Been complaining in alpha about the obnoxious implementation of AI, and sadly, it is exactly the same in the shipped product.
Mind you, I was not expecting anything like splinter cell or Hitman; those are games made with that gameplay in mind, but even looking at something similar (FPS with stealth), like Thief games and similar; the gameplay in Odyssey is atrocious, to the point where I don't even bother.
Let's start pointing out the problems, because the issue as I see it is in the implementation of AI. I got a mission to sabotage a factory; which involve getting a compound inside their production line. Super happy, want to do that. Also there was a requirement to not kill anyone; exactly what I was looking for. Been playing Hitman for ages, and the feeling of poison a drink and kill someone while observing the scene from close by, is very rewarding, so I was hoping to get the same out of this mission. Sadly I got killed.
Got in the base, nobody noticed me, was in the shadow away from anyone patrolling, until I got to the industrial complex; the mission asked to go to complex 1 and put the compound in a machinery. Once close enough to the base I waited for a worker to get in, so I tailgated; nothing happened, the guy just said "why are you so close"; I moved on knowing that in real life, that would trigger an alarm (dude with no ID and dominator suit tailgate, that doesn't seem right); but I understand that the game is not playing it super realistic, so I went upstairs to access a terminal. Other guy there was minding his own business although noticed me and said the same "why are you so close", even if I was on the other side of the room.
Turn on the terminal to find the machinery, and got stuck there; no ID about where the complex 1 machinery was, since the mission details has none. This was a problem I pointed out in the alpha too, about how vague things are, and people say "it is the fun of it to find stuff yourself, no handholding bla bla bla"; which is fine; some people have more time to waste than me, so my threshold about how much time I want to spend to figure out things is way lower.
Anyway; ended up marking one of the areas so at least I can check them out; left the terminal and went downstairs when out of the blue I got the "marked for scanning, please do not move"; there was nobody around me, so I moved on; then I got a fine for not being scanned, and noticed that the guy on the top floor, where I was using the monitor, became yellow and then red; the base went in alarm and I was stormed by aggressors that killed me.
Now, if you don't see any problem with what happened, I am happy for you; Frontier made the game for you; but in my case; either that is a bug or there is something totally broken in infiltration missions, at the design level.
First of all, if nobody bother asking me my ID when I tailgate a door with level 2 access, then nobody should even care about me using a terminal. Since there is no disguise system in ED, you would be noticed immediately, so I am ok with workers not minding you. Except that the worker upstairs not only noticed me using the terminal, but even triggered a scan. That doesn't sound right. I noticed only guards using a scanner; but if workers do that too; then as soon as I was in the building I was supposed to be scanned; which didn't happen.
Second problem: guards knew exactly where I was; even if I was hidden; this was also in the alpha, basically ruining the game because there is no way to hide anywhere once the alarm is ringing; it is either you killing everyone (which would fail the mission) or you being dead.
Third; the scan initiated when I was downstairs; so not even in line of sight.
And this is just one type of mission; I tried different ones; all involving getting in and out to do something, download something or power down a base, and the result is almost identical: NPC behave erratically; differently from most other games that use stealth; and it is more like having AI that is either on or off, instead of having actual behavioral trees for their actions. If you have to get in a settlement with 20 people in, you would be found immediately as soon as someone see you; but in some cases this trigger the alarm, in other cases it does not. If you land at the spacepad, something should record you were there, everyone would know that you are there; and should check you out, instead nothing happens. You can even land 2Km away and walk, and nobody bother to see a guy coming from nowhere; until you are using a terminal or even stand still somewhere. This is really killing the whole stealth game part to me, and I was hoping that what we saw in alpha was an old version of AI, but it seems that nothing was done to fix it.
Do you like it? Good for you! I do not like it, and I paid the same money as you did to get the game; so my opinion is worth the same as yours; as such I believe that Frontier should know that while their FPS overall is decent; if they are planning to make stealth gameplay, they have a lot to learn from games that does it much better. And I am not talking of AI that forget you exist after they find you and fire at you; but about consistency... Which is totally a hit or miss in Odyssey.
