"Space Legs" Or planetary exploration on a budget

[Ponial]

This is basiacly my vision on it would be logical to implement space legs to ED

As anyone, I'd love to be able to finaly lift my "space butt" and actualy look around my ship, walk up to a window, etc.
Seems borring right? Still this would make proably 1 of the features that alot of playes wanted, to feel the scale of their ships from the inside, but I belive, this should be pushed forward.

Lets imagine, you encounter a planet that you want to land on and walk around, but you don't have or lost an srv. End of a exploration for you? I don't think so.
Our commander lifts up, walks up to a console behind him, and select items needed for him on the planet surface, plasma cutter pistol, synthesis tool, scaner, maybe even a jetpack for the hell of it. Here is the first thing I belive will be important for "Space legs" - possible survival on a planet and tools for it(we already have it in SRV so no need to yell any space survival game here).
Back to our commander. A basic kit is all we have(maybe there are more loadout option out there, yet we don't have them, as an example, anti drone weapon, a guardian probulator etc...)
We walk up to the door behind us, press a button, and we are outside, standing on a ramp of our ship, with a helmet on our head(linked to our life supprot?) ready for a little adventure. Here, we will finaly see the scale of our ships, be able to finaly feel how big it is, see all the details.
and again, something like this, will help planetary exploration, excluding the need for an srv, while still providint it with a utility of better surface exploration capabilities.

But yet again, there are bigger ships that can, well, lack the required space for landing, but we have and SLF. Why can't we board it, and use as a shutle, with "space legs" I belive we should.
Yet again, why explore on legs, what danger can it provide? I think its simpe, death. No, no permadeath! Just will have to spawn at a medical facility, and pay for ships recovery(or maybe go fetch it yourself).

An implementation like this, would lay in a nice start for future of such content.
This is how I see the matter of space legs, yup it will feel and maybe look like a feature from other games, but again, its the enviroment that matters.

 

[LanceLord]

Got ripped on posting this in the wrong forum section. So adding my 2 credits on this by direct cut and paste here. Even if being able to exit the spaceship in a space suit isn't feasible, it should be possible to walk around in your cockpit. It's the smallest life support area on your ship regardless of the ship size. And just like an earth trucker, pilot should have living quarters in their cockpit. Seeing how the vanilla game has constrained you 100% of the time to this area (minus being in a SRV).

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Obsidian Ant made some excellent observations for the pros/cons of space legs in the video. I wasn't aware the dev appeared to have been originally in favor of this, but ditched it for logical technical/performance reasons.

HOWEVER

There IS a possibility for space legs if it's restricted to INSIDE the player's ship based on the following facts/logic:

0. Elite Dangerous = EuroTruck Simulator 2 in space. Give or take dash of Privateer/Freelancer and a good seasoning rub of Civilization/Anno Domini (for the political space drama which manifests as ED politics & Power Play features)

This piece of blasphemy ideology pontificated:

1. Regardless of ship size, it's a fact some 95% of space ship capacity by design is reserved for cargo and/or hauling passengers based on your load out. Why?

2. ELITE DANGEROUS IS A SPACE SIM GAME ABOUT SPACE LOGISTICS AND/OR EXPLORATION. With some economic sandbox features (mining etc.) and PvP ganking (consensual or otherwise) in between. So by default of this inherent design, Elite Dangerous = EuroTruck Simulator 2 in space. This means...

3. YOU AS THE PLAYER ARE A PROFESSIONAL SPACE TRUCKER. Not a "pilot" as you're being led to believe, BUT A SPACE TRUCKER (with deadly hard point ePeen to boot). And unless you're carrying a backup smaller space craft or SRV on your ship, then you NEVER leave your "pilot" seat.

#3 is the foundation of my premise of ED being a space EuroTruck Simulator. Just like a terran bound 18 wheeler trucker, you Cmdr rarely get the opportunity to leave your seat. But unlike the terran bound 18 wheeler trucker, YOU NEVER HAVE A PLACE TO SLEEP. If a primitive 18 wheeler truck can include a sleep space (with electric ports to plug in appliances like a small fridge, TV etc) then why can't a futuristic space ship provide these amenities? From a 1st person POV that is.

So basically space legs could work like this. The cockpit is augmented with several new & interactive features (all experienced from 1st POV):

Add a small bed alcove which serves as a save/logout feature regardless of where the player is in space. This would really benefit deep space explorations if a player is LY from the nearest docking station and/or just wants to log off. This feature would work the way Star Citizen designs the player's log on/off mechanic by waking up/going to sleep on their spacecraft but always in first person.

