Hardware & Technical So, the nV 20xx benchmarks are out and they are... disappointing.

Chris Simon

Chris Simon
Just went through the various hardware review channels and I have to say, although this is exactly what I was saying and expecting, I am still disappointed.

20xx care only about ray tracing. The thing is... there are and will be no games to take advantage of this for a very long time and even after there are, we saw the results in the keynote - 20-30FPS isn't enough for serious gaming.

And as far as rasterization goes, oh boy.
2080 is within +-10% from 1080Ti (yes it gets beaten by 1080Ti FE (!) in half of the games) for 100-200 bucks more (and if 1080Ti goes down, which it probably will, the difference will be more)
2080Ti is about 20% better than 1080Ti but at twice the price (or more)

The only big performance leap is under Vulcan, which doesn't mean anything, because nobody's using it.

So it seems we have a whole generation of nVidia cards that is completely pointless. It doesn't beat the previous generation at the same price point, and it cannot utilize its only strength, because once RT games are "a thing", it won't handle them well enough for them to be playable, and as it will probably take years for these games to be out, there will be a whole another gen of cards at that point, anyway.

This is a huge fail. Anyone sees it differently?
(apart from people who preordered it and now will have to come up with some apologetics, I mean)
 
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Chris Simon

Chris Simon
Robert Maynard said:
.... ah, but now that the green team cards can make use of it, Developers may have to implement it (if they want assistance from Nvidia) - which would be great for Team Red (as Vulkan is akin to Mantle, AMD's previous "closer-to-the-metal" Graphics API https://www.amd.com/en/technologies/vulkan).
Click to expand...

That might be true and there are other things that MAY improve 20xx standing in the future. We'll have to see.
But to be honest, nVidia going "full Apple" with this release... they really lost a lot of credit in my eyes.

I wish the Radeon division made some breakthrough and leveled the field a bit.
What AMD did for the CPU market in the last two years was incredible. If nVidia was in the same position Intel is, right now (losing the server sector, losing the entry-level sector and barely winning in the gaming sector, but with no bright future (they are stuck on 14nm technology and won't have more effective chips for years)) - if they had real competition, not just the previous generation of their own cards, things would be different.

I don't have any prefenences when comes to hardware. I am not "team blue, team green or team red", I am a simple mid-range consumer who likes cool stuff that isn't overpriced.
My current gaming rig is full AMD, though. I went with Ryzen because at my pricepoint (under 300 bucks) it makes more sense (for example I won't have to change the motherboard and RAM if I ever decide to upgrade, next year) and I just bought the RX 580 out of spite. :D :D

We'll see where this goes.
 
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GuruNot

GuruNot
Chris Simon said:
So it seems we have a whole generation of nVidia cards that is completely pointless. It doesn't beat the previous generation at the same price point, and it cannot utilize its only strength, because once RT games are "a thing", it won't handle them well enough for them to be playable, and as it will probably take years for these games to be out, there will be a whole another gen of cards at that point, anyway.
Click to expand...

That sums up things very well to be honest. People wont be happy about dropping from 1440p or 4k down to 1080p to play RTX enabled games at 30 fps .....

Been through a lot of the reviews on https://videocardz.com/78054/nvidia-geforce-rtx-2080-ti-rtx-2080-review-roundup and a lot mention the same points, yes the 2080ti is the fastest card available, but the price increase is disproportionate to the performance increase in that aspect. Yes DLSS and RTX may be fantastic, but at the moment there is nothing available to prove that.
 

Dural

Dural
Been waiting patiently for these results. All a bit meh.

That's a poor and rather disappointing price to performance ratio for gamers comparing a 1080ti to a 2080ti. They get only 20FPS extra at OOTB clock speeds.

Assuming these cards have been built geared towards specific business goals rather than just doing what they can with the technology available, they think they are going to be selling a lot of 2080tis to render farms, crypto farms and compute farms and maybe they will because those benchmarks are a long way in front of the 1080ti.

