Technological Disconnect

[reazon19]

Let me start off by saying I love elite, and regardless of the way things are or continue to be I will still be a player and I consider this one of my all time favorite games.

However, based on a fair amount of grumbling and complaints in the forums it seems like there is definitely an odd disconnect between the way game mechanics work and the presumed technological advancement that should have taken place in the game lore.

A recent example was the forum post about the SRV. It seems like a completely reasonable assumption that 1300 years into the future we wouldn't be using land rovers that we, even in this day and age, have already presumably considered outdated. I'm not saying we should be driving Mass Effect stlye rovers, but we definitely shouldn't be driving millennial old designs of a navigational vehicle. The argument is fair.

Another obvious example would seem to be that we can't write down the schematics for all of the engineering upgrades (pinning ALL blueprints). It seems a bit odd that we cant use a copy machine of some sort 1300 years into the future. I get that there's SOME PURPOSE that the developers have in only allowing us to pin 1 blueprint, but again, this is just another example of the presumed technological disconnect.

In order to keep this fairly short, the point is that the many disconnects that are in the game compound to the point where the immersion isn't quite where it could be. It just seems to me that there could be better game mechanics in the development process that could allow for fewer forum complaints and a more immersive experience if this disconnect was addressed.

Begin the roasting.

EDIT: I too enjoy driving in the SRV, I'm just using that example as a jump off point for the topic.

 

[Red Martian]

Fair point, and yeah, I've had questions about the level of technology in Elite. Like you, I love the ships, the SRV is fun, but I do wonder how it's all supposed to fit together. I mean, if we're going to use retro hardware, then I want to rove the surface of a moon with a 1973 Volkswagen Bus, powder blue.

 

[Vedmo]

Wheels, levers, pulleys, fire, hammers. All ancient technologies and tools that will probably never be outdated.

 

[Eriseley]

It's funny that you should mention Mass Effect since SRV gameplay very much reminds me of the Mako. Do people just want a facelift or something? Because otherwise they are quite similar so I'm not exactly getting the tech complaint (except the missing air-drop - and also the Mako is a military vehicle). If people have a look problem with the SRV, then comparing ships to the Normandy, Elite certainly isn't as sleek either, but that's the look they're going for.

 

[reazon19]

Honestly, I think part of the SRV issue may be the visual appearance...it seems a bit "outdated looking". I still think it looks cool but it looks cool for now, not what a vehicle 1300 in the future would conceptually look like (obviously a matter of preference and individual taste, I get it). Overall the visual appeal seems almost like they are stuck in design looks from the 80's.

Which considering the original was in the 80's I get it...buuuuuut, you know...2018 and all.

I hate to use a mass effect reference again but it would make sense if these things were designed many years ago and just now being able to use as is the case in Andromeda where everyone was asleep for so long and no one had the capability to advance design.

But again, it's more about the overall "feeling" (probably a fairer term to use, since it's individual preference) of the technological disconnect that seems to be an issue for many. At least the more vocal folks on the forums, who I know actually represent a smaller percentage of the player base then it would seem.

 

[reazon19]

EDIT: In response to Vedmo.

I get that too, but I doubt many people would buy a car nowadays that looks like a Model T...I'm sure there would be amarket of some sort but I think most prefer to stay with the times and choose a more modern sleeker design for their vehicle.

Fair agrument though.

 

[Eriseley]

It sounds like another SRV that's more sleek than the Scarab would make people happy, then. Personally I like the industrial design myself, has an Alien vibe to me which I enjoy.

ALTHOUGH, I would take a "luxury" rover for my Dolphin.

 

[Eriseley]

Trying to jump off from the SRV to other tech aspects and immersion breakers...uhm...honestly the mission board. I feel like every station should have shipping missions available, and factions wanting various assassinations/bounties, various mined materials, whatever. Economy and state could influence balance of missions, but it seems very spammy instead. This would require a more complex missions board probably with filters, though.

 

[reazon19]

Yea, the mission boards are a whole 'nother issue...I don't even know where to start with that.

We should definitely have categories to filter...and an refresh button if we're gonna stick with the RNG of missions...the board flipping solo/open is intensely immersion breaking. I think a refresh button would satisfy a lot of grumbling. At least that way we could stay in-game. I think if FDev REALLY wanted to limit missions they wouldn't allow for the board to refresh between open/solo...but since they don't seem to kind, a refresh button would make more sense.

Overall I think the mission issues has a fair percentage to do with the BGS and powerplay.

There's another "FIX THE GRIND" thread currently that I made a comment in on page 14. If I knew how to tag it here on mobile quick enough I would link it, but I digress. The comment I made there I feel has at least some small relevance that could help to rebalance the feel of the ranks, and the overall BGS and powerplay which, mixed with a refresh button, could really help.

EDIT:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/418841-Grind-can-we-solve-the-problem/?page=13

last comment on that page...hopefully the link works.

 

[Pville_Piper]

Spinners... The SRV needs spinners.

 

[reazon19]

Spinners... The SRV needs spinners.

Floaters look cooler.

I kid I kid...sort of.

