Stop Name Calling

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Vlodec

Banned
In general I'd say it's never ok to use a word... any word... in a way that belittles or generalizes someone or their opinions. Griefer can be just as toxic as carebear in this regard.

People are free to disagree about play styles, but it's not ok to use words that only serve to ratchet up the noise level in the discussion and do nothing to help both sides gain an appreciation for the other's viewpoint.

Well ok, I see what you're saying, but I've always seen "griefer" as an accurate - you might almost say technical - description of someone who's objective in a game is simply to cause grief. That's how the term came about after all. If you consider it, let us say, inappropriate, what term would you recommend as a substitute, given that the very concept is a negative one.
 
Well ok, I see what you're saying, but I've always seen "griefer" as an accurate - you might almost say technical - description of someone who's objective in a game is simply to cause grief. That's how the term came about after all. If you consider it, let us say, inappropriate, what term would you recommend as a substitute, given that the very concept is a negative one.
I like "at"...
 
Just as the correct use of griefer is permissible as a descriptor (i.e. not for those that enjoy PvP, but for those that enjoy being ats), surely carebear is equally permissible as a descriptor?

I've become increasingly carebear over my time on these forums, despite currently hanging around Freeport (although as I'm not being instanced with players, it's carebear heaven).
 
It should go without saying, nothing personal intended.

Not at all - this is what reasonable and respectful discussion looks like.

On the whole I've tried to steer away from using the term carebear although I have ended up using it out of frustration.... eventually I ask myself why am I sticking to the spirit of the forum rules when others don't.

I get the frustration but I'd wager holding the higher ground and/or walking away has a better effect on those that are having a wind up. The other answer is of course - if you decide to not stick to the forum rules then you become subject to them which doesn't end up happy for anyone.

When I've used the term carebear its been as adjective or an ad-verb rather than a noun and I suppose its a catch all term that could describe a type of play which is linear, unchallenging, or perhaps just safe in a game with adult themes. For example, it might be used to describe someone who didn't like fighting in a game with War in the title.

It's interesting - you've actually described and used terms which are perfect for a counter argument where you might have used carebear - i.e.

"Personally I think you're wanting to "play it safe and don't enjoy a challenge".

Expressing an opinion and giving them grounds for a reasoned and respectful reply. Using such a response (if it were reported) would immediately be viewed and passed as being reasonable argument.

... this is a case of the chickens coming home to roost.

Possibly - although in terms of the volume of management, when the cry of griefer went up there were 'considerably' less people on board and we were spread very thin. As a moderation team, we are not able to read every single post and if they're reported in a timely manner and fit the bill of pejorative terminology then we would respond.

Its just a shame that wasn't seen as so objectionable when it was griefer this and griefer that. Where were the objections then?

That's a good question - we review every single reported post without fail and it's done by several mods at once in many cases. In the case of Griefer, there were several mitigating factors - the lack of reporting and at many times legitimate use of the term (objectively of course).

Each to their own right? Be nice if others here paid everyone the same courtesy.

Never a truer word spoken.

But in closing. If its okay to use griefer in the right context then its my contention that the term carebear should also be fair to use but I'm happy to never use or hear either term again. We can only hope ;)

Personally (and unless I'm moderating it is only ever my opinion and observations) I'd 'almost' agree with you. But I still feel that there is a difference between griefing and being a carebear however I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that front. I think we're all big enough and ugly enough to use our grown up words - it's the turning around and walking away that's the hard bit!
 
I like "at"...

Just as the correct use of griefer is permissible as a descriptor (i.e. not for those that enjoy PvP, but for those that enjoy being ats), surely carebear is equally permissible as a descriptor?

I've become increasingly carebear over my time on these forums, despite currently hanging around Freeport (although as I'm not being instanced with players, it's carebear heaven).

Shall we not use at as a term please. :rolleyes:

Honestly I think this thread has done it's dash - get your final words in and I'll close. The term may well come up under review but at the moment it is the source of a great deal of vitriol and forum negativity and as moderators we need to look at the bigger picture. When our report log fills with the same thing over and over then we respond with dealing with it in the most efficient way.

