The Steam Workshop and downvotes - my thoughts...

[shaneturner12]

Hi fellow members,

This is something that's been bugging me for some time and I'm interested in hearing others thoughts relating to this.

Like everyone else, I end up with downvotes (negative rates) on items I create. That's normal I'd say.

The bit that does annoy me though is that those downvoting in most cases don't leave a comment explaining why they downvoted an item.

It makes me wonder if they are simply doing it out of spite or jealousy when doing it in that way or whether they want to simply make their own items better since a downvote pushes the affected item further down the list. I've decided to not say much until now but I feel it's something that a certain part of the community is doing to affect the majority.

Whilst I can't do anything about it as one person, if I can make people think twice when downvoting and getting them to leave a comment to explain why, I feel I would be getting somewhere. In some cases, I can understand a downvote in certain situations like blatant copying of another creators item (although a comment explaining this would also help to warn subscribers).

I'm interested in other peoples thoughts on this rather thorny topic as the Steam Workshop is one of the main parts of this game - please keep it polite though.

Shane

 

[Helena]

I think it is jealousy.

 

[shaneturner12]

I'd say you're probably right there Helena. It's interesting that they choose not to say anything when they do downvote though.

Thankyou for your thoughts on it though - I do appreciate it.

Shane

 

[Coastercad]

Well, everyone is different and likes things for different reasons, and also downvotes things for different reasons. Some may do it out of jealousy, others because they genuinely don't like it. I personally don't downvote anything, because I think whenever someone puts something on the workshop they have done it to the best of their abilities in the given time, and should be proud of creating something. Thing is, the button is there and we are going to have to live with it. The button would probably be best replaced by something that could tag an item as offensive. At least that would make sense, where as downvoting creativity does not. Anyways, i wouldn't worrie to much about the downvoters, and instead take that time to appreciate the joy the upvoterrs give you.
Judging by your post i would say you would like some constructive feedback. I would try and resort to other means for that instead of the steam workshop. Maybe ask some builders you appreciate the creations of on one of the discord channels you are on for some feedback. I know everyone is busy these days and short on time, but asking doesn't hurt anyone, and I am sure anyone would be honored to be asked for feedback as it is a token of appreciation, even if you get no for answer because of todays hasty society.

Cheers,

 

[Palaber1984]

I think it is more out of spite

 

[shaneturner12]

Thankyou for your feedback Coastercad and Palaber1984 - it does give more possibilities on why downvoting happens as well.

At a personal level I very rarely downvote anything unless it's a blatant copy of what someone else has made or something similarly serious (I leave them a comment though).

I also agree Coastercad regarding constructive feedback and that everyone is different which I do get through different methods (and I'm guessing quite a few others do). I'm also open to negative feedback although when people do negatively rate, it doesn't give much of an indication (unless they also leave a comment) as to why. I also agree that an alternative button may help as well. The way I've learnt things is that if I don't like something I either tell the creator what is wrong with it or I simply don't rate.

I'm also appreciative when I get upvotes as well as feedback although I'm also trying to work out the reasoning behind downvoting without commenting (the main focus of this thread) although it has given me some ideas on why.

Shane

 

[Palaber1984]

Maybe ask some builders you appreciate the creations of on one of the discord channels you are on for some feedback. I know everyone is busy these days and short on time, but asking doesn't hurt anyone, and I am sure anyone would be honored to be asked for feedback as it is a token of appreciation, even if you get no for answer because of todays hasty society.
Cheers,

Asking? Why? There are a lot videos on YouTube that explain exactly how to build something. I asked month ago and didn’t get a answer. I realized that I don’t need that. I think I’m on the same level like any other featured builder. My only problem I have a family, childhood and working hard. These “great” builders sitting 24/7 and may don’t have nothing other to do.

So don’t ask them. Look videos and guides and try to recreate something that isn’t a copy but your own vision.

 

[redrum]

... out of spite or jealousy when doing it in that way or whether they want to simply make their own items better since a downvote pushes the affected item further down the list.

Negative ratings are counted independently, they don't subtract from the number of positive ratings.

Star ratings don't make it to 5 stars until at least 200 positive ratings are achieved. You could have 150 positive ratings and zero negative ratings but your item will still only be 3 stars because you need more than 200 positives for 5 stars.

OP, can we see your workshop? Where's the link?