 

[Eriseley]

Yeah link worked. I suspect the instance flipping is a game design issue that isn't easily fixed or it would have been already. That's honestly why I think just increasing the available missions in station and adding filters is a good idea: if you can't beat 'em join 'em, and just balance around that. You could still make various mission types more profitable at various economies or system states to encourage movement.

The Fed/Imp ranks also are odd, and I agree with swearing to a power BUT blocking content behind a wall sucks too, so I would add really expensive black market Cutter/Corvette etc. or something. Heck the Imps could, after you rank up enough, sell you captured Corvettes if you want or something.

 

[reazon19]

Yeah link worked. I suspect the instance flipping is a game design issue that isn't easily fixed or it would have been already. That's honestly why I think just increasing the available missions in station and adding filters is a good idea: if you can't beat 'em join 'em, and just balance around that. You could still make various mission types more profitable at various economies or system states to encourage movement.

The Fed/Imp ranks also are odd, and I agree with swearing to a power BUT blocking content behind a wall sucks too, so I would add really expensive black market Cutter/Corvette etc. or something. Heck the Imps could, after you rank up enough, sell you captured Corvettes if you want or something.

Or we could get them at some anarchy systems at a higher price. Cuz you know, pirates could steal ships and if you're aligned with a power they might not be so pleased dealing with those who have chosen a more structured lifestyle. I know most wouldn't want to pay extra but it makes some kind of sense on some level.

 

[Chorda]

Agreed, OP, there's a lot of internal inconsistencies with Elite, which is unfortunate, though hard to avoid.

It's a pedestrian point that 3304 will look nothing like the world Elite envisions, as it's one informed by 20th century science fiction and early space exploration. We're on the verge of photo-realistic VR technology, true AI, limitless fusion energy (15 years off according to the latest projections), and a possible paradigm shift into understanding reality as a holographic 2-dimensional universe (if current theories hold). Quite possibly, this sort of science fiction setting will soon seem as likely as Middle Earth.

 

[Eriseley]

Or we could get them at some anarchy systems at a higher price. Cuz you know, pirates could steal ships and if you're aligned with a power they might not be so pleased dealing with those who have chosen a more structured lifestyle. I know most wouldn't want to pay extra but it makes some kind of sense on some level.

Yeah absolutely, in fact making Anarchy into it's own faction you don't "swear" to but stick with would be interesting. In an old game Escape Velocity I played, which was itself inspired by Elite I think, they essentially had this in outskirts systems, and you could become entirely unwelcome in civ space but base out there.

 

[reazon19]

Can't argue there.

BTW, thanks for being constructive rather than attacking. I wish more people would contribute to this thread because it seems like better progress and discussion about topics than most threads I've read. Even though it's a slim chance that FDev will read this, and even a slimmer chance that they'll actually implenent any of this, it seems like the kind of thread so far that they are actually looking for in regards to comminuty input. Thanks.

 

[Eriseley]

Can't argue there.

BTW, thanks for being constructive rather than attacking. I wish more people would contribute to this thread because it seems like better progress and discussion about topics than most threads I've read. Even though it's a slim chance that FDev will read this, and even a slimmer chance that they'll actually implenent any of this, it seems like the kind of thread so far that they are actually looking for in regards to comminuty input. Thanks.

My guess is they read it and are taking it to heart, but really if I'm understanding correctly, the roots of the game are like a nest egg of the Frontier big wigs, plus Kickstarter funds, to kind of piecemeal a game together, and it just happened to be pretty successful, but hasn't exploded into World of Warcraft. So they have a limited game they don't really have the capital reasons to entirely redo. So we're kinda stuck with this general structure. :\

 

[Alex Brentnall]

Fair points, the only thing I'd bring up about the SRV is the speed. It does 40 odd m/s at top speed over rough terrain which translates to about 90mph. Scale is a bit off on planets... or should I say sense of scale. The vehicle is actually really damn good and the suspension is pretty solid considering the speeds and terrain.

Yeah I agree a hoverbike or whatever would be a cooler thing, I still hope more SRV types are in the offing for the Q4 exploration update this year.

 

[Bortas]

A recent example was the forum post about the SRV. It seems like a completely reasonable assumption that 1300 years into the future we wouldn't be using land rovers that we, even in this day and age, have already presumably considered outdated. I'm not saying we should be driving Mass Effect stlye rovers, but we definitely shouldn't be driving millennial old designs of a navigational vehicle. The argument is fair.

Always bothered me that I have to drive a wheeled vehicle while skimmers are flying around me everywhere. Goliaths are even bigger than an SRV... I want one.

 

[Schmack]

Anything you create in 2018 will look like something created in 2018 since you cannot move into the future to compare.

Use Star Trek as an example. For some reason the weapons they used looked like guns. They could fragment into molecules and be reproduced aboard a ship with everything intact, but they had a shuttle that looked like a cargo van and big incandescent indicators that flashed (in sequence, per Shatner).

FFWD to today's verson. The Enterprise looks different inside and out. It doesn't look like the future, it looks like right now. We don't know what the future looks like.