General / Off-Topic We have to end these stories

[Slange Lands]

Why would I want my fear to fade? Fear is what keeps me alive by restraining my more dangerous impulses and prompting me to take action against threats. I want to live.

Are you so uncertain of the strength of your will, that only the fear of retribution guarantees your not behaving like an animal?

You seem to be a person of integrity, why not trust your inherent altruism?

Living in fear seems to me much more limiting than living lovingly with common sense. Sure, driving and flying in airplanes are dangerous, but if I did not drive or fly I would never have seen the world, better educated myself, or met my husband. If my terror of malaria and cholera were greater than my love of history, I would never have experienced bits of ancient civilazations or directly experienced that I am one lucky f**ker and that my world and thought processes are not at all indicative of others' realities.

We may not have material control of our lives, but we sure as heck have some control over our interpretation of it.

Fear is something to be ignored, an obsolete evolutionary inheritance. Replace it with love and reason, please.

xoxo

 

[Morbad]

Are you so uncertain of the strength of your will, that only the fear of retribution guarantees your not behaving like an animal?

I'm supremely confident in my strength of will.

You seem to be a person of integrity, why not trust your inherent altruism?

I don't really believe in the existence of 'inherent altruism', just a sense of mutual self-interest.

Living in fear seems to me much more limiting than living lovingly with common sense. Sure, driving and flying in airplanes are dangerous, but if I did not drive or fly I would never have seen the world, better educated myself, or met my husband. If my terror of malaria and cholera were greater than my love of history, I would never have experienced bits of ancient civilazations or directly experienced that I am one lucky f**ker and that my world and thought processes are not at all indicative of others' realities.

There is a big difference between acknowledging and embracing one's fear when it's useful to do so and living in fear or ignoring common sense.

If I let my fear rule me, I'd also not be where I am today. I've put my life on the line more than once in pursuit of my various goals (which often involved increasing my future comfort and security...taking a little more risk now to face much less later) and will likely be forced to do so again. And I am content with such struggles, even if I'd like to minimize them.

However, if I'd ignored my fear, I'd be dead a dozen times over, and so would many others...both those I'd have failed to protect, and those I'd have immediately retaliated against when retreat, submission, or delay was the wiser choice.

We may not have material control of our lives, but we sure as heck have some control over our interpretation of it.

I strive for both.

Fear is something to be ignored, an obsolete evolutionary inheritance. Replace it with love and reason, please.

To categorically ignore fear is to abdicate reason, and you can't love if you're dead.

Fear is not synonymous with phobia. Much fear is highly rational, or gives one a head start on rational actions when reason is still processing what's happened. It's up to reason to discard the irrational parts and will to overcome both irrational and rational fear when it doesn't serve one's goals.

Ultimately, I keep my fear around because it's a useful tool. I'd not discard it any sooner than I'd discard any other autonomic reflex. I like being able to breathe without needing to be conscious of it, even if I retain enough control to hold my breath, should it suit me.

 

[Robin of Spiritwood]

We have to end these stories?
...

Heartfelt honest post, Arry. Bad news about your family, too.
When these things happen we have to try to forgive ourselves for not doing the impossible thing we'd like to: help our loved ones to come back. Somehow.
I've been occasionally lucky in that regard, but it isn't going to last forever. Everybody knows that.

We can only do so much, and it never seems sufficient.

We, as a species, have to change the story of "incurable illness leads to euthanasia", to "illness got fixed on Wednesday".

Like getting a haircut, nobody makes a big deal of getting vaccinated for instance, but we are winning against Polio. One day there just won't be any more Polio, a terrible crippling illness feared by our grandparents. And all the horrible stories of all the people who were going to get it, will never be told. Instead we have the much better narrative of lives that are fulfilled.

The proximity of the solutions for so many illnesses is not as far as people believe, at least for the first ones.

 

[Morbad]

Like getting a haircut, nobody makes a big deal of getting vaccinated for instance, but we are winning against Polio. One day there just won't be any more Polio, a terrible crippling illness feared by our grandparents.

I didn't even realize we hadn't eradicated polio yet. Guess it's been so long since I've heard of anyone having it in the developed world.

 

[Chris Simon]

I didn't even realize we hadn't eradicated polio yet. Guess it's been so long since I've heard of anyone having it in the developed world.

Antivaxxers. The epitome of modern human stupidity.
Kind of like flat-earthers, but infinitely more dangerous to actual human survival. A virus couldn't ask for a better host than a moron without immunity and with freedom of travel all over the world.

 

[Morbad]

Antivaxxers. The epitome of modern human stupidity.
Kind of like flat-earthers, but infinitely more dangerous to actual human survival. A virus couldn't ask for a better host than a moron without immunity and with freedom of travel all over the world.

Antivaxxers are a problem, but it seems that the issues in eradicating polio is quite a bit more complex than that.

