General / Off-Topic Superman Returns vs Man of Steel

[Giskard]

Having recently seen Man of Steel, I have to say, I was disappointed!

I wanted a film filled with pathos and emotion. Characters we could empathise with. But instead I felt the film was somewhat crass, loud, bombastic and overblown. I mean, the last 40 minutes was one big fight sequence. It was like watching 'Transformers'!

I love Richard Donner's original 1978 film and I really think that film is the benchmark. However, Bryan Singer's 'Superman Returns' was a classy attempt to update the franchise I thought. It had a real respect for the original and I just think its a classier film all round. What do others think?

 

[Mobius]

Disagree,

Superman returns was truly awful, huge flaws like how was lex going to defend his kryptonite island from the us government with only a hand full of inept henchmen, and i though Kryptonite was lethal to superman, obviously not in superman returns, and the biggest disaster was Super boy,

Man of steal had its flaws but was for me exactly what I wanted, big over the top action,

 

[Alien]

I noticed a big difference between the two films, and a very important difference ...

Man Of Steel had no acknowledgement of Jerry Siegel Joe Shuster. It is widely believed that there is curse around the on-screen versions of Superman, and the two creators are connected to it, originally because they didn't get credited for it, and thus cursed it, which is why you tend to see their names in the opening credits, and it was this that was missing from Man Of Steel.

 

[DigitalDuck]

I think Man of Steel is what a Superman film should be - all of the others I've seen have just had villains attacking for the sake of it, random strengths/weakness for seemingly no reason (i.e. without explanation), and no action to make up for the lack of a decent story.

All of the other films put Superman as a goody two-shoes who can do no wrong, even though the comics don't. Man of Steel shows Superman as a Man, as imperfect, with flaws that aren't the obvious Kryptonite plot device.

But then it also shows him as Superman, with tremendous amounts of power, and shows that he isn't a human being that belongs on Earth. And if it comes with big over the top action, then that's even better.

Superman Returns was certainly more like the original films, but I think that's exactly the problem.

 

[Giskard]

It's probably an age thing! I think most big budget films are all the same! I can visualise the meetings with the studio execs: 'We must have more explosions! There's a 10 minute gap here where there is no action whatsoever!'

Does anyone else think that the climactic 'fight' went on and on too long? It was interminable.
- Being thrown into a skyscraper and flying straight out the side is nice - if done well and perhaps only done a couple of times, but smashing through the twentieth skyscraper over and over makes me switch off.

Maybe I'm just weird! I like subtlety. I think that's the key word. Where is the subtlety?

 

[DigitalDuck]

Maybe I'm just weird! I like subtlety. I think that's the key word. Where is the subtlety?

I imagine the subtlety is in films where the main character isn't faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, and able to leap tall buildings in a single bound.

 

[bitrogue]

Maybe I'm just weird! I like subtlety. I think that's the key word. Where is the subtlety?

My feeling is that if you want subtlety then stay away from superhero movies altogether. I'm not a fan of superhero movies in general, though one or two recent movies have made me rethink this. In general, I hate the costumes, the linear story lines, their fighting techniques are usually just bludgeoning and brute force methods which the likes of Jackie Chan could run rings around.
Despite my rant, I did enjoy this incarnation of Superman more than the others. I definitely prefer the darker and more forboding atmosphere than the light hearted cheesy styles of all the others. I probably won't be buying the DVD though.

 

[psykokow]

Batman begins dragged me back into the genre.. I hate henchmen pish!!

BUT I thought man of steel was ok, I found Returns duller than the blunt end of a pencil being rammed up my nostril.

I liked the Green Lantern (but its more comedy), and Iron Man 3 is a guilty pleasure regarding my strong like for Robery Down ME dribble.. sorry what was I saying?

 

[Phoenix_Dfire]

There were only two problems I had with the film.

1. The final fight was far far too long.
2.

Spoiler

He killed someone. Superman isn't supposed to do that. They put the character in the position where I felt he had no choice.

Apart from that I found it much better than Superman Returns although a bit more 'Lois and Clark' banter between Lois Lane and Superman would have been nice.

 

[PacalB]

There were several issues of morality in Man Of Steel and quite frankly I found them refreshing. I am sick and tired of over the top villains who act like buffoons. They reminded me of the old Batman series in the 60's. They were a joke.

Spoiler

I found the information about Krypton quite a revelation. The comics always portrayed the planet as scientifically advanced and here its presented as an Orwellian society where all their children are genetically engineered, except for Kal-El. Even on Krypton he would have been seen as a freak.

I thought Snyder portrayed Kal more as a Marvel character such as a mutant X men or the lonely isolated Silver Surfer. Emotionally isolated and filled with self loathing, this Superman fought to find himself and face the possibility of rejection. It was refreshing to see superman from a mortal lens and the struggle he had to endure to find his place.

Some say there was an issue with the killing Zod, but it showed even more how human he was (how we had affected him). I had no problem with the re-imagining of Kal-el. Controversial, perhaps. But all the new stuff, I thought it was brilliant. It was the best adaptation of Superman so far. Perfect no but it was engrossing.

 

[Nicodemus]

Both had flaws but both had some good points.

Superman Returns, while a bland film most of the time, was a nod to the old films and how he reacts to finding out that Louis is married and has a kid. The redeeming part of the film is that Kevin Spacey as Lex Luthor is spot on.

Spoiler

The Man of Steel gives us a taste of Krypton as it falls, it introduces us to the villains but gives them a very credible reason for their actions. They aren't evil just for evil's sake which a lot of superhero movies tend to paint the villains as. I agree that the end of the movie was just a bit too much of a slug fest, I think it would have been better if Superman had been more sympathetic to Zod and perhaps had beaten him but offered him the chance of redemption by giving him the scout ship to establish a new Krypton but to leave Earth alone.

I enjoyed them both for different reasons, Superman Returns was more of a story, Man of Steel was more of an action movie.

 

[PacalB]

Spoiler

I think it would have been better if Superman had been more sympathetic to Zod and perhaps had beaten him but offered him the chance of redemption by giving him the scout ship to establish a new Krypton but to leave Earth alone.

Spoiler

This could never have happened, Zod was a genetic class breed purely for the defence of Krypton, at any cost. Whilst he had any breath in him he would have been driven to get the codex out of Kal' Els cells. There was no other option.

 

[Alien]

Spoiler tags?

 

[Sir.Tj]

If you could use spoiler tags for info about specific points of the film for people who have not seen it yet.

Thanks

 

[PacalB]

If you could use spoiler tags for info about specific points of the film for people who have not seen it yet.

Thanks

Sure, will do. Sorry about that T.j. I've seen them being used just never really looked to see how to use them, I see the warp spoiler tag option now, will use them in any future postings. Once again apologies folks.