• Upon log off, player is able to stand up in the cockpit, and walk to their small bunk/cot alcove (located immediately behind the pilot's chair). Then can lie down to get the option to log out. Their spacecraft is stored at that point in space.
• Upon log in, player can sit/stand up to exist their bunk. They don't need to see their feet like in SC. Just have the ability to sit up/get up in first person and leave the bed/saving zone.

Player can then walk to their pilot seat to pick up where they left off playing the game as a paraplegic from their pilot seat.

OR another use for space legs:

Player could walk short distance to a ship storage panel to manually retrieve food/liquids/chems from storage. Then sit in their pilot chair, press a button to initiate food/chems consumption. These food buff performance items would only cost the player credits/storage space and not energy. With an additional disadvantage of spoilage over time. Alternatively, player could eliminate the storage/spoilage penalty. Simply just replicate food/liquids at a separate computer panel via a costly replicator module. This grants an indefinite food/liquid shelf life with superior boosts at no storage capacity. But at the cost of additional energy management from ship resources.

Both food/chems storage and replicator module panels would give players performance boosts. Like eating bowl of stew, drinking hot steaming cup of coffee/other liquids. But again, this replication tech costs energy and credits. So even if player has credits and bought said liquids, they can't replicate it unless their spacecraft has enough excess energy (or they optimize it to do so). This is a limited storage capacity of resources the player needs to buy when at docking stations. Then sit in their chair and consume the food for temporary health buffs. Why? These health buffs function as a player or ship based buffs.

When used as a ship buff, these health buffs provide a limited boot to ship performance How? This player health translates into better player mental acuity, endurance/constitution and reaction time so the player utilizes/operates the ship's resources more efficiently. So these ship boosts are directly manifested as temporarily boosts to one of the ships SYS/ENG/WEP by a minor percentage over a limited time. For example:

• drinking coffee/caffeine improves and enhances the ship's WEP from enhanced player reflexes. Good advantage in all PvE & PvP combat maneuvers
• drinking water/eating chems increases the ship's "perception" via scanning mode capabilities. Ship has better scanning capability for a limited amount of time. Works best with mining ice planets
• drinking other fluids besides coffee/water improves the ship's SYS via shields e.g. by 1% for several game minutes. Good advantage in dog fights and self defensive maneuvers
• eating food extends the ship ENG performance from an endurance and constitution perspective

When used as a player buff, these health aids are held in reserve and not activated until a player's ship or SRV becomes damaged/inoperable. When the player is stuck in orbit in space/on a planet and loses all life support from their spaceship/SRV vehicle, these health buffs extend the player's oxygen capacity timer. Possibly increasing their chance for survival for half hour to hour to give first responders time to help them.

OR another use for space legs:

player could walk short distance to a ship panel functions as their closet. Items the player has bought at stations such as exoskeleton armor of varying types, O2 tanks, med kits aid etc. are stored here. If player opts to wear a space suit, this clothing feature extends their ability for survival if they lose life support on their spacecraft/SRV.

1. If stranded in their ship with no life support in space near an orbiting space station, then the player could

2. If stranded in their ship with no life support in orbit of a planet with a known planetary based station, the player could use their spacesuit to buy time. Extend their life support while waiting for the contacted planet based station to teleport them into the docking bay. If player manages to survive the time it takes for this resource to occur, they see a loading screen and then find themselves safely inside the docking bay area.

3. If stranded in their SRV with no life support, space suit would allow them to exit their vehicle. Give them a limited amount of oxygen in which they can try to walk to the planet based station. Interact with the station to access the NPC by an external terminal panel to request permission to enter. After a load screen, player is sitting inside a passenger lounge area where they wait until their rescued SRV and/or ship is repaired at that station for a hefty fee. Or until other first Responder players like the Fuel Rats etc. extract or rescue them. Or upon reaching the station, interact with a NPC menu panel to contact the station NPC authorities and request their stranded SRV/orbiting ship is teleported into the station for repairs. This could be one way to save on the insurance re-buy costs.

BTW: these new features wouldn't touch the existing intricate layered menu system from the pilot's seat. Rather it would seek to enhance the extent of information you can already access from the pilot seat with a space legs feature like this. If your space craft is stranded (and say you have no back up ship in the hold), you could use the existing comm panel menus to contact the NPC station authorities by a distress signal. Then once the authorities are notified, they will tell you how long it will take to recover (i.e. teleport your ship in orbit). You could then use this time to leave your pilot seat, walk to the closet and access your space suit. Take whatever necessary health aides from storage to add to your inventory to extend your survival chances while waiting rescue.

