The textures for Western scenery

[Sclurp]

Howdy y'all,

The textures for the western scenery are of a level of quality that makes me think they were probably just thrown into PC2 directly from 1 and not given a sequel facelift.
If they had been re-made for PC2, then I believe there's an issue here rendering them at a quality that's vastly inferior to the rest of the game's assets.

At the base size, without scaling up, the textures are very muddy.

I am just posting this with the hope that:
1, You can have another crack at it or fix the issue and improve the visual appearance of these assets.
2, You can ensure future returning scenery is handled with more care and given a Sequel Treatment over a direct porting over.

And to add one final point. With a sequel, I think I can speak for a fair few people when I relay that when people said they wanted the classic themes from the first game (and other games in this genre, such as RCT), I thought of PC2's take on the theme. I.e. maybe some returning scenery pieces (sure, that's perfectly reasonable), AND new western scenery. New pirate scenery etc etc.
I think the base game scenery (aquatic, viking etc) is still lacking and should be still receiving pieces and animatronics too.

So while I do appreciate what the update brought, to an extent, it's a bit of a disappointment in some areas too. I actually just quit out of the game (in no dramatic way at all) when I saw the western pieces. Just because they were so low quality I didn't want to invest time into making a new park with those pieces.

 

[Valdo82]

I think everyone agree's on that, but this is the gist.

In someway I appreciate it, simply because it was probably eye opening to some people:

- Many people said, yeah they should put all the old scenery in and the best way: fast and for free. Cause it is sooo easy to port them from pc1 to pc2.

Yeah, we know got the piece in a low cost / low effort way. We now have 300 assets for free with nothing to complain about, cause we as a community demanded them for free in this way. We lost a lot of leverage here, cause it was a gift and due to the amount we probably have to appreciate it at first.

If this was a paid dlc, we probably could cry a lot about it and with right, but right now, we are somehow put in the place.

PC2 did what PC1 already did, a crappy base game that ages well over time, Frontier deceided to tweak their cobra engine to an extent that it is not compatible anymore to pc and PZ and yet, we expect a seamless continuiation on a small margin. (to an extend it is frontier's own fault, but this doesnt change the equation) you can only put that much money in the game and when you dont make enough the quality is the one of the first things that gets thrown overboard.

 

[Sclurp]

I think everyone agree's on that, but this is the gist.

In someway I appreciate it, simply because it was probably eye opening to some people:

- Many people said, yeah they should put all the old scenery in and the best way: fast and for free. Cause it is sooo easy to port them from pc1 to pc2.

Yeah, we know got the piece in a low cost / low effort way. We now have 300 assets for free with nothing to complain about, cause we as a community demanded them for free in this way. We lost a lot of leverage here, cause it was a gift and due to the amount we probably have to appreciate it at first.

If this was a paid dlc, we probably could cry a lot about it and with right, but right now, we are somehow put in the place.

PC2 did what PC1 already did, a crappy base game that ages well over time, Frontier deceided to tweak their cobra engine to an extent that it is not compatible anymore to pc and PZ and yet, we expect a seamless continuiation on a small margin. (to an extend it is frontier's own fault, but this doesnt change the equation) you can only put that much money in the game and when you dont make enough the quality is the one of the first things that gets thrown overboard.

I mean, I do have something to complain about. Just because it was free doesn't mean it's free from critique, and there's a value for money deficit with PC2 that needs to be made up for IMO. Or else things stay as sour as they are. The inclusion of the scenery is a good thing. But why is everything about PC2 being handled so poorly?
I appreciate them reworking flumes and making them so much better. Great work - but it's how it should have been when the game came out.

Alongside that great addition in this update though, we have what comes across as a really lazy implementation of something that is below the usual standard in Planet games, ya know? Why are we buying a sequel if we're just copy and pasting PC1? I don't understand what is happening in their office but the PZ team were not struggling this hard to create QOL updates alongside HIGH quality assets for scenery and animals (bar the occasional blip with the animal models).

Sometimes I wonder if the PC2 team is comparatively tiny compared to teams they had for the first game and PZ. Maybe they've pulled people away to work on JWE3 which is probably guaranteed at this point to outperform PC2.

 

[Valdo82]

I mean, I do have something to complain about. Just because it was free doesn't mean it's free from critique, and there's a value for money deficit with PC2 that needs to be made up for IMO. Or else things stay as sour as they are. The inclusion of the scenery is a good thing. But why is everything about PC2 being handled so poorly?
I appreciate them reworking flumes and making them so much better. Great work - but it's how it should have been when the game came out.

Alongside that great addition in this update though, we have what comes across as a really lazy implementation of something that is below the usual standard in Planet games, ya know? Why are we buying a sequel if we're just copy and pasting PC1? I don't understand what is happening in their office but the PZ team were not struggling this hard to create QOL updates alongside HIGH quality assets for scenery and animals (bar the occasional blip with the animal models).

Sometimes I wonder if the PC2 team is comparatively tiny compared to teams they had for the first game and PZ. Maybe they've pulled people away to work on JWE3 which is probably guaranteed at this point to outperform PC2.

I am not an expert on all of Frontiers' Franchises, but isn't the western set on of the biggest Set(quantitywise) we got for free? I feel we got less assets on for example the 'Adventure set' from PC1 than the Westernset and with this they made around ten for each unit.