If these things were a LOT faster or a LOT less expensive they would make sense for gamers, they aren't either of those things.
 
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Chris Simon

Chris Simon
Dural said:
Been waiting patiently for these results. All a bit meh.

That's a poor and rather quite disappointing price to performance ratio for gamers comparing a 1080ti to a 2080ti. They get only 20FPS extra at OOTB clock speeds.

Assuming these cards have built these geared towards specific business goals rather than just doing what they can with the technology available, they think they are going to be selling a lot of 2080tis to render farms, crypto farms and compute farms and maybe they will because those benchmarks are a long way in front of the 1080ti.

If these things were a LOT faster or a LOT less expensive they would make sense for gamers, they aren't either of those things.
Click to expand...

Yes, of course 2080Ti is destroying synthetic benchmarks. So I guess it will find its customers on the farms. But yeah. This is just sad.
 

Morbad

Morbad
Disappointing, perhaps, but it shouldn't be surprising.

Anyway, who is this a fail for?

If you want best bang for the buck, buy a GTX 1080 Ti, other Pascal part, or even a discount Polaris. If you want the fastest there is, the RTX 2080 Ti is significantly faster than the Titan Xp at the same price as well as faster than the Titan V for less.

NVIDIA gets to be first to the DXR scene and sets the benchmark, which will likely force AMD and Intel to rush to get RT specific hardware on their parts sooner than they were planning. They also get to retain the performance crown and sell a bunch of expensive parts while they wait for 7nm production to ramp up.

I suppose it could be a fail for pre-orderers, but why anyone would pre-order a GPU and then be disappointed when it delivered exactly what they should have been expecting (you couldn't pre order them until a month ago and fairly accurate performances estimate have been around much longer than that) at a price they were apparently willing to pay.
 

Jon flint

Jon flint
The 2080ti is just a TitanV for 1/3 of the price, it beats a 1080ti by 20-50% but it costs about £100 more than I paid for my 1080ti back in January.

It's kind of what I expected though tbh. The 2080 being just a 1080ti replacement with rtx/dlss glued on and the 2080ti being a TitanV equivalent..

The real promising stuff for me, is DLSS. Having watched the recent digital foundry piece on the new tech, it seems really exciting. Granted, it's just fancy upscaling, but the gains are spectacular for minimal loss of quality. It may even be enough to enable RTX features at 4k and maintain 60fps (which i suspect was the intention in the 1st place). Playing at non-native resolutions may be a difficult pill for pc gamers to swallow, but if it's largely indistinguishable from native 4k and allows the use of new RTX features, then I'm all for it...

[video=youtube_share;MMbgvXde-YA]https://youtu.be/MMbgvXde-YA[/video]

+Despite the reviews and negative press, I'm still not cancelling my pre order for a 2080ti, I knew what I was getting into and still want the fastest available (mainstream) single card solution, which right now is the 2080ti.
 
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Deleted member 110222

D
Chris Simon said:
That might be true and there are other things that MAY improve 20xx standing in the future. We'll have to see.
But to be honest, nVidia going "full Apple" with this release... they really lost a lot of credit in my eyes.

I wish the Radeon division made some breakthrough and leveled the field a bit.
What AMD did for the CPU market in the last two years was incredible. If nVidia was in the same position Intel is, right now (losing the server sector, losing the entry-level sector and barely winning in the gaming sector, but with no bright future (they are stuck on 14nm technology and won't have more effective chips for years)) - if they had real competition, not just the previous generation of their own cards, things would be different.

I don't have any prefenences when comes to hardware. I am not "team blue, team green or team red", I am a simple mid-range consumer who likes cool stuff that isn't overpriced.
My current gaming rig is full AMD, though. I went with Ryzen because at my pricepoint (under 300 bucks) it makes more sense (for example I won't have to change the motherboard and RAM if I ever decide to upgrade, next year) and I just bought the RX 580 out of spite. :D :D

We'll see where this goes.
Click to expand...

I think you're right.

