Various issues with Imperial Clipper

k1llm0re

K
Dear Elite: Dangerous(and FD!),

I created this thread, both to hopefully spark some discussion on the topic of the Clipper, as well as attempting to get someone at FDev to notice these issues it has.

As some of you may know, the Imperial Clipper is currently experiencing some issues, including a particularly nasty and severe bug that seemingly causes the Clipper to have 0 mass for the purposes of mass locking enemy ships.

Another issue that it faces is lack of convergence points on its awkwardly placed hardpoints, which ultimately results in the Clipper's inability to deal with enemy player's double chaff in a skillful, rewarding manner. This leads to a frustrating experience for Clipper pilots when combined with the mass locking issue.

The Clipper also has an incredibly high maintenance cost, and the "zero mass bug" appears to make this ship particularly vulnerable to taking damage from ramming and collisions, resulting in an artificially high rate of repairs on an already exorbitantly high repair cost. All in all, these issues make flying the Clipper a careful consideration for any potential pilot, as it has many downsides in its current iteration.

Besides those things, the Clipper is a real treat to fly. It is fast, agile, deadly, and destroys any player without double chaff via gimballed weapons.

Unfortunately, though, I have been unable to find any word from Michael or anyone else at FDev as to whether they have acknowledged these issues with this fine vessel.

Please comment on whether you feel the Clipper deserves a hardpoint redesign or rebalance, and if so, what other changes, if any, may be required to keep the hull within balance.

Love always,
Commander Killmore
 

Bando

Bando
Holy hell.
I don't know anything about the Clipper, but you sure put some nice writing up there...
 

k1llm0re

K
Bando said:
Holy hell.
I don't know anything about the Clipper, but you sure put some nice writing up there...
Click to expand...

Thank you friend!

Though you may not know about the ship, hopefully you know a little now, and your kind words are helpful in bumping the thread for visibility.
 

Ratas

Ratas
I have been flying the clipper for a week or so, and I really enjoy it a lot. Only thing I'd be happy to get would be center line mounted guns, as I prefer fixed guns over gimbaled, but I can certainly live without. I certainly prefer this over my old Asp, even when only D-C rated so far.


Mass lock sounds nasty, I did wonder how easily a player driven Cobra escaped from me though, would be nice to keep them locked better for sure.


So can't say this needs fixin, great agility makes up huge size and weaker shields than some other big ships. Also not sure how closely this is supposed to be balanced to python, I'd certainly got python faster than this if I went full trade grind, but on the other hand I much prefer the cheaper upkeep and insurances, although havent wrecked my clipper yet.


Not sure what you mean by expensive upkeep though? Hull damage gets to 100k-300k range quite fast, but one shouldn't really go into situations where shields can not keep the damage in check. Fuel is easily scooped with lot of internal space for scoop and weapon slots are Limited, so not that much ammo weapons anyway. Every now and then I do something stupid and pay 250k for repairs, but can't rally say it is any kind of problem. My main income is assasinations and bounties, trading only if my money reserve starts to get low (below 2M). Although I agree going to warzone in a clipper often costs more than you gain from kills there. But I think throwaway Vipers are best for that anyway.
 

Issmir

Issmir
the mass lock thing is pretty bad. I quite like the placement of the hardpoints though. that might just be me, but it gives the ship a lot of character.

Ratas said:
Hull damage gets to 100k-300k range quite fast, but one shouldn't really go into situations where shields can not keep the damage in check.
Click to expand...

True, though I learned the hard way not to fit a Frame Shift Interdictor onto a clipper.
 

CMDR Jenna Nord

CMDR Jenna Nord
k1llm0re said:
Dear Elite: Dangerous(and FD!),

I created this thread, both to hopefully spark some discussion on the topic of the Clipper, as well as attempting to get someone at FDev to notice these issues it has.

As some of you may know, the Imperial Clipper is currently experiencing some issues, including a particularly nasty and severe bug that seemingly causes the Clipper to have 0 mass for the purposes of mass locking enemy ships.

Another issue that it faces is lack of convergence points on its awkwardly placed hardpoints, which ultimately results in the Clipper's inability to deal with enemy player's double chaff in a skillful, rewarding manner. This leads to a frustrating experience for Clipper pilots when combined with the mass locking issue.

