Unclaimed Cargo - Illegal?

Ugha

U
I really don't think that unclaimed cargo just floating in space should be considered stolen.

Now if you kill someone and then loot the cargo then that is a different story.

It's not illegal to go through someone's trash. So why would it be in space?




One more thing. When I get a kill pirate mission that wants me to go to a system that is unclaimed (no government) and usually consists of just a single star. I never run into anyone wanted. How can someone be wanted by a government that doesn't exist. Long story short I never get to kill/find any pirates. There may be something I am not doing correctly on this. /shrug
 

DePriest

DePriest
I kinda have to agree with you, it seems like it would fall under something like the law of salvage honestly. If someone comes across a ship or cargo after it was lost then they should be entitled to either keep it or get compensation for the retrieval for the cargo.
 

Deleted member 38366

D
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Vicis

Vicis
Yup...

Not only that, but it's ridiculously stupid that it's perfectly legal to kill someone who's wanted in a system, but illegal to take their cargo.
 

rumtruffle

R
i agree
it goes against standard conventions in even previous elite games.

if you kill a pirate you should be able to take their cargo and its not considered stolen.
obviously illegal goods would still be illegal. but getting finded for picking up scrap etc is just ludicrous, how the hell do the authorities know where the scrap came from.
 

Wicz

Wicz
So a pirate kills a player, steals his cargo, but runs out of space in his hold and has to leave several canisters in space next to the wreckage. That pirate is then carrying stolen goods, I'm sure nobody disputes this fact.

Then you arrive and collect the cargo he had to leave behind.

You seriously think that shouldn't be classed as stolen?

If you want free stuff in this game, you have to steal it.

If you don't want to get caught with stolen goods, I suggest you stop stealing them, or learn how to avoid detection.

Watch this....

[video=youtube;KbaLJTGHkj8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbaLJTGHkj8[/video]
 
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skadog

skadog
There should be some conditions put in place for the law of salvage to be observed.
 
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starjump

starjump
Vicis said:
Yup...

Not only that, but it's ridiculously stupid that it's perfectly legal to kill someone who's wanted in a system, but illegal to take their cargo.
Click to expand...
Wanted is a criminal so its legal to take him down. The cargo is possible stolen which is the reason they are wanted. Two scenarios: Catching a thief that stole something wont make the items free for you to take just cause he was caught. Someone bought items and dropped them wont make it yours/ok to take either. So i think its completely fair system. However being able to buy salvage license would be a nice addition, and might come afaik.
 

Danneh

D
This has been touched on numerous times, and i think we can all agree (and i believe FD have said they will implement something of the sort), that not all picked up cargo should be stolen, and should be salvageable. Meaning that a pirate's cargo can be returned the rightful owners/faction for a finder's fee, which is less than the black market price, but comes with a rep boost. Similar scenario for USS drops, which should have options to sell to different factions for different benefits, i.e. military plans to the empire/federation.

Also, noone has mentioned it so far, but you aren't finding wanted pilots in ungoverned systems because the wanted status only refers to that sector. You're right, everyone is clean in those systems because there's no government to put out a wanted notice. To claim bounties from these people, get a kill warrant scanner. I believe it still won't change from clean to wanted, but you can scan them and see if they have bounties in the contacts panel, and of course, with no wantedness, you can open fire on them without fear of repercussion, and claim the bounties in the respective systems.
 

Ugha

U
Danneh said:
This has been touched on numerous times, and i think we can all agree (and i believe FD have said they will implement something of the sort), that not all picked up cargo should be stolen, and should be salvageable. Meaning that a pirate's cargo can be returned the rightful owners/faction for a finder's fee, which is less than the black market price, but comes with a rep boost. Similar scenario for USS drops, which should have options to sell to different factions for different benefits, i.e. military plans to the empire/federation.

Also, noone has mentioned it so far, but you aren't finding wanted pilots in ungoverned systems because the wanted status only refers to that sector. You're right, everyone is clean in those systems because there's no government to put out a wanted notice. To claim bounties from these people, get a kill warrant scanner. I believe it still won't change from clean to wanted, but you can scan them and see if they have bounties in the contacts panel, and of course, with no wantedness, you can open fire on them without fear of repercussion, and claim the bounties in the respective systems.
Click to expand...

