Hardware & Technical The Sony VR Headset discussion thread

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
This may be a little bit premature, but given the third-party leaks it seems to be worth asking:

Will Elite Dangerous support Sony's new VR headset (to be announced this afternoon)? Have the Frontier developers been lucky enough to receive a dev kit? C'mon, you know you want to tell us!
 

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
Rog said:
Isn't it likely that Sony's HMD will be just for the PS4?
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Perhaps. But that would be incredibly short-sighted of them, given that they *know* there's a market screaming out for these products.

Also, DB has said he would be interested in developing for the current generation of consoles.
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
JohnStabler said:
Perhaps. But that would be incredibly short-sighted of them, given that they *know* there's a market screaming out for these products.

Also, DB has said he would be interested in developing for the current generation of consoles.
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Sony VR has always been for PlayStation platform exclusively. It also always have costed arm and leg.
 

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
Pecisk said:
Sony VR has always been for PlayStation platform exclusively. It also always have costed arm and leg.
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Sony's Glasstron HMD had VGA input. Methinks that was a PC device. So if Sony is willing to make PC compatible HMDs then I don't think it's too much of a stretch...

Plus, Playstation peripherals use USB so it would be a bit shortsighted for them not to add compatibility...
 

KING5TON

KING5TON
I'd say it'd be short sighted of them just to limit it to PS4 unless they believe that PS4 exclusivity would shift more PS4 units.

I personally wouldn't buy a PS4 just for this. Considering that the PS4 only runs games like BF4 at 900p you'd think it would struggle to output a decent resolution at a rock solid 60fps on basically 2 screens.

According to the OR team you need constant 60fps for a decent VR experience.

If it turns out that Sony's effect is as good as the proposed OR Retail version or better and isn't too expensive and works on the PC I'd be interested.

I was amazed when I got to borrow an OR dev kit for a few days and I'm awaiting the retail version with bated breath.
 

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
KING5TON said:
I'd say it'd be short sighted of them just to limit it to PS4 unless they believe that PS4 exclusivity would shift more PS4 units.

I personally wouldn't buy a PS4 just for this. Considering that the PS4 only runs games like BF4 at 900p you'd think it would struggle to output a decent resolution at a rock solid 60fps on basically 2 screens.

According to the OR team you need constant 60fps for a decent VR experience.

If it turns out that Sony's effect is as good as the proposed OR Retail version or better and isn't too expensive and works on the PC I'd be interested.

I was amazed when I got to borrow an OR dev kit for a few days and I'm awaiting the retail version with bated breath.
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The problem with OR is that they've taken a long time to get to a commercial product. While I understand that product development takes quite a while, Sony may have the opportunity to pip them at the post if, as you say, they deliver a resonably priced product that is at least as good.
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
JohnStabler said:
The problem with OR is that they've taken a long time to get to a commercial product. While I understand that product development takes quite a while, Sony may have the opportunity to pip them at the post if, as you say, they deliver a resonably priced product that is at least as good.
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Not really. People knowledgeable about Sony VR says it has completely different goals and aren't aimed at games.
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
JohnStabler said:
Who are these knowledgeable people? Care to cite this authority, given that nothing has been announced yet?

I'll admit it's speculation, but I am going off media reporting; which is framing it as a potential competitor to Oculus Rift http://www.edge-online.com/news/son...esents-virtual-reality-gamings-greatest-hope/
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Previous Sony VR where low on specs and aimed mostly at virtual experiences and watching movies. Media is very well known doing articles about subjects they don't know nothing much about. Calling Sony VR a competitor of OR is quite laughable.
 

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
Pecisk said:
Previous Sony VR where low on specs and aimed mostly at virtual experiences and watching movies. Media is very well known doing articles about subjects they don't know nothing much about. Calling Sony VR a competitor of OR is quite laughable.
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So you don't believe it possible for Sony to develop more modern technology, aimed at gaming rather than just passive content?
 

Commander Thane

Commander Thane
Pecisk said:
Previous Sony VR where low on specs and aimed mostly at virtual experiences and watching movies. Media is very well known doing articles about subjects they don't know nothing much about. Calling Sony VR a competitor of OR is quite laughable.
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Key word here is previous.

This: http://www.stuff.tv/sony-set-reveal-oculus-rift-vr-gaming-headset-gdc-next-week/news is a new product, which "will be revealed at GDC". After that we can make up our own minds. Although I suspect actual prices will be a long way off.

The best outcome for consumers will be that all these devices offer a simple, transparent interface for developers - rather than a weighty set of proprietary requirements. The latter would result in specific titles or platforms being bound to one headset or another - bad for consumers and bad for the VR market in general. A VHS vs Betamax war sounds nice in principle but in reality, early adopters get screwed over price, 50% of those early adopters end up with obsolete products and the rest of the mass market stay away for years until a clearly cost-effective standard is introduced.

On the other hand, a nice easy implementation for developers* would mean that all devices could be supported on all games and consumers could make effective choices quickly, resulting in lower earlier prices for everybody.

*in our feature on David Braben in our last podcast - DB indicated that implementing Oculus Rift in time for Alpha was surprisingly uncomplicated - this is the level all devices need to set.
 

Cmdr Eagleboy

Cmdr Eagleboy
holdmykidney said:
Key word here is previous.

