Something weird just happened in Kwazahui

[Sophokles Logimo]

So, until yesterday, the struggle for control of Kwazahui was a race between A. Duval and Winters. Slowly, Winters caught up, so it finally got into conflict state by Sunday afternoon, and the merit farming could begin.

You know, Power Conflict Zones where each NPC of a different power you make explode there gives you 170-350 merits.I haven't found any documentation on how they affect control score, but given that I have personally won a few battles for Winters there and it did basically nothing for her Power's Control Score (which grew at the same slow and steady pace as before), it can't be much. The galaxy map sais you have to do lots of boring stuff to increase that score, but individual players don't have much influence there, it seems.

But today I fly and finish two battles, and for some reason, the empress Arissa Lavigny-Duval is suddenly in the system with a control score higher than Winters! How did that happen? Is this just Imperials suddenly coming to the system in large numbers, or is this some mechanic that's not documented (or not known to me at least)? Or is there a bug happening?

 

[Rock Hunter]

From my limited experience it takes a very quiet system for an individual Cmdr to make a meaningful impact (alongside a lot of work,) add other Cmdrs to the mix and the control score can move surprisingly quickly.

It certainly sounds like you went up against some Imperial Cmdrs, if they’re in a PG or Solo you’ll never know they’re fighting against you until the control score begins to reflect that.*

*There may well be signs that an experienced PP’er can recognise to see that others are working against them other then the Control Score but if that’s the case I’m not experienced enough to recognise them.

 

[Sophokles Logimo]

I guess what I am really asking is: How many Impies must have shown up in the system to get their empress the second place in the race so suddenly? How are control scores really generated?

 

[Rock Hunter]

Did you know their control score numbers prior to this happening and those at the end? If so you could times that by four (four personal merits equalling one control point) and see what you think that would divide sensibly into as a guide to the number of Cmdrs that may have been present.

Of course, looking at the weekly scores I often wonder just how much time some have, and how efficient with that time some of these Cmdrs are to generate million merits or so in a week?!

Otherwise you need to put a call in for Ian Doncaster - if he doesn’t know he’ll no doubt have a good idea.

Edited for silly mistake in phrasing.

 

[Sophokles Logimo]

Four personal merits are one control point? Are you sure? That would be cool to know. Because if it is really just "win merits", then the map's recommendations are utterly misleading.

Well, Arissa wasn't even listed in the system yesterday, so 0. Today, about now, it is 178,318, catching up to her niece's 185,319, with the only good guy faction in the game having a mere 92058.

 

[Rock Hunter]

I asked that very question in this sub forum just the other day - Personal merits per control point - thread

It seems to be the accepted number from observations so far. Though, for clarity, note that post #6 points out correctly that the merits awarded for completing weekly tasks don’t count toward control points, though some of those tasks may lead to gaining merits that work towards CP points (the mega ship scans are a very good example of this…again, in post #6.)

Looking at those numbers I wouldn’t be too surprised if an organised squadron/group (or two) came in and spent the day/evening plugging away.

I’ve just helped push a system into Stronghold in a very quiet and uncontested area of the Galaxy alongside a local group with around 15 members. Previously I’d pushed another system into Fortified by myself and it’s quite astonishing the difference a well organised group can make.

Hands up here though, I’m not offering stats that back all this up and don’t follow any data enough to know for sure this is all as it should, or could, be…just commenting from my observations.

 

[Hugh Jardon]

I guess what I am really asking is: How many Impies must have shown up in the system to get their empress the second place in the race so suddenly? How are control scores really generated?

I haven't looked recently, but there used to be Reddit threads, where some self-appointed generals planned it all out, then told their members where to fight - what targets needed to be reinforced and which ones taken over, so you'd get 100s of commanders all in their own instances doing the same thing. Does anybody know if that still goes on?

 

[nemolomen]

I asked that very question in this sub forum just the other day - Personal merits per control point - thread

It seems to be the accepted number from observations so far. Though, for clarity, note that post #6 points out correctly that the merits awarded for completing weekly tasks don’t count toward control points, though some of those tasks may lead to gaining merits that work towards CP points (the mega ship scans are a very good example of this…again, in post #6.)

One, or two, additional things I should mention about my example in that post regarding the Megaship Scans, each megaship can only be scanned one time every fortnight (two weeks), and they move.

 

[serakfalcon]

Two things, as basically the same thing happened with AD vs Archer. First, ALD, Archer, Yuri and other combat powers get more merits for combat. Typically 50% more though AD PVP team thinks it can go up to 100% based on their interactions with Archer commanders.

Second, the most efficient way to do any combat merit activity is in a wing. A properly disciplined wing of 4 is making 4x the merits with 4x the dps. This, combined with the combat bonuses ends up being a very efficient merit farm activity so any contested system seems to quickly attract disorganized merit farmers. I'm not sure what the score was but a single wing will be something like 30-50k control score/hour per wing, only ODY tourist settlement raids come close.

Imo without further balancing any non-combat power has no chance of winning a contested acquisition with a combat power where there are active power cz and/or bounty hunting scenarios.

 

[nemolomen]

I haven't looked recently, but there used to be Reddit threads, where some self-appointed generals planned it all out, then told their members where to fight - what targets needed to be reinforced and which ones taken over, so you'd get 100s of commanders all in their own instances doing the same thing. Does anybody know if that still goes on?

Oh, probably. But as some other recent posts here indicate, PP 2.0 is apparently a much more decentralized game on a strategic level, meaning different commanders or groups can focus on their own stuff and still make gains for the Power, or something along those lines....

