Starting to lose faith in this free-to-kill model

[drkaii]

Initially I liked it, my first pirate experience is documented and it went well, even though I was murdered for my hard-earned rare cargo. Either way, it was a positive experience because the pirate spoke to me, gave me a way out and I know him really well now and I know he would have kept to it. I like that, and I know why Frontier have deliberately allowed this form of play.

But it's devolving into something disgusting at the moment. People who spend their time looking for people to kill, no outs, no reasons, no communication of any kind. I guess these are the "griefers" that everyone is talking about. Well count me in on this anti-griefer campaign. This doesn't add anything to the game, except maybe something akin to ACTUAL crime.

Us explorers have it among the worst. Lembava is one. Yesterday my mate was just out of the bubble heading to me and as he entered the system, two FDLs simply destroyed him, for no reason.

I understand that in real life that kinda makes sense - there could be a pirate base there or something. But this isn't real life, and there currently aren't any ways to build pirate bases.These were just two jerks who happened to either be staking out to kill explorers for some disgusting cowardly reason, or they happened to run into him, and again, killed him for some disgustingly cowardly reason.

Why would we want to encourage people to go and kill those weaker? Not only is it bad for the weaker ones, but it's bad for the killers. There's a code in real life - be a good sport, don't be a coward, don't abuse others, be a man - and that code has been deliberately left out of this game by Frontier in their "we condone any type of play except cheating" attitude.

Ok rant over. I think I'll join mobius.

 

[Alex Brentnall]

I agree, In my honest opinion it comes down to the fact that its a game and supposed to be fun. If 10 players ruin the experience for 10,000 then it should be obvious who is not in the spirit of the thing. As it stands right now no shame in going solo to hand in weeks/months of exploration, its just sensible.

Whilst it's a "legitimate" game style and not against the rules it's not something that should be condoned in any way, imo killing un-armed vessels and new players in sidewinders should be given a much bigger penalty than the paltry bounty system atm. They should be hounded by Elite security Anacondas and Vultures

 

[bitstorm]

Us explorers have it among the worst. Lembava is one. Yesterday my mate was just out of the bubble heading to me and as he entered the system, two FDLs simply destroyed him, for no reason.

I understand that in real life that kinda makes sense - there could be a pirate base there or something. But this isn't real life, and there currently aren't any ways to build pirate bases.These were just two jerks who happened to either be staking out to kill explorers for some disgusting cowardly reason, or they happened to run into him, and again, killed him for some disgustingly cowardly reason.

Isn't Lembava the headquarters of Li Yong-Rui? There's one reason non aligned players may be attacked.

Also Lembava currently has a community goal on for exploration, there's another reason.

In my case I've just come back from exploring and am currently in the top 5% for the community goal, this will net me a nice monetary reward if I stay there.

Is it in my interest to intercept any and all ships entering Lembava for the next few days? If I decide to do that is it "griefing" or "gaming"?

 

[Allitnil]

Is it in my interest to intercept any and all ships entering Lembava for the next few days? If I decide to do that is it "griefing" or "gaming"?

It would only be in your interests if you believed that they were going to end up with more reports than you. Your best tactic would probably be to defend the explorers as the more of them that take part, the greater the number of CMDRs who will be in the top 5%.

The "gaming" / "griefing" distinction is a bit pointless IMO. If you enjoy the game and expect to want to continue playing it for some time then you should avoid doing anything that might encourage others to stop playing / not buy future expansions etc.

 

[Decado]

If the crime/bounty was put on the person and not the ship - that would help surely. Death shouldnt be a way out of paying a fine

But something as simple as just buying a cheap sidewinder and letting yourself be destroyed removing the bounty thats a rookie mistake by Frontier Developments. Baffles me why this isnt patched out!

