[Suggestion] Stealth & Scanning overhaul

Given that changes are being planned for Exploration, I feel that this would also be an excellent opportunity to overhaul most of the games' Scanning & Stealth mechanics. As they are currently far too binary & lack any true skill component-particularly with regards to Super-cruise.

Lets begin with Stealth. At its simplest, a ship's Profile/Visibility should broadly be a combination of its physical size & its "Heat Signature"-in both N-Space & Super-cruise (heck, probably already is, for all I know). Again, regardless of SC or N-Space, that Profile should impact not only the minimum range at which the ship turns up on the scopes of other ships, but also the length of time needed to get a successful scan of the ship. As such, Heat Management should be just as important a skill in Super-Cruise as it is in N-Space......if not more so.....& ships should have the ability to utilise a Super-cruise configuration of Silent Running. Similarly, certain Modules & Engineer Upgrades should exist to make Super-cruise Stealth easier, & certain ship types (most especially the Scouts) should be designed so as to run with lower visibility IMHO.

The flip-side of this is overhauling of Scanning.....again especially in regards to Super-Cruise. Passive Scans (just clicking on the object in the Nav Panel & pointing your ship at it) would work largely as they do now, except these scans would reveal less information than is currently the case. However passive scans would always be effectively "silent", & thus be a great scanning method for ships running in Stealth Mode.

Active Scanning would require an appropriate Scanner (Kill-Warrant, Manifest, Discovery) & would be able to be used in 3 different modes-Low, Medium & High Powered. Each level of Scan power would require the player to hold the button down for longer, would reveal more information about the target (relevant to the scanner type), but would also increase the risk of the scan being detected by the scanee, as well as revealing who the scanning is (& its location). Scanning Angle & Distance would-however-also play a significant role in the utility & risk of the different scanning modes.

What is most important, however, is that all these Active Scanning methods would be just as useful in Super-Cruise as they are in N-Space. Thus adding another potential danger to players/NPC's travelling to a destination within a system. Though such functionality will make things more potentially dangerous for the Cargo Hauler, Smuggler or Criminal, it would also have the effect of significantly reducing the random interdiction of players who are running with no cargo/no bounties-as law enforcement/pirates would only tend to interdict those revealed as viable targets by an active scan.

To make things more interesting, Modules & Engineer Upgrades could exist that could allow players & NPC's to break a scan in progress, or at the very least seriously delay the completion of said scan (in a manner similar to ECM's & Missiles). Even a Scan delay might be sufficient for the scanned target to make use of Stealth Mechanics to apparently "disappear" from the scope of the scanning ships. Of course the easiest way to evade scanning is to keep away from the Shipping Lanes within a given system ;).


So, in summary, what would the suggested changes do for the game?

1) I believe it would make travel in Super-Cruise a much more exciting & engaging activity, especially for more nefarious players.

2) It would allow for smaller ships to remain more viable, even for a "late game" player. It would also allow certain ships to be slightly modified to make them excel at Scanning, Stealth or both (the Asp-X & DBX both come to mind).

3) It would allow even more opportunities for Multi-Crew, as crew-mates could be involved in managing Stealth & even scanning activities.

4) It would allow for a whole range of new missions, all centred around Stealth (with or without Scanning). Covert Espionage missions that work along similar lines to Massacre Missions, Stalking Missions that work along similar lines to Assassinations & Haulage Missions that demand you can *never* get scanned.

Anyway, those are my thoughts. What does everyone else think?
 
Oh &, whilst on this topic, as much as I *love* the talk of using probes for exploration. I do hope they also look to significantly improve non-probe based Exploration Scans of Stellar Bodies. Many of the mechanics I mentioned above could also be utilised for Stellar Body Scans, to make it a much more engaging activity than just a passive point, click & fly towards each object approach that we currently have.
 
I like the thinking behind this. As it is, scans are very binary. You either have the info or do not. Allowing a difference between passively scanning and actively digging for info would give a lot more nuance and meaning to the varying ranges of scanner and return a lot of purpose to heat management. Opening up new missions types is just icing on the cake.

This inspires a related idea, revolving around the oft-maligned detailed surface scanner. Disclaimer: I hate this thing. Like, with actual hatred. It's a module tax that gives you more money and adds no gameplay whatsoever. It would have been far more interesting if it required you to close in on a planet and circle it to form a complete detailed scan. It could use some sort of wireframe mesh to show how much of the body your scanner is covering so you just kind of "paint" the whole thing until it registers as complete. We could even have different grades of DSS that paint a bigger swath of the planet when close enough.

Full scanning would take more time, but it would give us more reasons to fly around and actually look at things. At this point they'd probably have to increase the information available from detailed scans to make this worth anything; maybe increase the payout a bit for the extra effort. It could simply be the "level 3" scan of discovery scanners. Passive honk, mid-range scan, close range detailed sweep. More effort, info and payout required for each level.
 
