Weapon Piercing and module damage questions

LMAOCanda

L
Hello,

I have many questions

Is it true that there is no point to have piercing value over 75 for KE damage since highest hardness ship is only 75?

I know the lower you hull hp, the higher chance of getting hull penetration,
but does a high piercing weapon, such as rail gun, increase penetration chance or do higher module damage?

In term of penetration and module damage is there a benefit of having piercing value over 75?

I heard that destroying a module deal huge damage to hull HP. Is it true?

I heard a shot with high piercing can go through a ship and damage another ship. Is it true?

thx
 
Last edited:

LMAOCanda

L
I found this post which answer some of my questions.

Penetrator Rail Gun doesn't penetrate

Hello Can anybody please give me some advice on the correct use of the penetrator Rail Gun Mod? I have two class 2 Rail Gun on my Cutter, with Lvl 3 Lightweight and Super Penetrator. Spent last couple of hours trying the weapons on various NPC and seems that despite how good I am aligned the...
forums.frontier.co.uk forums.frontier.co.uk

Apparently each weapon has a "breaching chance" and "penetration depth"

Cannon has highest "breaching chance" of 60-90% with standard 75% "penetration depth"
Rail gun has standard "breaching chance" of 40-80% with infinite "penetration depth"

Is this correct? The information is kind of different than what is described at bottom of this page
https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/wiki/Bulkheads
 

bladebss

bladebss
Ok.. brech chance and piercing are seperate things.

Piercing is how effective a weapon is against different hulls. So small ships have thin hulls and so have a low hull hardness. A weapon with good piercing does more damager to ships with thick hulls or hull hardness. The anaconda has a hull hardness of 70 ithink. So if your weapons do not have a piercing value above 70 you will do reduced damage to the anacondas hull. It has no effect on breach chance.

Breach chance is the likelyness that a shot will breach the hull and hit a module.
This has an upper and lower chance.
The upper chance is the chance of the shot breaching when the hull is at 100% intergrity. The lower chance is when the hull is at like 1%

Now there is a hidden value of depth. Witch determins how far in to a ship a breached shot will travel to hit a module.
Rail guns can travel very far into a ship to hit a module.. but multicannons can only travel a short distance.

So if you are shooting the front of an anaconda, and you breach the hull with a rail gun shot.. you might hit the engines right at the back of the ship. As long as you didnt hit any other modules between the front of the ship and the engines. Superpenetratior effect on rail guns will allow you to breach modules as well so even if you hit a module it will keep going and hit other modules along the way so you will hit the engines from the front of the ship and do damage to every module you hit along the way.

If your are not using rail guns, you wont hit the engines as the depth of the breach for other guns is not 100% so it will stop and do no damage before it hits the engines. But other modules closer to the front of the ship will be able to be hit as they are not so far away from the point the shot breached the hull. This is often why shooting a ship from the top or bottom will be easier to hit modules, as the shot has less distance to travel inside the ship and hit the module.

No shot can go right thrugh a ship and hit another ship.. not even superpen rails.

Destroying a module does no extra hull damage ut can reduce the effectiveness of the ship as that module has failed.. eg. Shoot the power plant out and the ship will be running on emergancy power and may bot be able to run its shields or thrusters so they will also down.

Continued shots to a broken power plant can casue it to go critical and blow the whole ship before the hull has been destroyed. But this is the only module that will do this, all other modules just break and stop working and carry no extra damage to the hull.

Module damage is the breach damage. It is mitigated a little by hull resistance effects, such as kinnetic ressistance or thermal resistance and by the use of module reinforcement packages, as long as they are still active.


So basicaly..
Piercing effects hull damage.
Breach chance effects module hits
Breach damage effects module damage
There is a hidden breach depth for weapons and rails have 100% all the rest have less thogh i dont know the stats on this, and no shot can breach the whole ship and hit another.
 

