Suggest change: Landing gear or cargo scoop = Shields offline. And no instant charge afterwards either.

I knew but didn't realize as I don't have first-hand experience on prismatic shields, other than I have used shield boosters and had to power them off to decrease the restart time and then powered them on for the recharge.



Unarguably good points in your entire post.

I flew small to medium ships, I don't have first hand experience on corvettes, cutters, anacondas and I managed a shield tanked Fer-de-lance knowing that smaller ships can have their ships back online quicker than larger ships, with better shields. So I don't know how it'd feel like with a large ship with insane amount of hitpoints to bring back up at any undock.

They're not prone to instant death like small ships though.

anaconda and corvette would have slightly longer recharge times than the FDL, but if you were to equip bi-weave shields on the FDL and 6 A rated shield boosters then you would have an idea of what it would be like for a Corvette or Anaconda with bi-weave shields.

You do have a valid point about people bouncing off the landing pad and the station. Perhaps it is just me, but it has always bothered me when I see ships land carelessly and I have always tried to land my ship carefully. I do not know if making players land without shields is the solution here.
 
anaconda and corvette would have slightly longer recharge times than the FDL, but if you were to equip bi-weave shields on the FDL and 6 A rated shield boosters then you would have an idea of what it would be like for a Corvette or Anaconda with bi-weave shields.

You do have a valid point about people bouncing off the landing pad and the station. Perhaps it is just me, but it has always bothered me when I see ships land carelessly and I have always tried to land my ship carefully. I do not know if making players land without shields is the solution here.

It's not a solution, I agree :) But the bouncy castle station is more a sign of how we all feel about shields as of now. I don't want to get rid of it as much as I want my ship to feel more like a huge metal structure with physical exposure to other objects with a deeper sense of surroundings and dangers.

I think I've always used bi-weave on the FDL, you mean that's comparable to what the bigger ships experience? The 6A on FDL I don't remember exactly how it was. Basically what I do with bi-weave was power off all shield boosters to hurry the restart, then turn them on during charge at on-state.
 
You know Nicky the Hutt it never going to happen so you might as well stop. If you join a year ago when people whined about dying when NPC or player ships hit them and they are destroyed or when they crash into stations and such and died. Frontier change that. So that would not happen. So do you really think they will change the mechanics that you are asking for right now?

I longed for a real Iron man mode. Where Risk is as powerful as the reward. But it not going to happen. Why? Most of the people here don't want that risk. They want that bubble that protect them.

I understand what you're trying to convey, I'm just such very positive person in the way that I know despite how thin the chances to be heard, that silence isn't better. So I won't "stop" like you strongly suggest :) I hope the iron man mode will win over casual mode, my suggestion is not that horrible or anti-casual, it's just something a few people (or me at least) would like to see and we have to leave a mark somewhere.
 
Heck, FD don't even have to make it mandatory to lower shields for cargo, scooping or gear, just give us the option to 'lower' shields, and be able to bring then back online almost instantly.

That way, we can all play to our own style. You can either go for fun easy play style, or semi sin style and lower your shields for physical contact.
I would personally like it, but I would not like Ironman mode, as I don't get the play time to keep starting again if I died. Lol but I do agree with each to their own.
 
Heck, FD don't even have to make it mandatory to lower shields for cargo, scooping or gear, just give us the option to 'lower' shields, and be able to bring then back online almost instantly.

That way, we can all play to our own style. You can either go for fun easy play style, or semi sin style and lower your shields for physical contact.
I would personally like it, but I would not like Ironman mode, as I don't get the play time to keep starting again if I died. Lol but I do agree with each to their own.

That is how it works in the star trek universe. Shields can be "lowered" or "raised" very quickly, so long as they are charged.
 
Heck, FD don't even have to make it mandatory to lower shields for cargo, scooping or gear, just give us the option to 'lower' shields, and be able to bring then back online almost instantly.

That way, we can all play to our own style. You can either go for fun easy play style, or semi sin style and lower your shields for physical contact.
I would personally like it, but I would not like Ironman mode, as I don't get the play time to keep starting again if I died. Lol but I do agree with each to their own.

That is how it works in the star trek universe. Shields can be "lowered" or "raised" very quickly, so long as they are charged.

Exactly.
There are more reasons to lower shields, even as optional reasons. The only reasons considered in the game is heat management or not fitting a shield generator to begin with. We all got used to keeping shields during landing and cargo management, but the game is not limited to that. It will become a bit odd to implement deployable fighters and EVA in the current and next seasons, without having to reconsider their approach to that always-on impenetrable screen around the entire ship.
 

