The problem with the new C&P improvements

[Earth Ultimatum IV.]

Yeah, new C&P improvements, all nice.

But this is all extremly easy to abuse against other players. Dishonorable PVPers who will interdict you asking for a duel, but turn crimes ON when they start losing, or people who lure you into shooting first. You will become wanted and all of these C&P improvements will punish YOU even though you're not the one who started a fight. We've also seen fights where the enemy wing had crimes OFF but they had a healer with them who had crimes ON. Shooting the healer made you wanted, even though they started the fight and all of them were wanted except the healer.


There has to be a clear way of telling who has crimes ON and who has them OFF. This way we can also tell who's looking for a fight and thus not waste time on PVEers. The option should be locked during fights to prevent switching and luring too.[alien]

 

[Truesilver]

I completely agree. Fiddling with report crimes on/off has every capacity to become a real form of nuisance trolling as C&P improves.

Also, I sincerely hope that Powerplay v Powerplay pledged attacks will not result in Pilots Federation bounties (assuming not of same power or superpower, of course).

From a RP/Lore perspective it is reasonable to suppose that clandestine operatives would be forbidden from drawing such things to the attention of the Pilots Federation, and from a gameplay perspective Powerplay needs all the help it can get.

Indeed, if those who are inclined to attack Clean Cmdrs are drawn towards Powerplay and Pledger v Pledger violence, everybody wins.

 

[RagingxPenguin]

You both are on the same page as me
I'm desperately hoping FDev was not so short sighted!

 

[Deleted member 115407]

If it's currently possible to toggle crimes mid-combat, that needs to change.

 

[RagingxPenguin]

It happens all the time. Its a real treat.
I love when you have a 3 v 3 that turns into a 11 on 3 and they still try to talk smack after.

 

[Terry Bruge-Hiplo]

A cooldown between being able to toggle it on/off might help too...

 

[z993126]

Complaining "they started the fight!" does no good if you engaged in it of your own accord. How can someone lure you into shooting first? That's your decision and moral failing.

 

[Deleted member 115407]

We've also seen fights where the enemy wing had crimes OFF but they had a healer with them who had crimes ON. Shooting the healer made you wanted, even though they started the fight and all of them were wanted except the healer.

Perhaps another mechanic needs to be added, wherein winging would sync up crimes status to whoever sent the invite, thus preventing mixed groups.

 

[Deleted member 110222]

Simple fix.

The game already knows when you're in combat, given the fifteen second log-out countdown.

Just put in a bit of code disabling the report crimes option toggle when that timer is also primed for use.

This way, a player can choose before leaving the station, if they want report crimes on or off.

Even easier, would be to make the report crimes toggle only available whilst in a hangar.

 

[Earth Ultimatum IV.]

Complaining "they started the fight!" does no good if you engaged in it of your own accord. How can someone lure you into shooting first? That's your decision and moral failing.

No it's not. You get interdicted. However, since you yourself have crimes OFF and are looking for PVP, they will not get wanted despite attacking you, but you will be wanted the moment you react. Which makes no sense.


The current system is assuming that there are only two kinds of PVP: organic PVP in the game, with bounty hunters going after pirates, pirates going after traders, and with faction warfare... And pre-arranged fights where everyone agreed to disable crimes.

There's also a third type of PVP, which is going to a CG and looking for randoms who are interested in PVP. The problem is that these randoms are many times trolls who activate crimes ON when they start losing or will interdict you. Which makes no sense.




Make the crime setting status visible. Alternative would be to add a third crime reporting option - "Disable if target has disabled", so if they activate crimes ON during the fight, they will make themselves wanted (however this may not work, because they can activate crimes ON and wait for you to hit them first, also exploitable).

 

[Jukelo]

I see no problem here, do your duels in anarchy if you can't trust the other side for respecting your gentlemen's agreement.

I'd rather see Frontier work on stuff that matters, like organic PvP happening because one side has a real goal that can be achieved by the use of violence rather than try and catter specifically to that misguided " consensual PvP " nonsense.

 

[Chorda]

Alternatively, move the report crimes toggle to the power authority tab of stations ('Disconnect from Crime Database' or whatever).

 

[simo2003]

Agreed, this could potentially be a big problem.

 

[Earth Ultimatum IV.]

I see no problem here, do your duels in anarchy if you can't trust the other side for respecting your gentlemen's agreement.

That's not how PVP works.

Also there's literally no reason not to add what I'm asking for. It's going to make the life of actual PVPers easier and will remove exploits, with no downsides at all.

 

[Konnivar]

Reporting Crimes on should work both ways, if you have report crimes on and the other person doesn't you should still become wanted; make it a double edged sword. Also toggling in combat really shouldn't be a thing and I like the idea of being able to see who has crimes turned off.

 

[Jukelo]

That's not how PVP works.

Also there's literally no reason not to add what I'm asking for. It's going to make the life of actual PVPers easier and will remove exploits, with no downsides at all.

Switching crimes on mid-fight is and should remain a legit tactic in policed systems. If one side decides they no longer want to play fair and they are technically in the right, then they should be able to.

 

[Earth Ultimatum IV.]

Switching crimes on mid-fight is and should remain a legit tactic in policed systems.

No it should not. It's completly idiotic.

 

[Riverside]

This seems like a bit of a first world problem to me. Surely part of the game is learning who you can trust & who you cannot.

I think the issue described is just a remnant of a playstyle that took advantage of a loophole that has now been closed.

 

[JonLuis69]

I mean, does there really have to be a problem? Every single announcement it seems we get "the problem with that is...".
I think some people min/max the problems rather than just accept the gradual but ever improving nature of the game.

 

[Earth Ultimatum IV.]

I mean, does there really have to be a problem? Every single announcement it seems we get "the problem with that is...".
I think some people min/max the problems rather than just accept the gradual but ever improving nature of the game.

It is a big problem. If you increase the punishment for a crime, you must also make the crime detection better to avoid unfair punishment and trolling.

I think some people min/max the problems rather than just accept the gradual but ever improving nature of the game.

Depends on your point of view. This would actually be a massive downgrade for any legit PVPer.