Stolen Goods vs. Salvage

[Darque]

Hello everyone,

Like many people here, I have picked up some cans floating in space and thought I had some loot, only to be fined when I arrived at the station. I started testing and OCCASIONALLY I can turbo boost into the station before it scans me and don't get fined, but more times than not it's a fine. This makes (imo) looting cans a pointless exercise, and at best, no fun.

I have read what people are posting about this, and there appears to be a general hue and cry for a change in this mechanic.

I would like to suggest that cans floating in space become "salvage" rather than stolen. I would also like to suggest that cans from WANTED ships be treated either as salvage, or as a new category indicating they are recovered stolen goods that can be turned in for a reward.

Cans dropped from ships that isn't Wanted status should be a different color or have a warning to a player considering scooping them...like a comm. message instructing that they are stolen. Since there is no mechanic, as far as I know, for marking a place in space and going back to it, there is no reason to pretend someone has stashed the cans in a location.

I suppose I could ramble on with ideas, but let's stick with the core idea - cans floating in space should be marked SALVAGE, not STOLEN and players should be able to recover them and sell with impunity.

Please note whether you agree or disagree below. I don't want to start a debate, just a simple forum vote. Thanks!

Yes to Salvage, or No to Salvage?

 

[Hethwill_Khan]

What would be the difference ?

Price of salvaged stuff cannot surely be the same as traded stuff nor even close to smuggled stuff...

Fines for smuggling are 115% of the average for the illegal cargo, per cannister.

Smuggling gets 90% galactic average profit ( at the risk of 115% fine ).

Trade goes 25% galactic average profit at best.

Salvaging should get what ? 15% at the very best ?


You can't simply erase smuggling by giving salvaging the same benefits without any of the risks.

Rethink what trade-offs should be present at the Salvage activity... if not very reduced prices.

 

[Darque]

::sigh::

 

[Hethwill_Khan]

C'mon, I got your idea, you steal from a stealer and you are a good guy right ?

Wrong IMO. And Pirating and Smuggling walk hand in hand.

Ah and if you don't know and never testified the fact, if you hang around for a bit and the Sec services arrive they will clean the serviceable space disposing the cannisters themselves. They need no salvaging teams

Now, how could a Salvager professions be introduced properly, hand to hand with Bounty Hunter ?

 

[Heathy]

if you press DELETE on your keyboard, you'll enter silent running and you won't get scanned, it helps if you have heat sinks so you can then tap V to ditch heat if its taking you too long to get in.

although i sort of agree that it should be a mixture of stolen and reclaimed things, if you find salvage in the middle of the ocean, you can claim it under maritime law it would make the same sense in space imo.

 

[mcneils5]

The only way Salvage would work as a mechanic is to have specific places to hand them in and get a relatively percentage of their value, try to take them anywhere else and they class as stolen and you risk a fine but you get a higher amount of profit for selling them on the black market

just my 2 pennies worth of course

 

[Darque]

Thank you, I didn't realize that...although I read elsewhere that isn't completely accurate. I will give it a try. I still would like the thread to get back on track. Salvage, yes or no?

Addendum: I tried your method and was scanned just like before. It appears random. I DID contact the station and request docking before I went silent. Is it possible to go silent and try to enter the station without requesting docking - is that what you are saying?

 

[Kadius]

The only way I think salvaging could work with the current system is if you salvaged wrecks instead of just picking up dropped cargo. You wouldn't be able to get weapons and such due to how that system works, but it would allow a distinction between stolen gold and salvaged gold.

 

[Rearden]

Well, salvage should have its own mechanics I agree and part of those mechanics should be to willingly deliver them to the cops for a reward that is probably lower than stolen items money wise but has other components like reputation gain.

The problem with all this is that they put fencing (getting rid of stolen items for a profit), salvaging and smuggling (bringign illegal goods to market) all in the same category. It serves only one purpose: to annoy 3 professions at once

 

[Rockspider]

Just fly to an outpost with a black market Simples

 

[Jay8ch]

Outposts with black markets in anarchy systems are where you take your stolen goods. No fines.