 

[Lazerus Artificial]

If the crime/bounty was put on the person and not the ship - that would help surely. Death shouldnt be a way out of paying a fine

But something as simple as just buying a cheap sidewinder and letting yourself be destroyed removing the bounty thats a rookie mistake by Frontier Developments. Baffles me why this isnt patched out!

this and it would be way better if you couldnt "exploit" your way out of a bounty.
just destroy your sidewinder - done.

bounty should scale with the lost ship, so if a pirate destroys a type 9, he would get a higher bounty than what he would get for a sidewinder.
if the type 9 then has cargo, the bounty would be even higher. same for exploration data and those things.

and if then the lost-bounty would also scale with the pirates ship, then we could call it a decent bounty system.
destroy a 10M bounty pirate while he flies a sidewinder would only award you the price scaled on exactly that ship (like 10% of the rebuy value or so), while that amount is substracted from his bounty pool.
if you destroy him in his anaconda, then you would get a lot more out of him, while he looses also a lot more from his pool.

it would finally make bounty a "penalty" and not a "i will just avoid that system for a week" system.

 

[CMDR_UKmouse]

I returned to Lembava after about 2 months in the black.
I was ashamed to do it, but around 800ly out I changed to 'Solo'.
Too much to risk for the sake of a couple of idiots spoiling the game for many others.
I'm now speed honking to up my CG submissions, again playing in 'Solo'.
Once the CG ends on 2nd July, I'll be back to 'Online'.

 

[bitstorm]

It would only be in your interests if you believed that they were going to end up with more reports than you. Your best tactic would probably be to defend the explorers as the more of them that take part, the greater the number of CMDRs who will be in the top 5%.

Ha! Aye you may be onto something there. Then again the value is additive, if commanders could only visit once perhaps defending would more likely be the best option.

I do think there'll be a last minute surge, in last few days there's gonna be lots of top 5%ers coming in.

 

[bitstorm]

If the crime/bounty was put on the person and not the ship - that would help surely. Death shouldnt be a way out of paying a fine

But something as simple as just buying a cheap sidewinder and letting yourself be destroyed removing the bounty thats a rookie mistake by Frontier Developments. Baffles me why this isnt patched out!

I thought this was a great idea...

Eve apparently allows pilots to take implants, reason being there's then which are lost on death, meaning there's then a cost to dying.

Go self-destruct in a Sidewinder and all those lovely implants are lost. I really like that mechanism.

As you say, I think Frontier need to be tying some things to the pilot and not just the ship.

 

[certhas]

this and it would be way better if you couldnt "exploit" your way out of a bounty.
just destroy your sidewinder - done.

? you lose the bounty on your head at death? thats really stupid.

Imo the penalty for killing clean targets really is waaaay to less. I mean elite is simulating human empires in a huge galaxy, they should apply some strict rules for murdering, like all factions of a system getting hostile towards the murderer (not able to land anymore - stations immediately open fire if you enter their fire range) and a really big bounty on our head (which you cant loose by death - really stupid mechanic).

 

[Traveller_GG]

Bounty stays on person not ship and is increased exponentially. Along with people who talk in cinemas and those who can't spell 'lose'

At the moment the risk / reward is totally unbalanced and makes the game too dangerous for the law-abiding

 

[Andrew Gaspurr]

As long as it's mandatory to return home and sell one's exploration data to StelCart personally I will fly in a PVE Private Group or even Solo. I don't see any reason to expose myself to some jackasses prowling for some of those "exploration carebears". Not going to happen...

 

[CMDR DoubleSkulls]

I returned to Lembava after about 2 months in the black.
I was ashamed to do it, but around 800ly out I changed to 'Solo'.
Too much to risk for the sake of a couple of idiots spoiling the game for many others.
I'm now speed honking to up my CG submissions, again playing in 'Solo'.
Once the CG ends on 2nd July, I'll be back to 'Online'.

Don't be ashamed. I did the same thing. I had 100m worth of exploration data on the line. That was too much of my time and effort going to be wasted if I died to take any risk. Now that's sold I've been pottering around in open as normal.

 

[Lupin]

I do not like it when players kill other players for no reason, but sadly this happens A LOT on online games. I am thankful that we are not like Call of Duty.

We do have options to get around the problem, solo mode, better skill, sneaky tactics or getting escort (See player groups) are but a few.
I consider using solo mode as forced to play the greffier/trolls way.

Personally I switched to my python before entering system (700mg+ shields), picked a time where I thought system would be less busy (NOT US time) and plotted a course that would take me through system so I could jump system if needed.
Result. 1 player I saw in system (Did not check to see what ship being used) and jumped by 3 ship NPC wing 6km from station. But in an safe with data.