Deleted member 38366

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A few observations/issues I'd have with that :

- Shields are often the only thing that prevent getting quite severe Ship damage when docking or undocking @ busy Stations
(be it Players in a hurry, NPCs that ignore the own Ship, limitations of the Docking Computer or your occasional Station rammers)

- Docking in a Ship that suffered critical damage could become rather painful

- Landing on Planets (or Planetary Bases) without Shields currently carries high chance of incurring Hull Damage
(again, Shields cover that issue)

- Mining in a RES is an Option that some folks still do
(if you had to lower Shields to scoop/collect and if there was any notable delay in getting the Shields back up - bad news... Not considering the Scan-Ramming NPCs right now, but I imagine hunting to ram the crap out of Miners would quickly become a thing)

- scooping under fire in Signal Sources currenty possible and useful
(often had to scoop Mission Salvage when after a few Seconds numerous NPCs jump in - again, very bad news if your Shields are down and should you be unable to restore them to full power very fast)




Now taking all the Cons into consideration, I tend to see no reaonable benefits that would even remotely outweigh them.
At least not in the current Meta... And it would certainly give the "funny guys" some new Opportunities you can be darn sure they'd find ways to exploit for their purpose.
 
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From the logical/realistic point of view, you're right with the cargo scoop. But - as others stated before - the gameplay won't benefit from changes. On the other hand, especially the most dubious characters in this game would really appreciate a landing gear down/cargo scoop activated=shield deactivated mode for this what they call their "amusement".
 
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Pros/cons:
+ More suspense during landing, docking and undocking.
+ An enjoyable difficulty among simulation fans.
+ More caution seen around stations, less speeding.
+ More value to hull modules, less tendency to go "all shields, no hull" in outfitting.
+ More value and reasons to using shield cell banks (traders especially).
+ Pirates will have to drop their shields to scoop cargo, improving the challenge.
1: I don't know how you land but shield or not would really make 0 difference to me, I suppose to those that slam into the dock sure, but when you put it down as you should?
2: again what difficulty? what does removing shield in two situations, landing and scooping, which you only are doing when you aren't fighting, add in terms of difficulty?
3: Why? because people would be exiting slowly? you do realize a lot don't hit landing gear until last moment, those entering would have shield and could fly as recklessly as possible, only ones at 'risk' would be those leaving and they could just stay inside until charge?
4: This I don't get, the only ones that think that are those that haven't tried hull reinforcements in my book, they are very nice.
5: How? why would there be a 'use' for them, in non combat situations?
6: what challenge? scooping while police is coming to get them? in most situations currently with pvp piracy you have to remember they don't really fire on people unless they are going to destroy them, as such no police coming and no risk from having no shield while scooping?
 
Oh my... Not sure where to start...

You can switch the shields generator off in Modules section, so if you'd like to do some beta testing, you can do that now. I'd suggest you to start testing it and then share your conclusions with the forums. If you think it would be more exciting for you to play this way, you already have this option. Why on Earth you would like to make Elite worse for many other people is beyond my ability to comprehend.

1. Suspense during docking... What sort of suspense? I do that so many times each day that I would happily skip this part of the game whatsoever, if there was an option to do that. I fly Anaconda at the moment, so if shields were going off during docking, I would simply put better bulkheads and hull reinforcement package and just ram whatever's in my way in the mailslot. Yes, I would take damage, but I think the ship would survive most of encounters (at least with smaller ships, I would still have to avoid bigger ones, just like I do now). There are just a few ships that would be able to damage my ship significantly and I don't see them that often. As for the repair cost / fines, that would be percentage profit small enough to not really matter and big enough to annoy me.
2. Elite is not a flight simulator. You can control the game with hotas, and you are flying something, but it's still very far from being a flight simulator. It's not a go to game for flight simulator fans...
3. I would speed even more than I do. To make sure that if I ram some poor NPC, I send them spinning as far from the mailslot, as I can. I already always leave stations with full speed and boost and don't really pay much attention if there is something in the way. Mostly because it takes way too much of my time. If I can loose up to 20 mil in insurance, cargo and profit, you may be absolutely sure I won't mind blowing up some innocent Sidewinder or other Hauler if it didn't try to avoid the collision and be quick about getting out of the mailslot.
4. Makes zero sense when it comes to exploration. Since there is no A+ or A++ FSD in game, the only way of getting higher jump range is to shed weight any way you can. Personally I always fly with weapons and shields, but definitely not armor or hull reinforcement, unless I go to war. There are explorers out there who even got rid of weapons to get a better jump range. If now you force them to make their ships heavier, many will stop exploring. Not every ship in the game has to be outfitted for combat and your suggestion would make players outfit their ships this way. Which removes the little bits of customization we have whatsoever.
5. Shield banks are for combat, not for trading. Why would you have them instead of cargo racks? Once again, if shields were going down all the time, people would go for hull reinforcements, not for shield cell banks. And probably removed the shields whatsoever to fit more cargo and make up for the loss of cargo space due to hull reinforcement.
6. I'm not interested in piracy, but that seems about as harsh as having to drop shields when entering stations and rather pointless. Once again, people would skip the shields and went for hull reinforcement and armor instead.