There's nothing wrong with negative ratings, it means someone thinks your item could be better. Maybe it contains too many pieces, or is sloppy in some way, or doesn't fit the search criteria they were looking for when finding your item.

Or perhaps someone thinks it has too many ratings for what it is. Eg, there's many "popular" items on the workshop which are nothing special at all. yet are in top 3 most popular in last week or even three months when searching for a "wall" for example.

That's the other point, the default sorting criteria on the workshop is "relevance" not popularity. Again searching for "wall" you get disappointing and almost worthless first page results on a set of 68 page results. This last example "wall" has 42 subscribers! IT'S ONE WALL PIECE !!! That's twice as many subscribers as my poor little dog I spent an hour making!

 

[shaneturner12]

Thank you for your feedback redrum. I was actually being general but if you want to have a look at my workshop you're welcome to - it's at http://steamcommunity.com/id/shaneturner12/myworkshopfiles/?appid=493340. I've been working to improve on the workshop though so my earlier builds aren't much good.

From memory it's 150 rates for 5 stars but that brings another interesting point regarding downvotes and that is that it means more upvotes are needed to get anything above 3 stars.

However, the main point of this isn't necessarily the downvote itself - it's more to do with not knowing why the downvote was made.

I agree also that the sorting mechanism can also be an issue as some items can be rather simple compared to others.

Shane

 

[redrum]

it's more to do with not knowing why the downvote was made.

That implies you're fine with not knowing why the upvote is made, so long as you get an upvote.

Explanations for why people like your work are just as important as why they don't like it. Often people will choose to upvote even when they have reservations about some aspects of your work. We do that all the time in the name of encouragement and good will, such as when applauding the efforts of a child learning to paint.

Your most recent item - Haunted Hotel, you say in your description to leave an explanation for downvotes. Well, one possible criticism is that structurally it's missing load-bearing support on that front section. The outer window frames would not be enough support for the weight of two stories of building above. I wouldn't downvote you on this, but I wouldn't upvote or subscribe on that point. I just like realism, and it looks "wrong" to my eyes. Your hotel looks good at night from a distance though, which will be fine for a lot of people.

You're also using the "deep" windows on a flat surface, but the deep windows are better suited for the roof part of a house. This dolls house is an example of how those windows are better placed. At the moment on your hotel they look sort of stuck out, not part of the building, but there's no rules.... if you are happy, then other people will be happy and it looks like you get a lot of happy subscribers. Just don't interpret upvotes as validaton, it's a social media trap! [big grin]

 

[shaneturner12]

Thank you for getting back to me on that redrum and I also appreciate your feedback (I can make use of that for future projects). I've also learnt something new regarding the deep windows as well.

I agree that comments with positive upvotes are also helpful particularly for encouragement. I sometimes get feedback in the form of comments and sometimes not on that front although sometimes I'm guessing it's a time factor.

Shane

 

[Chems]

That implies you're fine with not knowing why the upvote is made, so long as you get an upvote.

There is a difference. When you get an upvote, you can just keep doing what you do, since your creation is good enough. However, when someone gives you a downvote without feedback, you don't know what you need to do to improve.

 

[Helena]

I think it is silly to downvote just because you dislike it. There's so many things on the workshop and it is not for everyone to like same things.

I have never ever downvoted but I have written comments when I found something that was troubling. Things I did not like in the end? I just simply unsubscribe them.

 

[Helena]

also that "wall" example, is from way in beginning. Very early blueprints get much attention.

 

[shaneturner12]

There is a difference. When you get an upvote, you can just keep doing what you do, since your creation is good enough. However, when someone gives you a downvote without feedback, you don't know what you need to do to improve.

Exactly (and thankyou for your feedback there Chems). It's the not knowing side when it comes to downvotes that worries me.

Shane

 

[shaneturner12]

Thankyou for your feedback Helena - I appreciate it (like all other responses here).

I think it is silly to downvote just because you dislike it. There's so many things on the workshop and it is not for everyone to like same things.

I have never ever downvoted but I have written comments when I found something that was troubling. Things I did not like in the end? I just simply unsubscribe them.

That's what I often do regarding comments/unsubscribing. I can't understand why someone would downvote something if they simply don't like it.

also that "wall" example, is from way in beginning. Very early blueprints get much attention.

I thought it looked like an early blueprint and I can agree that the early ones do sometimes get quite a bit of attention.

Shane