If you didn't prepare sufficiently ahead of time i.e. buy a spacesuit, health aides etc. then you die and have to resort to using your insurance to rebuy a new space ship. So space leg feature would give the player an alternative immersive workaround to saving on rebuy insurance cost (by giving them the alternative optional penalty of a smaller O&M/repair bill v. entire rebuy ship cost)

Cmdr Obsidian Ant's had some interesting oversight on the dev's decision against space legs here. But I still think it's possible to implement this feature. Especially if it's constrained to the cockpit of the player's ship

[video=youtube;wkFwsiPHeR4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkFwsiPHeR4[/video]

 

[LanceLord]

Glad to see at least one other person who believes in the small details where space legs are concenred.

It's inconceivable to me why the game constrains Cmders to existing in their cockpits some 99% of the time (1% or so to SRV vehicle). Yet ZERO functional details of living accommodation exist? This is the one aspect of space wayfaring that Star Citizen gets down 100%.

I agree at least two features need to be added to the cockpit:

1. A bunk -- gives players a saving point regardless of where they are in space. As long as you're not under attack/interdiction or in an active war zone region of space, you should be able to get up from your chair, walk several steps to your bunk, lie down and then get the option to save/exit the game.

2. Intuitive closet AND chest storage -- gives player intuitive storage space in form of visually customized panels (for easy identification). Both of these have different functionalities.

(a) The closet is just an artistic representation of a gear load out i.e. clothing/armor/space suit storage for the player. Looks like a locker and gives player a dozen or so storage slots to place space suits & gear like helmets, gloves, boots and reserve. Hell even regular civilian clothing for the RPG factor. If you're wearing regular clothing (while communicating with NPCs in your pilot chair, that could influence their demeanor to like you (you've impressed them). Or mistrust/fear you (if say, you're wearing a spacesuit with the most a class advanced tactical modules/gear etc).

OTOH: If you wear nothing except your underwear, expect the NPC station threat to fine you for public indecency. Or prepared to be blasted from orbit as a sexual deviant for your moral delinquency. Lots of new game play options for players seeking to curry favor with a faction and/or improve their position in Power Play scenarios etc.

(b) The chest is simply customized storage the player can designate for weapons, items/resources they collect by manually walking/exploration on planets, food, medicine/chems/health aids, water, non aqueous fluids (like booze). These containers can be distributed around the cockpit on wall panels depending on the size of the cockpit (which varies with spaceship class and type). They are modules you buy at space port (or even at engineers) that once you add to your ship, the module appears on a cockpit wall panel. So if you buy and install a

(i) regular storage chest: you'll see a storage trunk. Interacting to open this lets you place whatever resources/items you collected while exploring on foot on a planet. Or from walking to a space station and interacting with the NPC panel there to buy goods.
(ii) closet panel: you'll see a locker styled panel. Interacting to open this lets you place/retrieve your space suits, and other gear you wear like a space helm, boots etc. You buy all this gear when at space stations
(iii) food panel : this can be physical storage or a more expensive replicator. As I explained in the other post, replicators never spoil food or require storage. They're the superior storage option at cost more credits and energy. The cheap storage option is manual for n00b Cmders who're broke. You buy food staples and place into these overhead storage panels. Retrieve them into your player inventory when you need to eat/get buff. Cheaper at zero energy cost. But at expense of limited storage space and food spoilage/shorter shelf life.
(iv) water tank : works like food storage or replicator. But has indefinite storage life.
(v) non aqueous liquids: identical to water except you don't get water buffs from consumption but other ones.
(vi) med/chems panel : you'll see a new panel in your cockpit you can interact with that opens a storage window. This lets player store their health aids in this panel. Which they'll need if they become injured/incapacitated on a planetary excursion while on foot.

#1 is VERY helpful for those deep space farers on exploration/mining runs who're too tired (physically irl) to continue playing the game. Or need to quit ED for whatever irl reasons and don't have a space port/station in the near vicinity to hyper jump to. This lets Cmdrs simply pick up where they left off on their journey/adventure upon subsequent login.

#2 is both for PvP tactical and PvE RPGing reasons. (for reasons/benefits, see my original post above)

Disclaimer: Possible The Sims 3 detail that would likely never be considered:
The food/water/liquids storage let's player bring a filled food bowl/mug with them to their pilot chair. Player can consume the food (again first person) while sitting in their pilot chair. Similar to way it works in Fallout 4, RDR2, or Star Citizen. Being able to put your coffee mug on command panel would be icing on the cake. lol

 

[Ponial]

After reading both of your replies, and giving it some thouhts, my original reply was scraped(should it be interesting, will post(mostly some arguing on the mater of space truks)).
I can say, the way you suggest it, should it be implemented will be nice foundation and a testing ground for possible development of such a feature, up and beyond what I originaly thought of.