Risk and reward, but powerplay just seems to be another reason to be crap to another player. ED should NOT be just about conflict.

 

[bitstorm]

If someone kills you how do you know it's for "no reason"?

What about dropping into an Anarchy area and killing NPCs for "no reason" - is that allowed?

 

[certhas]

If someone kills you how do you know it's for "no reason"?

What about dropping into an Anarchy area and killing NPCs for "no reason" - is that allowed?

if you're clean and not pledged to anyone it is "for no reason"
i know its "only" a game but even in a game (as long as its not a shooter) some principles of social interaction should apply and one of those is: hurting or killing someone is a major crime as long as there isnt a war or you're a member of a law enforcing organisation or in a system without any government.

anyway, i had an encounter yesterday with someone who interdicted me, submitted, abode to his demand of throttling down to zero, after some scanning and chatting (and an empty cargo hold) he told me to leave the system and jumped away...
well, i did not leave till i had done my job of delivering some documents but thats the way it should be!
tbh. when i first read fd wants to make "battle arenas" for instant pvp i thought "more pewpew content, not again!" but then i realized: "maybe all those trigger-happy psycho's will use that new feature instead of killing easy prey"

 

[Traveller_GG]

if you're clean and not pledged to anyone it is "for no reason"
i know its "only" a game but even in a game (as long as its not a shooter) some principles of social interaction should apply and one of those is: hurting or killing someone is a major crime as long as there isnt a war or you're a member of a law enforcing organisation or in a system without any government.

anyway, i had an encounter yesterday with someone who interdicted me, submitted, abode to his demand of throttling down to zero, after some scanning and chatting (and an empty cargo hold) he told me to leave the system and jumped away...
well, i did not leave till i had done my job of delivering some documents but thats the way it should be!
tbh. when i first read fd wants to make "battle arenas" for instant pvp i thought "more pewpew content, not again!" but then i realized: "maybe all those trigger-happy psycho's will use that new feature instead of killing easy prey"

Agreed. I'm hoping for the same.

 

[drkaii]

if you're clean and not pledged to anyone it is "for no reason"
i know its "only" a game but even in a game (as long as its not a shooter) some principles of social interaction should apply and one of those is: hurting or killing someone is a major crime as long as there isnt a war or you're a member of a law enforcing organisation or in a system without any government.

anyway, i had an encounter yesterday with someone who interdicted me, submitted, abode to his demand of throttling down to zero, after some scanning and chatting (and an empty cargo hold) he told me to leave the system and jumped away...
well, i did not leave till i had done my job of delivering some documents but thats the way it should be!
tbh. when i first read fd wants to make "battle arenas" for instant pvp i thought "more pewpew content, not again!" but then i realized: "maybe all those trigger-happy psycho's will use that new feature instead of killing easy prey"

The fact that someone equated players to NPCs is really missing the point of this thread. Anyway, yeah, that's what I mean about good piracy.

I'm just talking about people whose only purpose is to kill weaklings. No conversation, no orders, nothing

 

[Andrew Gaspurr]

When I played EVE Online once, I was ambushed in my Mining Ship while mining in a low-security system (where I better had some eyes placed beforehand). I was subsequently scanned down, ambushed, immobilized and ransomed. I paid and the dudes let me go. Then we had some nice 'yarrr!!!!'-style comms chatter.

Long story short: Was an event to remember (and not repeat) and we had some good times and some good laughs. That's the way to go!

 

[Lazerus Artificial]

? you lose the bounty on your head at death? thats really stupid.

An active bounty is resolved in one of the following ways: Firstly if a ship detects the bounty and destroys you then the bounty is claimed and removed. Secondly if your ship is destroyed, but the bounty is not detected then the following happens: The bounty becomes dormant and can only be detected by authority scans by agents of that jurisdiction and if detected will become an active bounty with a new seven day timer. If a dormant bounty is not detected within seven days then it is removed. If an active bounty is not claimed or made dormant within seven days then it will be cleared.

so yeah, as usual:
undock with a sidewinder - kill yourself - bounty becomes dormant.
or
undock with a sidewinder - let a friend kill you - he gets credits and you are clean.