I fight against corporate interests as well, but having to work for a living is not the same thing as literal slavery, and I hardly see why everyone's always trying to make this comparison. You get a crummy job in the Federation, you can leave it. You might not get a nice home and opulent wealth, but you won't be packed into the cargo hold of some random trader's ship and sold as a commodity. And I do think people should be guaranteed basic needs like food, water, a private abode, and access to information, hence why I support the Federal Liberal party and shadow president Felicia Winters.
The Winter Manifesto
- Thread starter BromeTeks
- Start date
I fight against corporate interests as well, but having to work for a living is not the same thing as literal slavery, and I hardly see why everyone's always trying to make this comparison. You get a crummy job in the Federation, you can leave it. You might not get a nice home and opulent wealth, but you won't be packed into the cargo hold of some random trader's ship and sold as a commodity. And I do think people should be guaranteed basic needs like food, water, a private abode, and access to information, hence why I support the Federal Liberal party and shadow president Felicia Winters.
There's far more slavery in the Federation than in the Empire. I'm not talking about minimum wage jobs or illegal under-the-table workers. I'm not even talking about indebted wage-slaves forced to buy from the company store. I'm talking about human trafficking. Kidnapping, exploitation and unpaid labor under threat of violence as well as encouragement of bribery to the necessary officials (lapped up in a unregulated corporate cesspool).
A far cry from imperial slaves who, even when denied their guaranteed rights still have far more oversight and review protecting them from the levels of exploitation you find in the Federation, and imperial slavery is initially voluntary to avoid debt-shame. In the Empire conventional slavery is outlawed and strictly enforced.
You act like these problems don't exist in the Empire. All the major powers outlawed unregulated human trafficking, but if you know where to look, you can find vulnerable humans being trafficked in the Empire, same as in the Federation, Alliance, and everything in between. Crazy that I have to argue it in 3306, but Slavery is bad. And while it should be fought everywhere, only one superpower has state sanctioned slavery. And no matter how much glitter they try and dress it up with, slavery is still slavery. Ask the citizens of Chione. Imperial slavery outnumbers all other forms of slavery, including in unaligned systems, combined.
I also don't know how you could possibly think that the Empire would have less corruption than the Federation. They literally built their political system on corruption, but call it "patronage."
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The corruption you speak of is mostly above board in the Empire and is exactly what most other powers criticize us for which makes one wonder if it as corrupt at all when viewed through this lens. A few backwater worlds that are less than the imperial ideal are hardly comparable to the thousands of Federal worlds which condone it every which way except officially.
Also, don't pretend there isn't a difference of degree: Childcare, healthcare, education, marketable skills upon release, food, housing, networking opportunities, (nominal) legal protection from physical abuse and abuse of dignity for starters. A minimum safety net.
Compared with: Blind eye to obvious and critical suffering, starvation, overworking, liquidation of dignity and rampant physical and mental abuse. All involuntary and all under threat of immediate violence with no legal recourse.
Even the federal wage-slaves eating soylent goop in their hab-blocks have poorer living conditions than most imperial slaves.
Regardless, I sell imps to federal research stations beneath board because I'm scum.
Long Live ALD
Long Live the Empire
Also, don't pretend there isn't a difference of degree: Childcare, healthcare, education, marketable skills upon release, food, housing, networking opportunities, (nominal) legal protection from physical abuse and abuse of dignity for starters. A minimum safety net.
Compared with: Blind eye to obvious and critical suffering, starvation, overworking, liquidation of dignity and rampant physical and mental abuse. All involuntary and all under threat of immediate violence with no legal recourse.
Even the federal wage-slaves eating soylent goop in their hab-blocks have poorer living conditions than most imperial slaves.
Regardless, I sell imps to federal research stations beneath board because I'm scum.
Long Live ALD
Long Live the Empire
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All things the Federal liberal party advocates for, without having to sell your freedom to the rich. Seriously, you're brainwashed if you think that 'having debt' is so embarrassing that you need to give up all your freedoms, be stuffed in a pod and shipped halfway across the bubble to the highest bidder. I'm quite sure the children and families of slaves are not typically shipped with them, so you're basically abandoning your child to an orphanage to go serve in debtor's prison. In polite society, if you can't pay back your debts, you can file for bankruptcy to discharge them. Your family isn't shattered. Your rights aren't sold off.
A roughly accurate description if you are an imperial slave to a wealthy patron who doesn't care about your well-being. See: Chione. What happens to an Imperial slave if they don't like their work assignment? Can they just walk off the job without facing arrest?
Also again. There are 505 stations in all of human space that are known to be points where slaves are sold. There are 3,607 where imperial slaves are sold. Half of those aren't even aligned to the Empire, so whatever legal protections the empire might afford them are academic, they're at the whim of whatever their owners want.