Keep in mind, you're not being stopped from expressing your opinion - you're entirely free to do that - just find other more respectful and less broadly ambiguous terms.

So - last words in and I'll close out in an hour or so.
 
Antagonistēs

He also expressed unhappy thoughts about 'griefer' and ever since then i've been trying to come up with a term that means the same but isn't out and out obscene... no luck so far i'm afraid. :eek:

A Greek word: Antagonistēs or the English term: Antagonist.

Definition of Antagonist. In literature, an Antagonist is a character or a group of characters which stand in opposition to the Protagonist or the main character. The term Antagonist comes from Greek word “Antagonistēs” that means opponent, competitor or rival.

It is close enough for Government work and is quite polite and politically correct. :)
 
Most people on these forums are extremely helpful and polite. I've enjoyed my time on the Frontier boards more than any other and I hope that it continues to be a place for constructive, mature debate.

Edit: Moved to General

I find that it's more of a hugbox than anything else and anyone with a conflicting opinion is instantly shot down.

Oh and certain mods deleting posts because they don't know the meaning of certain words and assume they're offensive.
 

Vlodec

Banned
Keep in mind, you're not being stopped from expressing your opinion - you're entirely free to do that - just find other more respectful and less broadly ambiguous terms.

So - last words in and I'll close out in an hour or so.

Exactly what "more respectful and less broadly ambiguous terms." ?

Under the circumstances I think it's a fair question.
 
I find that it's more of a hugbox than anything else and anyone with a conflicting opinion is instantly shot down.

Oh and certain mods deleting posts because they don't know the meaning of certain words and assume they're offensive.

Due to the nature of this thread, I'll let this slide (discussing moderator decisions is normally infraction worthy as per the forum rules.)

I'd contend that they're 'shot down' because they're either delivered in a negative and forceful manner or there is a majority that has the opposing opinion - I'm certainly not condoning abusive argument and it should always be reported if you feel that this is the case.
 
Exactly what "more respectful and less broadly ambiguous terms." ?

Under the circumstances I think it's a fair question.

Look at the context - highlight what you object to - represent your differing opinion. i.e.

"Personally I feel that your sitting outside the space station and shooting whomever comes out is wrecking the game for others - what's your justification for doing it?"

Rather than

"<insert expletive here>you griefer!!!11!!"

"You're just a bunch of carebears!!!11!!, the game lets me do it so I do!!!"


or to respond to a false accusation when some has gotten tagged in Anarchy systems:

"<insert expletive here>you griefer!!!11!!"

"Frankly if you enter an anarchist system then you're fair game - don't risk what you can't afford."

(followed by what I'd hope is use of the reporting function for the use of swear words).
 
most of this forum puts me off playing (testing) this game but am addicted to reading it!

i should have waited till ED is released and then played it like the "majority" of folk that will eventually play it - god help em!

Reading present discussions (lol) that could potentially be worthy debates often turn out to be a very sad representation of humanity. Too many in-jokes, boasting about conquests, wind up OP's etc etc

Empathy is very thin on the ground here
 
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Forums dedicated to old school kind of games with mature audiences tend to be less restrictive and more lightly moderated than typical forums, but for some reason the situation seems to be the reverse here. A peculiar phenomenon. When mild words from basic gamer lingo are banned, I get the impression that users will be banned as well if they make any politically incorrect statements. I wish more people would simply grow a thicker skin and choose not to be offended by what strangers on the Internet say to them. Besides, the ignore list is there for a reason.
 
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Forums dedicated to old school kind of games with mature audiences tend to be less restrictive and more lightly moderated than typical forums, but for some reason the situation seems to be the reverse here. A peculiar phenomenon. When mild words from basic gamer lingo are banned, I get the impression that users will be banned as well if they make any politically incorrect statements. I wish more people would simply grow a thicker skin and choose not to be offended by what strangers on the Internet say to them. Besides, the ignore list is there for a reason.

...Ideal worlds huh...

Closing - cheers all.
 
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