Thank you! Your the first to respond to this issue! *heads to buy a warrant scanner immediately*
 

Panzerbeard

P
I like to imagine that the reason salvaged cargo counts as "stolen" is that there is some kind of digital receipt or proof-of-purchase attached to the cargo. When it's sold in a station, it's marked as belonging to that specific buyer. When you want to sell the cargo, or if you get scanned, the details on the receipt are checked against your details, to see if you're actually the owner of the cargo, and if you're not, it's considered stolen. After all, they don't have any way of knowing whether you just found it, or if you "liberated" it from some innocent trader. After all, in real life, you need various documents when selling a car, for example, to prove you're the current owner and you haven't just nicked it. The black market presumably have the means to forge or reset the data on the documents, so they can launder the goods.

There probably isn't any in-universe grounding for that theory, but it makes sense to me, at least. I think there should be some feature that lets you hand in salvaged cargo to the authorities, and get a small finder's fee and maybe a small amount of reputation. It'd be less profitable than smuggling it into a station and selling it on the black market, but it's a legal alternative.
 

Vicis

Vicis
starjump said:
Wanted is a criminal so its legal to take him down. The cargo is possible stolen which is the reason they are wanted. Two scenarios: Catching a thief that stole something wont make the items free for you to take just cause he was caught. Someone bought items and dropped them wont make it yours/ok to take either.
Click to expand...

And do tell me what happens to said cargo after 5 minutes?

I can't have it so no-one can?
 

Macgyver

Macgyver
Vicis said:
Yup...

Not only that, but it's ridiculously stupid that it's perfectly legal to kill someone who's wanted in a system, but illegal to take their cargo.
Click to expand...


This ^^^
just dumb game mechanics designed to take the fun away.
love to know how they keep track of stolen goods and why can we just change canisters to get rid of any marked bills?

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starjump said:
Wanted is a criminal so its legal to take him down. The cargo is possible stolen which is the reason they are wanted. Two scenarios: Catching a thief that stole something wont make the items free for you to take just cause he was caught. Someone bought items and dropped them wont make it yours/ok to take either. So i think its completely fair system. However being able to buy salvage license would be a nice addition, and might come afaik.
Click to expand...

hey this game ain't real life.
its a game, we kill bad guys we take their stuff Nuff said.
just another stupid ED game mechanic that will bring certain doom to non flyboy potential buyers.
The game never had enough Joe public testers, only a bunch of diehard Flyboys who love this rubbish.

so how's that game? Any good loot? ---- well funny thing that... Loot just rots in space , cause if I pick it up, chances are I will get a $15k fine for bringing in to the lost and found office....
 
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Lovecraft

Lovecraft
I found 3 Paladum and 1 Tantalum (sp) and thought how lucky I was, until I received a 44k fine. Not touching anything floating in space unless it's a contract item from on :p
 

MadMoe

MadMoe
The System Authorities will scan you even if you're in silent running IF they make visual contact with your ship. To fairly reliably smuggle without doing the FA-off coasting, fly around the station until you're more-or-less lined up with the slot while keeping about 8km out from the station. Next, full throttle towards the station while using your maneuvering thrusters to adjust your alignment.

Request docking permission! Request docking permission! Request docking permission!

Once inside the slot, throttle back, deploy landing gear, and dock. It takes a bit of practice, but once you get it down its pretty easy to avoid being scanned... unless you totally biff the entrance that is. ;)
 

Panzerbeard

P
Macgyver said:
This ^^^
just dumb game mechanics designed to take the fun away.
Click to expand...
Well, that's entirely subjective, now, isn't it? Personally I think it adds to the fun by introducing the chance for extra profit IF you're willing to risk smuggling. It's a risk/reward thing, if you're a bounty hunter you'll get money from the killmail anyway, but there's potential for extra money at the cost of increased reward. There are ways of justifying it from an in-universe standpoint (see my previous post), and as a gameplay mechanic it does a good job of encouraging the use of the smuggling and black market system. I can see why some people wouldn't like it, but that's a matter of opinion, I guess
 

Helvellyn

Helvellyn
The idea isn't too bad or unreasonable but like some of the above posts suggest there needs to be more to it. Returning it as salvage for a reduced reward sounds reasonable (you'd probably need to mark it as salvaged and therefore unable to sell it for full price before being scanned). Blowing up a pirate who isn't carrying stolen cargo should let you scoop it up for no risk too, but perhaps that one might be changing. Of course there's no way of telling whether it is when you're getting the mission. Slaves can always go free, at no cost perhaps (leaving them drifting in space until they die shouldn't really be the legally acceptable option!)

For salvage bulletin board missions just pick them up in anarchy systems.
 
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