I'll give a proper reply when I have time but for now one point I want to address is that the so-called brainwashing goes both ways. Who magically pays back your debtors? What part of the consequences ensure those who are out of pocket are compensated? The consequences of debt in the federation can be quite severe with or without guilt. How does a society presume to lecture another on fairness when they are less capable of enforcing rule of law? Imperial oversight is a difficult thing to deny, whether you agree with the policies or not. The Federal philosophy is an ideal that tends to impoverish the masses rather than uplift them. In imperial space everyone has a place and they know their place. As to the families of the indentured, perhaps we should take a closer look to the imperial labor charter for specifics ( 
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).I'll give a proper reply when I have time but for now one point I want to address is that the so-called brainwashing goes both ways. Who magically pays back your debtors? What part of the consequences ensure those who are out of pocket are compensated? The consequences of debt in the federation can be quite severe with or without guilt. How does a society presume to lecture another on fairness when they are less capable of enforcing rule of law? Imperial oversight is a difficult thing to deny, whether you agree with the policies or not. The Federal philosophy is an ideal that tends to impoverish the masses rather than uplift them. In imperial space everyone has a place and they know their place. As to the families of the indentured, perhaps we should take a closer look to the imperial labor charter for specifics (
What a very imperial view. Creditors take the loss and debtors take take a credit hit so that it's harder for them to borrow money. This isn't rocket science. But like I said in my manifesto, Imperial slavery is a safety net for the rich. They get paid back one way or another, so no investment is too risky for them. The cost is, of course, billions of slaves, but how else can you get such shiny ships?
Maybe it's just the Alliance in me, but personally, the reason slavery is so frowned-upon is because it violates the basic rights of other humans...or more reading between-the-lines, it overtly defies the Primal Directive hardwired in all humans. That said, there have been exceptions, involving particularly racy and wild playmates who enjoy simulating conditions of slavery as some form of (assuming the word isn't a crime punishable by death or worse) "fetish". But those are the exceptions, not the examples.
My point is to ask a simple question: what if slavery is somehow voluntary? Like, legitimately voluntary, and specifically not forced into it out of some socioeconomical desperation. For money holds no significant sway over the Alliance, which is how we get to preach our ideals more strongly. We were founded SPECIFICALLY to oppose the corporate domination of the Federation, and the overt oppression of the Empire. Both regimes, in my eyes, should FALL AND BURN!
My point is to ask a simple question: what if slavery is somehow voluntary? Like, legitimately voluntary, and specifically not forced into it out of some socioeconomical desperation. For money holds no significant sway over the Alliance, which is how we get to preach our ideals more strongly. We were founded SPECIFICALLY to oppose the corporate domination of the Federation, and the overt oppression of the Empire. Both regimes, in my eyes, should FALL AND BURN!
Then by definition it's not slavery.
I think the question asked is:
What if there was a system that allowed people to 'hire themselves out', to 'trade' their skills and time to another person for a guaranteed 'reward' instead of just food, board and life, but actually allowed that person to better themselves? It would need legal guarantees and 'working conditions' that were acceptable and all sorts of checks and balances and they would need paying for in a Capitalist society so some sort of general taxation would be needed. Its a dream for sure.
However, the 2nd bit, desperation. Apart from a few people born to the right family most people cannot do anything but trade their skills and time for the reward for someone elses benefit and hope to better themselves along the way. They dont have a choice. So are they effectively 'enslaved' by the system if not by the individual? They are not property as such but what choice do they have?
So to satisfy both needs you would need to be able to trade your skills and time for the betterment of society as a whole and not have to worry about feeding and clothing and housing yourself in the process. This would allow people to do what is right for society as a whole and not what they need to do to survive. Which I think is represented by the Utopians but I cant remember his name hes that memorable in game.
Watch out for the Utopians, they often in games are the happiest to blow everything up or release the end of life virus and start again to build their Utopia. Not sure about this one, I dont trust him yet lol
its all tyranny, oppression of the people, we need to tear it all down and work our way back up, bootlickers and tyrants will not be tolerated.
And? The Federation is grappling with a political crisis that's causing many to jump to potentially hazardous conclusions, the Alliance is being invaded by Thargoids, and refugees are being thrown all about space. Not exactly the time to intensify inter-power rivalry, I think.
Fortunately, the Federation has the means to peacefully remove the current leadership from power, while the Empire does not. I'm not terribly worried about the Thargoids because the pilot's federation has again and again shown themselves to be a match for them.
Oh, and since I'm here, I thought I might remind people.
If you're complaining about the NMLA killing civilians, the Empires hands are bathed in far more blood. Just ask the former inhabitants of the Prism system.