I like the idea of building on stealth mechanics. It would also be a good time to re-balance stealth and silent running in combat, since it's pretty much useless at the moment.

Blackmarkets could also do with a complete overhaul. Including being able to purchase illegal goods, particularly blocked rare goods. Also blackmarkets shouldn't be able to be closed as easily as they are now. A player's blackmarket network should mean something too.
 
I like the thinking behind this. As it is, scans are very binary. You either have the info or do not. Allowing a difference between passively scanning and actively digging for info would give a lot more nuance and meaning to the varying ranges of scanner and return a lot of purpose to heat management. Opening up new missions types is just icing on the cake.

This inspires a related idea, revolving around the oft-maligned detailed surface scanner. Disclaimer: I hate this thing. Like, with actual hatred. It's a module tax that gives you more money and adds no gameplay whatsoever. It would have been far more interesting if it required you to close in on a planet and circle it to form a complete detailed scan. It could use some sort of wireframe mesh to show how much of the body your scanner is covering so you just kind of "paint" the whole thing until it registers as complete. We could even have different grades of DSS that paint a bigger swath of the planet when close enough.

Full scanning would take more time, but it would give us more reasons to fly around and actually look at things. At this point they'd probably have to increase the information available from detailed scans to make this worth anything; maybe increase the payout a bit for the extra effort. It could simply be the "level 3" scan of discovery scanners. Passive honk, mid-range scan, close range detailed sweep. More effort, info and payout required for each level.

Well, Q4 will be giving the DSS addtional functionality, in the form of launchable probes. If so, then this makes it all the more imperative for the other existing scanners to be able to do more detailed, active scans of stellar objects.
 
Wait, so in order to make the scanner more interesting, they're going to let us launch probes that just do the same scan from farther away?

Instead of adding functionality and mechanics, they're just making the same gameplay more convenient. It'll still be a module tax; we just won't have to close in.

Methinks they've missed the point...
 
Wait, so in order to make the scanner more interesting, they're going to let us launch probes that just do the same scan from farther away?

Instead of adding functionality and mechanics, they're just making the same gameplay more convenient. It'll still be a module tax; we just won't have to close in.

Methinks they've missed the point...

No, they've not missed the point.....but I suspect you may have. Take a look at their Lavecon Demos & explanations. I think probes sound really cool, to be honest.......as have many hard core Explorers on these forums.
 
While I'm wholeheartedly against stealth in normal space, I actually like the idea in SC. It would be another avenue for traders to configure their ships to avoid interdiction, however I'm not entirely sure how it would work.

Silent Running is based around the idea of short duration, anything more than about 10 seconds requires heatsinks to sustain, and even then, we're talking about ~30 seconds to enter a station or evade an attack. Stealth in SC would require minutes to be effective, and I can't really see a downside mentioned in your idea to balance this. If a CMDR can go stealth whenever they please, without any kind of penalty, then it's basically Solo mode, and IMO pointless.

The only idea I could behind is a module that allows Silent Running to operate in SC without heat buildup, at the cost of something (substantial cargo space, speed, interdiction defense etc), or allow the CMDR to enter the mode for short periods, but upon deactivation drop out of SC and emite a massive burst of heat that's visible as a USS. The idea would be that a trader can limit (not negate) their detection, in exchange for a penalty if they are detected.
 
While I'm wholeheartedly against stealth in normal space, I actually like the idea in SC. It would be another avenue for traders to configure their ships to avoid interdiction, however I'm not entirely sure how it would work.

Silent Running is based around the idea of short duration, anything more than about 10 seconds requires heatsinks to sustain, and even then, we're talking about ~30 seconds to enter a station or evade an attack. Stealth in SC would require minutes to be effective, and I can't really see a downside mentioned in your idea to balance this. If a CMDR can go stealth whenever they please, without any kind of penalty, then it's basically Solo mode, and IMO pointless.

The only idea I could behind is a module that allows Silent Running to operate in SC without heat buildup, at the cost of something (substantial cargo space, speed, interdiction defense etc), or allow the CMDR to enter the mode for short periods, but upon deactivation drop out of SC and emite a massive burst of heat that's visible as a USS. The idea would be that a trader can limit (not negate) their detection, in exchange for a penalty if they are detected.

Where as I feel.stealth needs to be a more important aspect of the game in both N-space & SC. The point isn't to make your ship truly *invisible*, IMHO, but to simply make your ship much harder to spot-especially at longer ranges. Part of the idea is to.merely run your ship in the lowest energy setting, in order to evade detailed scanning, with occasional use of Silent Running as a back up-particularly useful if someone is mid scan & you want to break their lock-on........& then increase speed so they cannot pick you up again. At least that is one of the uses I would envisage.

Of course, having a crew mate involved in managing heat & Silent Running could make smuggling much more engaging for Multi-crew fans.
 
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