Mind you, I was not expecting anything like splinter cell or Hitman; those are games made with that gameplay in mind, but even looking at something similar (FPS with stealth), like Thief games and similar; the gameplay in Odyssey is atrocious, to the point where I don't even bother.
Let's start pointing out the problems, because the issue as I see it is in the implementation of AI. I got a mission to sabotage a factory; which involve getting a compound inside their production line. Super happy, want to do that. Also there was a requirement to not kill anyone; exactly what I was looking for. Been playing Hitman for ages, and the feeling of poison a drink and kill someone while observing the scene from close by, is very rewarding, so I was hoping to get the same out of this mission. Sadly I got killed.
Got in the base, nobody noticed me, was in the shadow away from anyone patrolling, until I got to the industrial complex; the mission asked to go to complex 1 and put the compound in a machinery. Once close enough to the base I waited for a worker to get in, so I tailgated; nothing happened, the guy just said "why are you so close"; I moved on knowing that in real life, that would trigger an alarm (dude with no ID and dominator suit tailgate, that doesn't seem right); but I understand that the game is not playing it super realistic, so I went upstairs to access a terminal. Other guy there was minding his own business although noticed me and said the same "why are you so close", even if I was on the other side of the room.
Turn on the terminal to find the machinery, and got stuck there; no ID about where the complex 1 machinery was, since the mission details has none. This was a problem I pointed out in the alpha too, about how vague things are, and people say "it is the fun of it to find stuff yourself, no handholding bla bla bla"; which is fine; some people have more time to waste than me, so my threshold about how much time I want to spend to figure out things is way lower.
Anyway; ended up marking one of the areas so at least I can check them out; left the terminal and went downstairs when out of the blue I got the "marked for scanning, please do not move"; there was nobody around me, so I moved on; then I got a fine for not being scanned, and noticed that the guy on the top floor, where I was using the monitor, became yellow and then red; the base went in alarm and I was stormed by aggressors that killed me.
Now, if you don't see any problem with what happened, I am happy for you; Frontier made the game for you; but in my case; either that is a bug or there is something totally broken in infiltration missions, at the design level.
First of all, if nobody bother asking me my ID when I tailgate a door with level 2 access, then nobody should even care about me using a terminal. Since there is no disguise system in ED, you would be noticed immediately, so I am ok with workers not minding you. Except that the worker upstairs not only noticed me using the terminal, but even triggered a scan. That doesn't sound right. I noticed only guards using a scanner; but if workers do that too; then as soon as I was in the building I was supposed to be scanned; which didn't happen.
Second problem: guards knew exactly where I was; even if I was hidden; this was also in the alpha, basically ruining the game because there is no way to hide anywhere once the alarm is ringing; it is either you killing everyone (which would fail the mission) or you being dead.
Third; the scan initiated when I was downstairs; so not even in line of sight.
And this is just one type of mission; I tried different ones; all involving getting in and out to do something, download something or power down a base, and the result is almost identical: NPC behave erratically; differently from most other games that use stealth; and it is more like having AI that is either on or off, instead of having actual behavioral trees for their actions. If you have to get in a settlement with 20 people in, you would be found immediately as soon as someone see you; but in some cases this trigger the alarm, in other cases it does not. If you land at the spacepad, something should record you were there, everyone would know that you are there; and should check you out, instead nothing happens. You can even land 2Km away and walk, and nobody bother to see a guy coming from nowhere; until you are using a terminal or even stand still somewhere. This is really killing the whole stealth game part to me, and I was hoping that what we saw in alpha was an old version of AI, but it seems that nothing was done to fix it.
Do you like it? Good for you! I do not like it, and I paid the same money as you did to get the game; so my opinion is worth the same as yours; as such I believe that Frontier should know that while their FPS overall is decent; if they are planning to make stealth gameplay, they have a lot to learn from games that does it much better. And I am not talking of AI that forget you exist after they find you and fire at you; but about consistency... Which is totally a hit or miss in Odyssey.
