human face, and the players actions thus far only serve to add to an invisible quota. Running guns to a faction, for instance, doesn't actually put guns in that factions hands, it just raises their influence by 0.01%, you could have been smuggling custard or anything else, it doesn't really matter. That's what I mean by how it feels so disconnected at the moment. There's no organic participation or witnessing of events for the player to care about, or to have chain reactions such as running guns, the rebels are better equipped for a better fight, the rebels thus win, and begin gaining ground etc. It's represented by a small % increase/decrease which, at a certain point, begins spawning conflict zones which are essentially just areas for typical mmo mobs to spawn in. There's never that big, exciting pivotal showdown between the Feds and the Crimson State.
So, I suppose what I was hoping for was something a bit more... organic, alive, and independent of the player. Something which could produce exciting, special events instead of spawning a randomly chosen scenario from a small pool of them.
Perhaps kind of like an A.I in a grand strategy game, managing its interests and dynamically forming alliances, breaking them, waging war, raising taxes, constructing fleets, pursuing resources, having limited resources in the first place, having a limited population, having varying government structures etc. which we as players could interact with meaningfully. In a way, I guess you could kind of think of it like an invisible game of CK2 dictating what happens.
In simple terms, the Crimson State and its power wouldn't just be represented by a simple percentage, but more like:
Persistent important faction NPCs/officials (structure changes depending on government type) which have their own duties, and if killed (they can only be killed once and it would be hard!) have significant effects:
-King Ted
-Viscount Bob
-Grand Treasurer Trevor
-Admiral Brody
-etc
Territory:
- "Knight Dock" - Lugh 5 - Wealthy, very large industrial station
- "Read Gateway" - Lugh 7 - Wealthy, very large industrial outpost
- "Seega Port" - Lugh 8 - Wealthy, very large industrial outpost
- "Maclean Hub" - Lugh 11 - Wealthy, industrial outpost
Population in controlled territory (a % can be potentially conscripted):
3 billion
Popular support:
32%
Daily/weekly/monthly revenue (through trading, mining, taxes etc):
2 billion credits
Daily/weekly/monthly expenditures (buying ships, repairs, payments etc):
1.3 billion credits
Treasury:
20 billion credits
Military Personel:
14 million
Space fleet:
-2 Dreadnaught/generic capital ship (STOLEN/CAPTURED)
-60 Anacondas
-23 Type 9 supply ships
-30 ASPs
-100 Cobras
-120 Vipers
-300 Eagles
-500 Sidewinders
-20 Federal Fighters (STOLEN/CAPTURED)
At which point the A.I would manage their resources as best as it can, allocate its military where it makes sense etc, similarly to how the A.I does it in certain strategy games. For obvious reasons, tracking each NPC individually would be a pain in the butt, but I think there are ways to make each NPC you kill/interact with have interesting effects on a broader scale.
Poorly thought out, but you probably get the gist of it. Anyway, with something vaguely along those lines, I think it would help mitigate that problems I've been having where it just feels like NPC's don't actually do anything or have a purpose, and how factions just seem to at this point be names that you complete missions for until 0% turns into 51%, spawning conflict zones until that faction is the new boss. It would make it so much more rewarding to destroy one of their small number of Anacondas, that doesn't just respawn, forcing them to spend either a ton of money, or to cope without it. It's just something I've been mulling over my head over gamma.
Is something like this already in the game, will it be, is it stupid and too complicated for what Elite is?
Additionally, some posts from the previous Gamma thread that I found helpful:
And
http://puu.sh/dv1pY/77477460eb.png
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