The Clipper also has an incredibly high maintenance cost, and the "zero mass bug" appears to make this ship particularly vulnerable to taking damage from ramming and collisions, resulting in an artificially high rate of repairs on an already exorbitantly high repair cost. All in all, these issues make flying the Clipper a careful consideration for any potential pilot, as it has many downsides in its current iteration.

Besides those things, the Clipper is a real treat to fly. It is fast, agile, deadly, and destroys any player without double chaff via gimballed weapons.

Unfortunately, though, I have been unable to find any word from Michael or anyone else at FDev as to whether they have acknowledged these issues with this fine vessel.

Please comment on whether you feel the Clipper deserves a hardpoint redesign or rebalance, and if so, what other changes, if any, may be required to keep the hull within balance.

Love always,
Commander Killmore
Click to expand...

While I agree on most points I must disagree with pointing out that the Clipper is agile. It isn't. In fact it can't keep up with autorotate when you enter a Coriolis station. It always slides to the side. When they fix the high rep costs and at last make it able to keep up with autorotate I would be eternal grateful.

You may also look at this thread https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=106485

And here is something I pointed out in another thread

Cobra 180t hull -> max repair ~8k
Asp Explorer 280t hull -> max repair ~240k
Imp Clipper 400t hull -> max repair ~740k
Type-7 420t hull -> ~8k?
 

Battleship Kickass

B
Mass bug is being addressed in 1.1. Dev has responded to this a long time ago, don't have the post saved.

Hard points will probably never be changed, have to have a trade off for being so quick. Chaff is supposedly being nerfed as well from the dev's.
 
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Wicz

Wicz
Don't forget the shadow, please fix the shadow :cool:

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Battleship Kickass said:
Mass bug is being addressed in 1.1. Dev has responded to this a long time ago, don't have the post saved.

Hard points will probably never be changed, have to have a trade off for being so quick. Chaff is supposedly being nerfed as well from the dev's.
Click to expand...



I thought the trade off for being so quick was the awful range?
 

Quineloe

Quineloe
The masslock thing gets fixed in 1.1

and the Clipper does not suffer in collisions from this bug. I've been rammed by a python at high speed and survived, I've rammed Asps and they took more damage while my shields didn't even drop. I destroyed Cobras with ramming them without losing my (3A) shields.

Also when scooping the Clipper destroys canisters very easily, as is common with large ships.

The only issue are the hardpoints that basically mandate gimballed or turreted weapons, and hopefully the announced chaff nerf will mean that you can't cycle banks to chaff 100% of the time anymore.
 

Raaya

Raaya
Also, if you use gimballed weapons, the aiming points are way off target. You still hit, but you cannot determine if the gimbals have settled on the target.
 

Wicz

Wicz
Quineloe said:
What awful range?
Click to expand...


With a full hold it struggles to make 65ly depending on the individual jumps. Given that it's a clipper it should have longer range in my opinion, and a larger fuel tank.

But this is only my opinion, and of course you have yours.
 

Quineloe

Quineloe
65 LY seems to be quite a distance and I have covered trips of 150 LY easily with my clipper so far.

Awful is quite a big word to use compared to really low jumprange that some other ships have that can't just fit a fuel scoop without sacrificing half their cargo capacity.
 

CMDR Jenna Nord

CMDR Jenna Nord
Wicz said:
With a full hold it struggles to make 65ly depending on the individual jumps. Given that it's a clipper it should have longer range in my opinion, and a larger fuel tank.

But this is only my opinion, and of course you have yours.
Click to expand...
Make that a 32t tank and you would have 130ly and that would be too much imho.

A5 FSD and you have ~23ly unladen ~15ly with full load.. I would say thats pretty good for not being a dedicated trade ship.
 
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SpiralRazor

Banned
S
Quineloe said:
What awful range?




That thread is pure hyperbole. Cobras lose when ramming clippers.
Click to expand...



16 ton fuel tank gives it a pretty bad range. a 32 ton tank would not be remiss BECAUSE of the cost of repairs on it....they are out of proportion with every ship near is price range. Either that or the T7 repair costs are bugged as well.

A Navy Clipper is going to have quite a good range, from nearly every lore source you can dig up. The Imp Clippers jump range is average, a bit better then a T7s, but not my much.



Cobras do lose when ramming clippers, mostly...but on occasion for some reason a cobra can blow up a clipper from full to dead...therein lies some sort of bug.
 
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