Still on my first rig, I'm not familiar with the AMD route. (Intel/NVIDIA here)

I might have to consider AMD next time.
 

Chris Simon

Chris Simon
Flimley said:
Many reviews all in one chart.


Flimley
Click to expand...

Ah, cool. I didn't think Jim will work that fast. :D
I'm looking forward to his analysis (like all before) though I suspect he will say the same thing. Although him being a tech enthusiast par excelence, I think he will see the 20xx gen as a sign of good future tech. :)
 

Chris Simon

Chris Simon
Jon flint said:
That's just how much they were in the UK at the time I was building my pc, anywhere from £920-£1100... thankyou very much crypto miners!
Click to expand...

Dude. I knew about ridiculous prices over the winter, but I didn't think they were THAT crazy. That sucks. :(
In that case, the 1100-1300 bucks for 2080Ti isn't that much of a leap, then.
I was comparing it to today's prices where you can find a 1080Ti around 500,-
 

ZeroAi

ZeroAi
Chris Simon said:
Just went through the various hardware review channels and I have to say, although this is exactly what I was saying and expecting, I am still disappointed.

20xx care only about ray tracing. The thing is... there are and will be no games to take advantage of this for a very long time and even after there are, we saw the results in the keynote - 20-30FPS isn't enough for serious gaming.

And as far as rasterization goes, oh boy.
2080 is within +-10% from 1080Ti (yes it gets beaten by 1080Ti FE (!) in half of the games) for 100-200 bucks more (and if 1080Ti goes down, which it probably will, the difference will be more)
2080Ti is about 20% better than 1080Ti but at twice the price (or more)

The only big performance leap is under Vulcan, which doesn't mean anything, because nobody's using it.

So it seems we have a whole generation of nVidia cards that is completely pointless. It doesn't beat the previous generation at the same price point, and it cannot utilize its only strength, because once RT games are "a thing", it won't handle them well enough for them to be playable, and as it will probably take years for these games to be out, there will be a whole another gen of cards at that point, anyway.

This is a huge fail. Anyone sees it differently?
(apart from people who preordered it and now will have to come up with some apologetics, I mean)
Click to expand...

+Rep

I hope this changes with updates to our favorites games :-(
 

Jon flint

Jon flint
Chris Simon said:
Dude. I knew about ridiculous prices over the winter, but I didn't think they were THAT crazy. That sucks. :(
In that case, the 1100-1300 bucks for 2080Ti isn't that much of a leap, then.
I was comparing it to today's prices where you can find a 1080Ti around 500,-
Click to expand...

Yeah, I probably am one of the few people who see the 20 series as a bit of a bargain based on prices we paid for 10 series..

Although i totally understand everyone else that paid the non-inflated prices will look at the cost of 20 series cards and quite rightly say "hell no!"
 

xondk

X
20xx series is definitely not as good a buy then previous generations, the leap is significantly smaller, however there is hope. Turing is quite different from previous generations, so maybe it will take time for the new architecture to get up to speed, this has been seen before, but yeah it is not a given that it will happen.

Personally I was looking at it, but am considering waiting for the die shrink.
 

Lucius-Darcia

Lucius-Darcia
Jon flint said:
That's just how much they were in the UK at the time I was building my pc, anywhere from £920-£1100... thankyou very much crypto miners!
Click to expand...

I'm expecting that cryptominers will go full on the 20xx series which will result in a slightly prise drop on the 1080ti.
So that's why i was waiting for the 20xx series: to get a realistic price range for the 1080ti :p
 

Lucius-Darcia

Lucius-Darcia
Chris Simon said:
Dude. I knew about ridiculous prices over the winter, but I didn't think they were THAT crazy. That sucks. :(
In that case, the 1100-1300 bucks for 2080Ti isn't that much of a leap, then.
I was comparing it to today's prices where you can find a 1080Ti around 500,-
Click to expand...

WHERE??!?:eek:

All i see is still between 800,- € and 1100,- € and the same in £
 
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