 

[haafie]

I hardly ever get scanned entering any station, they try but I'm usually already busy setting down on the landing pad. It's a nice way to get a little extra. Full speed at the station, full speed through the 'letterbox', heavy on the breaks...profit.

 

[Darkfyre99]

Until legal salvage licenses are implemented in game, if you take something you didn't pay for, then you are a thief. The police have no way to tell if you're a pirate who destroyed the ship that was carrying that freight, a scavenger looting the dead, or someone who thinks they're doing a good deed but are unknowingly breaking the law.

If you're carrying goods that don't belong to you, the police assume the worst, and act accordingly. Welcome to the Frontier.

 

[Eleazaros]

I don't go to stations with salvage - not real stations. I only visit outposts. You'll rarely ever get scanned docking at an outpost - you just need to find one with a blackmarket (not that uncommon).

Once you dock, just sell the stuff at the blackmarket via the contacts page and you're set.

You're stuck with stations if you're flying larger ships - only small ships can usually dock at outposts.

Small ships being:
Adder
Cobra Mk III
Eagle
Hauler
Sidewinder
Viper

Any others are medium or large ships.

It's a profitable way to go collecting the stuff but, again, don't use star ports to sell it - stick to outposts.

 

[Rearden]

I don't go to stations with salvage - not real stations. I only visit outposts. You'll rarely ever get scanned docking at an outpost - you just need to find one with a blackmarket (not that uncommon).

Once you dock, just sell the stuff at the blackmarket via the contacts page and you're set.

You're stuck with stations if you're flying larger ships - only small ships can usually dock at outposts.

Small ships being:
Adder
Cobra Mk III
Eagle
Hauler
Sidewinder
Viper

Any others are medium or large ships.

It's a profitable way to go collecting the stuff but, again, don't use star ports to sell it - stick to outposts.

ASP and Type 6 also fit in outposts

 

[MACMAN86]

For me using Silent Running never works but running in fast does. It is wrong for all goods to be classed as stolen when the game knows if you had to kill for the cargo or not. This needs fixing!

 

[Jack Dalton]

if you press DELETE on your keyboard, you'll enter silent running and you won't get scanned, it helps if you have heat sinks so you can then tap V to ditch heat if its taking you too long to get in.

although i sort of agree that it should be a mixture of stolen and reclaimed things, if you find salvage in the middle of the ocean, you can claim it under maritime law it would make the same sense in space imo.

Not true. I have been scanned while in Silent Running. It might be easier to get past, but you might still get scanned.

 

[Rearden]

For me using Silent Running never works but running in fast does. It is wrong for all goods to be classed as stolen when the game knows if you had to kill for the cargo or not. This needs fixing!

You can check my signature for a guide on several approaches but more importantly it has a link to Sandro's comments on silent running which may explain why silent running is not working for you. I also think there is a bug (or feature, who knows?) that most of the time the station spawns way ahead of the authority vessels and this is why (most of the time) you can evade scans by going fast instead of cautious since you're halfway to the station before the patrols even spawn. I do expect them to either fix the spawning of the patrols or increase the distance you spawn yourself when dropping out of supercruise sometime in the future to increase smuggling risk - although I expect them to increase the profits at the same time.

For the same reason I expect them to someday differentiate between outpost and station black markets when it comes to smuggling profits.

In any case, a mix of "cold and fast" has allowed me to do over 6 million in smuggling profits without ever being scanned, and most of that is definitely not at outposts.

 

[Heathy]

Not true. I have been scanned while in Silent Running. It might be easier to get past, but you might still get scanned.

I must have been lucky, i've actually seen the 'ship scan detected' hit silent running and ducked into the station, it all works on line of sight so yeah. what i meant to say is if you have silent running on you can't be targeted.

 

[BadSector]

It makes absolutely no sense that you cannot keep what you found, i can get it if the items are illegal and/or stolen but otherwise: founders keepers. its called a common sense. You can read about salvage rights
here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_salvage
"The law of salvage is a concept in maritime law which states that a person who recovers another person's ship or cargo after peril or loss at sea is entitled to a reward commensurate with the value of the property so saved."