This: http://www.stuff.tv/sony-set-reveal-oculus-rift-vr-gaming-headset-gdc-next-week/news is a new product, which "will be revealed at GDC". After that we can make up our own minds. Although I suspect actual prices will be a long way off.

The best outcome for consumers will be that all these devices offer a simple, transparent interface for developers - rather than a weighty set of proprietary requirements. The latter would result in specific titles or platforms being bound to one headset or another - bad for consumers and bad for the VR market in general. A VHS vs Betamax war sounds nice in principle but in reality, early adopters get screwed over price, 50% of those early adopters end up with obsolete products and the rest of the mass market stay away for years until a clearly cost-effective standard is introduced.

On the other hand, a nice easy implementation for developers* would mean that all devices could be supported on all games and consumers could make effective choices quickly, resulting in lower earlier prices for everybody.

*in our feature on David Braben in our last podcast - DB indicated that implementing Oculus Rift in time for Alpha was surprisingly uncomplicated - this is the level all devices need to set.
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Valve already working on open VR API together with OR. However I don't expect Sony to support it any time soon.

JohnStabler said:
So you don't believe it possible for Sony to develop more modern technology, aimed at gaming rather than just passive content?
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Not at this point, no. Of course, I can be wrong, but frankly I don't believe I will be.
 
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Commander Thane

Commander Thane
Expectations and opinions are always wonderful - we wouldn't have a podcast if we waited for solid facts before broadcasting a discussion - but surely it's better to have solid facts before making a final decision on a product's viability or apotheosis?
 

Shigawire

Shigawire
It is rather sad and perplexing that a mega-corporation like Sony, with all their resources, hasn't been able to launch the VR revolution.. It took a young guy in his parents' garage to kickstart this revolution.. and now Sony wants to join the party.

Sure, Sony has already tons of VR-related patents and they are extremely savvy with regards to hardware. But now that Sony is revealing its VR technology, I am sad to see everyone and their mom suddenly jumping in excitement. Wasn't Oculus Rift impressive enough? They needed to see this tech being launched by a johnny-come-lately, BEFORE being convinced?
Even all the articles about the Oculus Rift, all the videos, everyone explaining to people how remarkable this is.. they have refused to find it interesting. But as soon as Sony teases a reveal, everyone on my facebook started to show excitement.

The fact is, all the really hard work in implementing VR, overcoming the problems, coming up with solutions, has already been handled by Oculus, Valve and others. And these are in favor of an open platform. I wouldn't be surprised if Sony starts to wave its giant patent portfolio against Oculus and others, and start patent trolling.. I wouldn't be surprised if Sony wants a closed and proprietary standard, and forcing developers to adopt it. I can already see it coming, Sony VR© or PS VR®

Thankfully, I suspect Nvidia will be a strong buffer against this kind of move, because Sony partners with AMD.. which is Nvidia's greatest competitor.

I don't want to see a repeat of the BluRay vs HD-DVD - or VHS vs Betamax.. or OpenGL vs Direct3D

With all that said, I am in favor of competition! In the near future though, I think the Virtual Retina display technology of Avegant Glyph will be superior to any AMOLED + lens displays. The field of view of the Avegant Glyph was purposely nerfed in order to accomodate video viewing in a small form factor. There is no reason why the virtual retina display can't operate at a higher field of view. The benefits of the virtual retina display are enormous:

-perfect image quality (for the resolution)
-zero screen door effect (no distance between pixels)
-perfect and natural photon transmission, zero "screen fatigue" on the eyes
-smaller form factor, less weight on the head
-uses far less power

I wouldn't be surprised if Oculus VR some time in the future buys up the Avegant company. Or maybe Sony does it.

Also, it has to be said that the hardware in a Playstation 4 will have a hard time handling VR content of sufficiently high quality. The CPU, GPU and RAM in a PS4 are completely "below average" compared to today's PC hardware.
Sony will have to be able to deliver a rendering framerate of 2x60fps (or 2x30fps with proper screen syncing). And in order to achieve that with a PS4, the graphics fidelity will have to be significantly reduced.
 
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Slawkenbergius

Slawkenbergius
I thought that David Braben already hinted somewhere that they would try to support all the various VR devices that gained traction in the market. They're not tied to Oculus by any exclusivity arrangement, and adding support for a different flavour of VR will probably be fairly trivial, and add value to the COBRA engine.

On another thread, I teasingly suggested that Frontier's recent £3.75m deal to produce two games for a new hardware platform might even be Sony VR.
 

JohnStabler

JohnStabler
Much as I like and respect Oculus for their commitment to bringing VR to the mass market and their adoption of open standards, they have not succeeded in getting a consumer model available. It seems their quest for improvement (read: scope creep) have led them to hold off on producing something that the public could actually buy. From the POV of the early-adopter consumer, this is a big mistake.

I know a not insubstantial number of people that would buy a VR headset tomrrow if it could do what the Oculus currently does with a higher resolution screen.

Slawkenbergius said:
I thought that David Braben already hinted somewhere that they would try to support all the various VR devices that gained traction in the market. They're not tied to Oculus by any exclusivity arrangement, and adding support for a different flavour of VR will probably be fairly trivial, and add value to the COBRA engine.

On another thread, I teasingly suggested that Frontier's recent £3.75m deal to produce two games for a new hardware platform might even be Sony VR.
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I would love for you to be right.

I believe we only have to wait until 5PM GMT when GDC 2014 kicks off before we see if there's a chance you're right...
 
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