 

[Sophokles Logimo]

Two things, as basically the same thing happened with AD vs Archer. First, ALD, Archer, Yuri and other combat powers get more merits for combat. Typically 50% more though AD PVP team thinks it can go up to 100% based on their interactions with Archer commanders.

But does this affect control score, or just the players' ranks, which will only have light influence once most of those pledged to the powers are on rank 100+?

Good point regarding the organization, everyone. I guess I should find myself a Winters squadron that actually wants to win.

 

[Purrfect]

Merits are awarded that give you more rank. That's great. 1 CP = 4 merits, unless for exploration / exobiology, where it's 1 CP = 6 merits. So if you earn 20k merits at Power CZs, you are adding 5 kCP to the acquisition score. Power CZs are some of the fastest merit earners in the game, so you're doing the right thing, but there's just not enough of you.

What's happened is that the opposition Power Discord has woken up and they are doing stuff in the system now. You should join your preferred power's Discord so you can be as impactful as they are being.

Winging up with 3 other Cmdrs is highly recommended. Three or four wings will make a real difference. A single Cmdr, not so much. That's why although the new system is decentralized (see Kumo splitting into two), the reality is that the tank rush of a major Power's Discord will still move the needle a lot more than a single Cmdr.

 

[serakfalcon]

But does this affect control score, or just the players' ranks, which will only have light influence once most of those pledged to the powers are on rank 100+?

Merits move player ranks and 1/4 of the merits move the control score. All the heavy hitters on my Power's discord are well on their way to 2 million merits or more, the rank 100 plus is a long way in the past, but we aren't playing for that. I acquired 75% of a system myself this week and teammates finished off the rest.

Net net, while you don't need to be organized to do PP2.0 the organized groups are pouring millions of merits into their objectives so you either have to join up or expect to be outnumbered. Of course there's a cross section of squadrons, PMFs etc that adds another dimension of politics to things (it may be a waste of time for a Winters pledge to attempt to expand into an area where an Imperial PMF has claimed as their home, or vice versa Empire moving into a Fed PMF space).

Or you know, if your area of space is going to belong to ALD or AD maybe you should consider switching sides

 

[Sophokles Logimo]

[...]

Or you know, if your area of space is going to belong to ALD or AD maybe you should consider switching sides

I have a carrier, I just move where Winters needs me.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Four personal merits are one control point? Are you sure? That would be cool to know. Because if it is really just "win merits", then the map's recommendations are utterly misleading.

Well, Arissa wasn't even listed in the system yesterday, so 0. Today, about now, it is 178,318, catching up to her niece's 185,319, with the only good guy faction in the game having a mere 92058.

The map only lists the top two sides in the Acquisition, plus your own if you're not in the top two - so it's possible that yesterday ALD's score was just a couple of points behind yours but they pulled ahead today. Genuine three-way fights are fairly rare so it perhaps makes sense that not everything is listed.

Because if it is really just "win merits", then the map's recommendations are utterly misleading.

The map recommends the activities you'll get a 50% Power bonus for doing - which, all else equal and all activities perfectly balanced, would be the most effective ones. As it works out, an inefficient activity with a 50% bonus is still worse than an efficient activity without it, though hopefully at least some of that will be balanced better over time.

Imo without further balancing any non-combat power has no chance of winning a contested acquisition with a combat power where there are active power cz

I'm fairly sure all powers get "power CZ" as a preferred activity in Acquisition Conflicts - though of course a Power generally focused around combat might have more people set up to make use of that bonus.

 

[serakfalcon]

I'm fairly sure all powers get "power CZ" as a preferred activity in Acquisition Conflicts - though of course a Power generally focused around combat might have more people set up to make use of that bonus.

Except, that's not the case, non-combat powers do not get that bonus, they get other bonuses of which the most farmable are completely disabled, hence my relatively continual complaints about it.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Except, that's not the case, non-combat powers do not get that bonus

Interesting - I'll need to recheck what Kaine gets for those.

 

[Markov Chaney]

Though, for clarity, note that post #6 points out correctly that the merits awarded for completing weekly tasks don’t count toward control points, though some of those tasks may lead to gaining merits that work towards CP points (the mega ship scans are a very good example of this…again, in post #6.)

"Hey Commander, we would like you to do this thing and we will reward you accordingly with rank, even though this thing is no use to us in the larger context and it's quite likely we've sent you to the wrong system so you can't hand anything in anyway." What a splendid piece of story design and implementation.

 

[Rebel Yell]

"Hey Commander, we would like you to do this thing and we will reward you accordingly with rank, even though this thing is no use to us in the larger context and it's quite likely we've sent you to the wrong system so you can't hand anything in anyway." What a splendid piece of story design and implementation.

That's why I also stopped doing weeklies unless are tremendoustly easy (like scan ships).

Merit (and then CP) "bombs" are a thing in the current framework, where during an acquisition the powerplay CZs are only one of the potential source of merits for both sides.Unfortunately some balance is still needed (I believe that supercruise drop in/drop out spawns are too random and poor atm) and we do need to have some activities (like rare commodity trading and escape pods) restored.

 

[Rebel Yell]

I haven't looked recently, but there used to be Reddit threads, where some self-appointed generals planned it all out, then told their members where to fight - what targets needed to be reinforced and which ones taken over, so you'd get 100s of commanders all in their own instances doing the same thing. Does anybody know if that still goes on?

We're doing it for Archon Delaine, there are also other redditors active... I've made a public feed for that but may be I can miss some if more subs are set (i.e. there are 2 for Delaine). Sorry for cr4p link but I'm on mobile:

https://www.reddit.com/user/82nd_rebel/m/powerplay_20/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share