The "God Roll" grind

Darkslayer

Darkslayer
It seems like a pointless discussion to me. Most of the talk I see concerning Beyond Eng. is about whether the new G5 rolls will be better than the old. To me it is a pointless discussion and here is why.

Most players do not participate in PvP. I love engineering both the old way and probably will the new as well. There is never a grind for me as the only mats I have ever needed to at least get grade 4 Eng was acquired during regular play. I haven't once scavenged a planet for anything. I actually enjoyed most of the unlocking requirements for the engineers as it made me see new sides of the game.
In the end here is what it has done for me.

My Viper 4 with no more than G4 upgrades can now fire gimballed C1 beams almost indefinately without any pips to weapons. This allows me greater speed and agility especially with DD tuning. I now have plenty of power to run whatever loadout I want. I can jump almost 30 ly in full multi role spec. Engineering has enabled me to lessen the negative traits of the ship I prefer to fly and I am more capable in all aspects of PvE.
I think the ENG discussion puts too much emphasis on the 2 tier mentality. I am perfectly happy with having a tier that is somewhere in between. If the new system offers even more flexibility in the builds then bravo FD.

PS. To all those who whine about FD not implementing "promised content", this game has more than enough content for the measley 60 bucks I have invested.
 

IndigoWyrd

IndigoWyrd
Darkslayer said:
It seems like a pointless discussion to me. Most of the talk I see concerning Beyond Eng. is about whether the new G5 rolls will be better than the old. To me it is a pointless discussion and here is why.

Most players do not participate in PvP. I love engineering both the old way and probably will the new as well. There is never a grind for me as the only mats I have ever needed to at least get grade 4 Eng was acquired during regular play. I haven't once scavenged a planet for anything. I actually enjoyed most of the unlocking requirements for the engineers as it made me see new sides of the game.
In the end here is what it has done for me.

My Viper 4 with no more than G4 upgrades can now fire gimballed C1 beams almost indefinately without any pips to weapons. This allows me greater speed and agility especially with DD tuning. I now have plenty of power to run whatever loadout I want. I can jump almost 30 ly in full multi role spec. Engineering has enabled me to lessen the negative traits of the ship I prefer to fly and I am more capable in all aspects of PvE.
I think the ENG discussion puts too much emphasis on the 2 tier mentality. I am perfectly happy with having a tier that is somewhere in between. If the new system offers even more flexibility in the builds then bravo FD.

PS. To all those who whine about FD not implementing "promised content", this game has more than enough content for the measley 60 bucks I have invested.
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I've scavenged many planets, many times. I happen to enjoy it, though it's usually cargo that I'm scavenging, not materials.
But I do materials scavenging too - so much so I built a ship for it - only real use I've ever found for an Asp Scout actually.

Again, it's something I enjoy doing.

I didn't hate the old Engineering system, I don't hate the 3.0 Engineering system.

I still see room for a lot of improvement in it, but that's something that will likely work itself out in the end.

I've never spent hours on end re-rolling anything in the old system, but I did do a good bit of side-by-side, point-for-point comparing during the beta. My overall finding is that there are only a few instances where older versions of modules actually had any advantage over new ones, and seldom were any of these "critical". But variety?

That's really going to have to wait to be seen. We tend to be creatures of habit after all.
 

Straha Yeagar

S
Engineering is a grind if one chooses to make it a grind. I can see how PvP combat enthusiasts could view it that way as they tend to feel as if they have to have god rolls for every module in order to be competitive. Many of their multiple ships have several of the same modules be it weapons or various utility mounted modules. The new system with moving the rank off of the engineer onto the individual module will cause the grinders to grind, but given how many updates and changes have been made over the past few years that have been combat focused with the PvP crowd gaining far more benefit that any other group, I have a difficult time having sympathy for them, especially with the new changes, because it is kind of exactly what they asked for.
 

Deleted member 110222

D
Grind is fine... As long as it only rewards. Current (thankfully soon dead) system usually demands payment, yet often gives nothing in return. In fact, it often gives a negative result. That's just stupid.

Each roll in the new system could only give 0.5% improvements. I'd still prefer it... Because it does irrefutably gives rewards for effort. I don't care about the size of the reward.
 

Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
Just because it doesn't apply to you, doesn't not mean it is without merit.
I've spent a lot of time "paying entry" to do pvp, and if I were to be cut off from having equivalent equipment now, then the game and all the progress I've made would be "objectively" pointless.