I know this a conversion, but i feel this all we can ask for for free. I am aware of the issues in the game (since launch) but get 4 whole DLCs (Western, Pirate, Fairytale, Sci-Fi) is too much to ask for as 'compensation' basically it would be like get the whole game back for free, if you convert it to DLC prices.

So yeah Frontier put themself in a tough situation here, we all agree it is a bit on them. But from a company standpoint it is a lose - lose situation.

 

[Sclurp]

I am not an expert on all of Frontiers' Franchises, but isn't the western set on of the biggest Set(quantitywise) we got for free? I feel we got less assets on for example the 'Adventure set' from PC1 than the Westernset and with this they made around ten for each unit.

I know this a conversion, but i feel this all we can ask for for free. I am aware of the issues in the game (since launch) but get 4 whole DLCs (Western, Pirate, Fairytale, Sci-Fi) is too much to ask for as 'compensation' basically it would be like get the whole game back for free, if you convert it to DLC prices.

So yeah Frontier put themself in a tough situation here, we all agree it is a bit on them. But from a company standpoint it is a lose - lose situation.

PC1 had the Planet Coaster/ Modern, Sci-fi, western, pirate, holiday, and fairytale themes in the base game.
By comparison PC2 is entirely lacking in what we got in the base game. I recognise some assets from Planet Zoo as well, so not everything seems to have been made from scratch. Which I'm actually fine with. PZ has high quality assets.

What they did with the western theme for PC2 was not of a sequel quality IMO. It's the same PC1 pieces but they look worse somehow.

Aspirations for the sequel to a hit game shouldn't be: here's what you had before but worse. I don't mind the majority of the pieces being reused from PC1 but they could have absolutely made some new ones and they should absolutely look better in the sequel.

If this is how it's gonna be, I'd honestly rather they didn't bother and use the dev team's efforts elsewhere.

 

[rct-uwe1]

... PC2 did what PC1 already did, a crappy base game that ages well over time, Frontier deceided to tweak their cobra engine to an extent that it is not compatible anymore to pc and PZ and yet, we expect a seamless continuiation on a small margin. (to an extend it is frontier's own fault, but this doesnt change the equation) you can only put that much money in the game and when you dont make enough the quality is the one of the first things that gets thrown overboard.

Again, do you know that PC2 wasn't made with the same engine version as for PZ? (This is really meant as a question.)

It might help to understand why it's going that bad. Is it a technical reason? Is it the dev team? Is it a profit only decision or all together?

 

[Valdo82]

They stated it in one of the dev diaries.

And you see it ingame especially in the graphics: The Waterreflections (natural and pool) are amazing, to some extent that a few Games can hold their stand against PC. Cyberpunk or the new FF 7 Rebirth (both very pretty games) have both worse water reflections.
The natural lightning/shadows is also pretty great.
Another thing is performance PZ and PC were a bit sluggish and you often had FPS loss on certain situation, this is not that much the case with the new engine. There are still limits to it and most users blatantly overestimated their own horse power.

So either they lied to us and tweaked the out of the old cobra engine, they had to build a new one.

So just because you have an engine, doesn't mean you have a car. You need wheels, transmission, brakes, body, etc.
So here it begins expertise: When you build the car for the new engine you need to find the parts that fit. PZ was in a comfortzone: They used a tweaked old engine, they knew which parts to use.
PC2 is a prototype with their own issues, you can see if your old transmission still fits, but what if it doesn't? You need to build a new transmission from the scratch, this takes time and probably more than one try sometimes.

So with PC2 they did what a lot of games did, bring the base game out and look for features later, just make sure you have the design space still open.

Now as to whose fault is it? Everyones.

Frontier has a history of having bad releases and they fix it up later, they got away with it so many times over so many years that it has been become a part of their work culture.
And with that mindset, (and here i am speculating but with some indicators) there is also added some bad company communication: You probably had times in your (work)life, that your boss told you: fix this in 5 days or you told someone to fix in 5 days, at the end the fixer needs 7 days to fix or something in between. It can be a lazy worker or a project manager who doesn't have a grasp to calculate worktime. This happens in almost every company, sometimes it is somewhere down the middle.

This extreme leads that things aren't going as planned and you need to adjust: release now, keep your promise or delay it and anger your consumers.

Yes, things are rushed:
Did the developers did their best to keep up with the schedule?
Was the staff well trained? and all times calculated and adjusted accordingly?
Maybe the shareholders were fine with a later and smaller return? (Shareholders aren't totally unreasonable, but they are like banks, they give you money and expect the money back + interest)

So it is a mix of everything but mostly Frontier's way and bet on them self, to produce a bad situation and get their return in the long run. They probably expect to sell DLC worth of around 70€ over the next 3-4 years.

 

[Abletudu]

Where are the western building pieces?

 

[rct-uwe1]

Where are the western building pieces?

They are listed at the very end of building pieces.

 

[rct-uwe1]

I have had a look at the new western building (only) pieces...
Compared to other walls and roofs, I can't see obviously bad textures.

The metal roofs even don't have a completely flat texture.
But I have to mention that the sloped metal inner corner roofs (all sizes) aren’t made well...
The two sides are not really connected so you can see through a gap in the corner.

 

[Vampiro]

Sometimes I have the impression beauty is in the eye of the beholder when it comes to judging textures. Or game settings in general.

Some people say the textures of the western set look improved, others state they got worse. For me personally I can only say they look better in Planco 2. Unfortunatly "better" is a very vague term.