About the bunk save. Amm, as an RP - fully agree, yes! But as a feature on a whole...Isn't it already in the game? whenever I log in, im still in my ship where it was, asteroid field or empy region of space.
Don't see much of a point for it outside of RP. For singlplayer games it makes sense to have this level of detail, but for a multiplayer, abit too much. Plus, if you log out, you will be where you were, your ship will be there, and I belive this is the problem for "CombatLogging". Now as a potential fix for it, possible.

Yet, I think that food/water related aspects, are abit too much, as of now, we can "exist" on our ships withought those just fine, and introducing something like it, will make some players panic.
As in they will have to worry about even more aspects of deep space travel, unless it's threre to provide some form of immersion, still on this matter I belive it should be like in Skyrim - there, but you don't have to use it.

To add to my original post, was going to make it bigger, with a possible roadmap for "Leg Day" (Space legs release day):
1)"Lift your up initiative" - finaly the chance to explore the cockpit of a ship
2)"Time to walk" - land on current planets to explore with your two(why this when we have SRV? Simple, new perspective, and no need to bring an SRV bay)
3)"I wonder what that ships/station interior looks like" - selfexplanatory, ships and stations interior, nothing major, just a relatively resonable space(interior baseplate with RNG to fill in the little details for each stations to look different)
4) Finaly - additional content, see what players want, like/disslike about this feature, add on top of it. Possibly add guardian dungeons?(they already look like there is something inside of some of them).


Once again, it is simply the way I see the future of a feature with its development. And the roadmap above? Basicaly the way I would work on its development(a developer myself(Banking)).

P.S. the coffe on the command panel - LOL, mug holders will finaly have a use xD

 

[LanceLord]

Can't believe you actually survived reading that wall of text.

Food/water come in as emergency health backup supplies for those ridiculously impossible SRV sabotage missions where you destroy power grids/do illegal data uplinks etc in another region. These missions always carry a KOS sort of bounty by authorities in that sector. So if you're attacked, eating/drinking would be a good way to survive/evade while under attack. And while hauling your wanted @ss back in your SRV to your ship.

Same for ability to buy upgraded space suits. Which are just a temporary boost of your existing ship life support feature to yourself while outside the ship/SRV. Say it boosts life support by 5%. So if you're attacked on foot/inside the SRV or even in the ship, once that 105% drops to zero, you're at the rebuy screen.


1)"Lift your up initiative" - finaly the chance to explore the cockpit of a ship <---Yep.

2)"Time to walk" - land on current planets to explore with your two(why this when we have SRV? Simple, new perspective, and no need to bring an SRV bay) <-- Yep. Because hemorrhoids are really really bad for your health. Besides, if Subnautica, NMS and pre alpha vaporware like SC can do this (especially where use of hand held/1st POV tools are concerned) then it is a possibility for ED.

3)"I wonder what that ships/station interior looks like" - selfexplanatory, ships and stations interior, nothing major, just a relatively resonable space(interior baseplate with RNG to fill in the little details for each stations to look different) <-- Yep. Much the way they've made several changes to interiors of space stations based on population's economic status and main source of trade. Like the rich/tourist type economy space hubs have lush green gardens in them. The interior of the space dock for industrial hubs look like the first Corilois hub you first encounter in your starter ship etc.

The only difference this time is allowing you to getup from your seat, exit the cockpit to trigger a loading screen. Then you're teleported into an isolated interior cell/server that is separate from the existing ED servers. Be able to interact with NPCs and access all the amenities the Galaxy map lists at these space stations. Again, this is the one aspect games like X4 and SC get 100% right. Space Engineers nails the whole astronaut/space farer vibe 100%.

Here's some of the great emergent gameplay adding sandbox features like Space Engineers could do for ED. Physically let players support/competitively build in teams the CG in DW2 and other projects. All these new animations would work well with existing sabotage missions we currently do using SRV on planets as well.

How space legs could become a CG (competitively in build teams or part of a wing expedition against other Cmder factions/NPCs in missions). Note the sabotage mission the engineering team performs in this video. Very similar to the SRV planetary faction missions:

[video=youtube;dVPbVBLRBrY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVPbVBLRBrY[/video]


You can sandbox buidling your space hub/station/dock design by yourself in Solo or with friends in PG mode:

[video=youtube;HZMxgfSa_Rc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZMxgfSa_Rc[/video]



A Rust style sandbox mission survival scenarios again in Solo, PG or Open
[video=youtube;4sFK3xJAF9I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sFK3xJAF9I[/video]