I've just been reading up on it and the oral attenuated vaccine is preferred in most cases because it doesn't require any special storage, training, or facilities to be administered. Problem is that the attenuated vaccine isn't dead and, in many areas, is actually responsible for more cases of polio than the nearly eradicated wild virus. This in turn makes near complete vaccination rates even more important, because living virus material is being introduced into local environments by the vaccination process; even if the vaccine works entirely as it should for the vaccinated individual, live virus is still making into their feces, where it can survive for weeks...and sanitation is not a highlight of areas that still see polio. There is a push to move to the dead, injectable, vaccine, but supplies were tight until recently and it's much harder to do mass vaccinations in developing nations if they have to be performed by trained personnel.

Of course, groups like the Taliban killing aid personnel and telling locals that the vaccine is some plot to sterilize their children is also not helping.

 

[Arry]

Antivaxxers are a problem, but it seems that the issues in eradicating polio is quite a bit more complex than that.

I've just been reading up on it and the oral attenuated vaccine is preferred in most cases because it doesn't require any special storage, training, or facilities to be administered. Problem is that the attenuated vaccine isn't dead and, in many areas, is actually responsible for more cases of polio than the nearly eradicated wild virus. This in turn makes near complete vaccination rates even more important, because living virus material is being introduced into local environments by the vaccination process; even if the vaccine works entirely as it should for the vaccinated individual, live virus is still making into their feces, where it can survive for weeks...and sanitation is not a highlight of areas that still see polio. There is a push to move to the dead, injectable, vaccine, but supplies were tight until recently and it's much harder to do mass vaccinations in developing nations if they have to be performed by trained personnel.

Of course, groups like the Taliban killing aid personnel and telling locals that the vaccine is some plot to sterilize their children is also not helping.

Not just the Taliban. In Africa, WHO workers etc., are being killed, because of rumours about what the 'white man' is supposed to be doing with all those needles.

 

[Morbad]

Not just the Taliban. In Africa, WHO workers etc., are being killed, because of rumours about what the 'white man' is supposed to be doing with all those needles.

The Taliban was just one of the more prominent examples having to do with polio. Ignorance and manipulation are everywhere, on some level.

 

[6xes]

Apologies for the length.

I'm strongly in favour of euthanasia. For people.

It's just that these advances can't come fast enough for so many good people, who end up dying.

The euthanasia dilemma is a odd one..
how does a person who is under considerable duress then give consent when they are not themselves?
if this be the case... should there be a pre-signed agreement whilst in their healthy years.. that the action be carried out...

the question then becomes... does anyone with a sane mind give sign themselves over to be euthanased for future sorting?
...more and more questions start cropping up which only adds to the confusion of the original question.

While i would agree under a War like scenario... the act of compassion when a individuals body is in 2-3 parts might justify the very act.

The decision is not a easy one

 

[Patrick_68000]

The euthanasia dilemma is a odd one..
how does a person who is under considerable duress then give consent when they are not themselves?
if this be the case... should there be a pre-signed agreement whilst in their healthy years.. that the action be carried out...

the question then becomes... does anyone with a sane mind give sign themselves over to be euthanased for future sorting?
...more and more questions start cropping up which only adds to the confusion of the original question.

While i would agree under a War like scenario... the act of compassion when a individuals body is in 2-3 parts might justify the very act.

The decision is not a easy one

Yes it could be a solution.

Look at the Vincent Lambert case in France.

Before having his accident which left him neurovegetative, he had always told his wife that if he had an accident of this kind, he would prefer to be euthanized.

But he had not made a written declaration.

As a result, he remained nailed to a bed, motionless, his eyes open in a neurovegetative state.

 

[Chris Simon]

Yes it could be a solution.

Look at the Vincent Lambert case in France.

Before having his accident which left him neurovegetative, he had always told his wife that if he had an accident of this kind, he would prefer to be euthanized.

But he had not made a written declaration.

As a result, he remained nailed to a bed, motionless, his eyes open in a neurovegetative state.

Man, this is probably my biggest fear in life.

 

[Patrick_68000]

Man, this is probably my biggest fear in life.

Yes, prisoner of his body, and can say nothing, nothing express, nothing ask.

 

[Chaparral]

Not a fan of making people suffer so they can wait for a cure.

Spent last weekend with a college friend changing his diaper, wiping the p iss and s hit off of his emaciated body, cleaning his bed sores after he was returned home from the ICU (he's suffering from end stage alcoholism). He fades in and out of ammonia build up induced delerium. Sometimes he's confrontational, sometimes self-aware, sometimes he is in agony from his various conditions. He is suffering.

I was just helping out his wife for a day.

She lives with the guy 24/7.

Yeah - not a fan of prolonged suffering, irrespective of the cause. Graceful exits should be an option.