In short, what you're suggesting would be a sure way to remove shields from the game whatsoever. Docking and cargo scooping are two minigames which add basically nothing to the gameplay, they just consume time. Way more time than basic activities should consume, in my opinion.
 
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Docking and cargo scooping are two minigames which add basically nothing to the gameplay, they just consume time. Way more time than basic activities should consume, in my opinion.

I disagree.
It would be a poor space sim (whatever the definition) if there was no docking in the game. The current implementation is the minimum mechanic that should be in the game.
What do you propose? Skip it and have instant docking by clicking a button? That would make for a very poor experience I think.
To me it seems extraordinarily weird not to want docking in a game like this.

Cargo scooping is entirely optional. If you do not want to do it then avoid it. Personally I like it. I think it is an essential mechanic.
But I would not mind if FD added some sort of cargo drone system to make it more interesting and convenient.
They already have a functional drone system.
 
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I disagree.
It would be a poor space sim (whatever the definition) if there was no docking in the game. The current implementation is the minimum mechanic that should be in the game.
What do you propose? Skip it and have instant docking by clicking a button? That would make for a very poor experience I think.
To me it seems extraordinarily weird not to want docking in a game like this.

Cargo scooping is entirely optional. If you do not want to do it then avoid it. Personally I like it. I think it is an essential mechanic.
But I would not mind if FD added some sort of cargo drone system to make it more interesting and convenient.
They already have a functional drone system.

It's not the subject of this thread, but I don't suggest removing the docking nor cargo scooping. I do get why it's necessary, I do agree it's better than some sort of video / loading screen. At the same time station approach and docking take more time than jumping back and forth between several systems. I had even planned a trade route for myself especially so I can land only at outposts and cut down the docking time. Sadly, that became obsolete with the moment I started flying Anaconda.

Anyway, I don't propose anything, they've done it this way and it's unlikely to change. The current system could be improved by for example: having the mailslot marked in a clear manner (quite frankly, I don't even see which side is green and which is red until I'm pretty close, and thus I'm not bothered anymore), having the landing pads arranged according to one pilot federation standard as opposed to be differently arranged at every station (there seem to be several variations of landing pads layout and numbering), having the designated landing pad change its colour (yes, to be absolutely and totally obvious without checking the number) and also instead of having the radar with everything what's happening around the station (which I don't care about when I'm docking), have a radar showing my position in relation to the landing pad and other ships inside the station. Since I can't exactly see if I'm already above the landing pad, unless I lower the ship significantly. If you're flying a big ship with poor visibility, you have to guess if you're in the right spot already, which is a poor design. Take off is fine as it is.

Personally I'd rather land on the outside of the star ports and got transported inside on the occasions when I really need it (e.g. outfitting & shipyard, maybe black market) and just use onboard computer to access other things (missions, market, universal cartographic). Quick landing, quick take-off and be about my business. Also, getting ships inside without any sort of screening before is a safety hazard. Contamination is one possibility, but what if someone decideds to fill their ship with explosives or radioactive materials and blow that up inside the station? And yes, I know such possibility is not in the game and is highly unlikely to ever be introduced. Which, again, is a shame.
As for the cargo scooping, they have introduced the limpets, so that's fine. Again, as for basic cargo scooping, without the limpets, they have designed it in a certain way and it's unlikely to change. Shame they didn't solve it using a tractor beam of some sort. I don't usually scoop any cargo, even if some NPC spills it after being blown up, it takes more time than it's worth, but perhaps I'd be more interested if it was more fun to do so.

For the record: I'm perfectly fine with the current mechanics as it is and it's playable. I just wish they were a bit more imaginative, ambitious and creative when it comes to such basic activities. Things the players are supposed to do over and over again dozens or hundreds of times a day should be quick as to not stand in the way of the gameplay. Current design philosophy seems to be more along the lines: "how do we make this bit into another minigame" as opposed to what I think would be better for Elite: "how do we make it cool".

Once again, this is not a subject of this thread, so my apologies for off topic. I just answered a question I've been asked.
 
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Originally Posted by DHMeyer

Docking and cargo scooping are two minigames which add basically nothing to the gameplay, they just consume time. Way more time than basic activities should consume, in my opinion.

My Docking-Ranking:

1st: Outpost - so much fun!
2nd: Coriolis/Orbis/Ocellus - it's ok
3rd: Planet Surface Starports: boring
4th: Planet Surface Starports (High-G-Planets): creepy!
 
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