The grandfathering of god rolls is a big deal whether it affects you or not.
If not playing pvp your weapons etc and their relative strengths to other players are indeed meaningless, so then one's input should probably be given similar weight.
 

sb413197

S
I think they’ve got it right now. New rolls are on par with the best rolls in the old system, and instead of 2000 plus roles per MODULE to get there, it’s 250 rolls per SHIP.

For those saying “I just wanted to do 5 rolls per module!”, no problem, get the grade 5 mats for 5 rolls and use the material trader to get the materials for the grade 1-4 rolls. Use the last 2 rolls for your grade 5 - no need to max it. Problem solved.
 

Ryoken

Ryoken
Alonya Ruslana said:
Grind is fine... As long as it only rewards. Current (thankfully soon dead) system usually demands payment, yet often gives nothing in return. In fact, it often gives a negative result. That's just stupid.

Each roll in the new system could only give 0.5% improvements. I'd still prefer it... Because it does irrefutably gives rewards for effort. I don't care about the size of the reward.
Click to expand...

This is exactly why I love the new system. It may not give people that instant gratification, instead it turns all rolls into positive gains. I'll take more time to build a ship over time than to continue to roll the dice for that elusive "god roll" when a distinct possibility is that I'll never see it no matter how many rolls I throw out.
 

Starender

Starender
Ryoken said:
This is exactly why I love the new system. It may not give people that instant gratification, instead it turns all rolls into positive gains. I'll take more time to build a ship over time than to continue to roll the dice for that elusive "god roll" when a distinct possibility is that I'll never see it no matter how many rolls I throw out.
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Same
 

cyberus

C
Bob Lighthouse said:
Just because it doesn't apply to you, doesn't not mean it is without merit.
I've spent a lot of time "paying entry" to do pvp, and if I were to be cut off from having equivalent equipment now, then the game and all the progress I've made would be "objectively" pointless.

The grandfathering of god rolls is a big deal whether it affects you or not.
If not playing pvp your weapons etc and their relative strengths to other players are indeed meaningless, so then one's input should probably be given similar weight.
Click to expand...

As a PVP player you are exactly one who must to understand and support this happening in 3.0.

Yes its effects everybody but it is very needed change..... defenetly to pvp side.

Or you are the one PVPer who's want to have advantage over the others who by no means could get exact same results as your god rolls?
 

Darkslayer

Darkslayer
I'm just saying that probably only 5% of us are PvP'ers. For everyone else Engineering is fine as it is and will be better than it was.
 

Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
cyberus said:
As a PVP player you are exactly one who must to understand and support this happening in 3.0.

Yes its effects everybody but it is very needed change..... defenetly to pvp side.

Or you are the one PVPer who's want to have advantage over the others who by no means could get exact same results as your god rolls?
Click to expand...


I'm not sure I am understanding you correctly but I do *not* currently posses any true god rolls, despite having done hundreds and hundreds of rolls.

The majority of experienced PVP players I've been reading from, would actually prefer a nerf to the old modules, instead the proposed buffed engineering mods.
I defer to them, but Frontier has been clear about attempting to buff instead.

I personally have not read anyone saying they want to keep an unfair advantage, not one.

That seems just like an ugly strawman.
 

Starender

Starender
Bob Lighthouse said:
I'm not sure I am understanding you correctly but I do *not* currently posses any true god rolls, despite having done hundreds and hundreds of rolls.

The majority of experienced PVP players I've been reading from, would actually prefer a nerf to the old modules, instead the proposed buffed engineering mods.
I defer to them, but Frontier has been clear about attempting to buff instead.

I personally have not read anyone saying they want to keep an unfair advantage, not one.

That seems just like an ugly strawman.
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I've seen exactly the opposite, most people tend to prefer buffs instead of nerfs, and trust me Frontier knows that, if they dare nerf anything its the apocalypse in the forum
 

Bob Lighthouse

Banned
Bob Lighthouse
Starender said:
I've seen exactly the opposite, most people tend to prefer buffs instead of nerfs, and trust me Frontier knows that, if they dare nerf anything its the apocalypse in the forum
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To be fair, I generally don't read what inexperienced, non-invested people say.
Could be selection bias, but I stand by that nonetheless.
It fits with my previous premise after all.

There are people with orderS of magnitude more rolls than I saying exactly what I am suggesting above, in this thread below.
We're talking in the tens of thousands of rolls.


https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/402587-Grandfathering-problems-The-Rail-Gun
 
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