Aashenfox

Aashenfox
Nice post above. Some additions... 1) torpedoes have the highest breach chance at 1000! This is how they ensure shield gen hits with reverb 100% of the time, every Torp breaches fully. And 2) It is said that super pens can hit multiple modules, but I have found this to either rarely be the case, or bugged. It's easy to test. Aim for the engines (of an fdl for example) from the front of the ship, and fire away with super pens. You won't ever hit the engines. I believe this is because while it MIGHT be able to hit multiple modules, it can probably only do so, UP TO the damage of the shot. So if the damage of the shot is consumed on the way through by either one or two other modules, the round never makes it to the engines. Some of this is untested assumption, but the fact remains, you can't hit the engines of an fdl with super pen from the front, for whatever reason.
 

Elpapo

Elpapo
Aashenfox said:
Nice post above. Some additions... 1) torpedoes have the highest breach chance at 1000! This is how they ensure shield gen hits with reverb 100% of the time, every Torp breaches fully. And 2) It is said that super pens can hit multiple modules, but I have found this to either rarely be the case, or bugged. It's easy to test. Aim for the engines (of an fdl for example) from the front of the ship, and fire away with super pens. You won't ever hit the engines. I believe this is because while it MIGHT be able to hit multiple modules, it can probably only do so, UP TO the damage of the shot. So if the damage of the shot is consumed on the way through by either one or two other modules, the round never makes it to the engines. Some of this is untested assumption, but the fact remains, you can't hit the engines of an fdl with super pen from the front, for whatever reason.
Click to expand...

This is indeed correct for case 2 from what I can tell.

If ship has MRP, then first up to soak up of that dmg is always MRP until remain active, then remain dmg is split to whatever projectile hits on its trajectory in order wich one was hit first, then I belive each module on its own, does make a independently to each other "roll" whenever breach chance happen or not for each of them.
 

LMAOCanda

L
bladebss said:
Ok.. brech chance and piercing are seperate things.

Piercing is how effective a weapon is against different hulls. So small ships have thin hulls and so have a low hull hardness. A weapon with good piercing does more damager to ships with thick hulls or hull hardness. The anaconda has a hull hardness of 70 ithink. So if your weapons do not have a piercing value above 70 you will do reduced damage to the anacondas hull. It has no effect on breach chance.

Breach chance is the likelyness that a shot will breach the hull and hit a module.
This has an upper and lower chance.
The upper chance is the chance of the shot breaching when the hull is at 100% intergrity. The lower chance is when the hull is at like 1%

Now there is a hidden value of depth. Witch determins how far in to a ship a breached shot will travel to hit a module.
Rail guns can travel very far into a ship to hit a module.. but multicannons can only travel a short distance.

So if you are shooting the front of an anaconda, and you breach the hull with a rail gun shot.. you might hit the engines right at the back of the ship. As long as you didnt hit any other modules between the front of the ship and the engines. Superpenetratior effect on rail guns will allow you to breach modules as well so even if you hit a module it will keep going and hit other modules along the way so you will hit the engines from the front of the ship and do damage to every module you hit along the way.

If your are not using rail guns, you wont hit the engines as the depth of the breach for other guns is not 100% so it will stop and do no damage before it hits the engines. But other modules closer to the front of the ship will be able to be hit as they are not so far away from the point the shot breached the hull. This is often why shooting a ship from the top or bottom will be easier to hit modules, as the shot has less distance to travel inside the ship and hit the module.

No shot can go right thrugh a ship and hit another ship.. not even superpen rails.

Destroying a module does no extra hull damage ut can reduce the effectiveness of the ship as that module has failed.. eg. Shoot the power plant out and the ship will be running on emergancy power and may bot be able to run its shields or thrusters so they will also poopoo down.

Continued shots to a broken power plant can casue it to go critical and blow the whole ship before the hull has been destroyed. But this is the only module that will do this, all other modules just break and stop working and carry no extra damage to the hull.

Module damage is the breach damage. It is mitigated a little by hull resistance effects, such as kinnetic ressistance or thermal resistance and by the use of module reinforcement packages, as long as they are still active.


So basicaly..
Piercing effects hull damage.
Breach chance effects module hits
Breach damage effects module damage
There is a hidden breach depth for weapons and rails have 100% all the rest have less thogh i dont know the stats on this, and no shot can breach the whole ship and hit another.
Click to expand...

Thank for answering.
So the piercing allows you to do 100% advertised weapon damage, but does it allow you do more than 100% damage to a canda if I have piercing value over 70?
What effect does a pricing value of 10000 give to a torpedo??
 

Deleted member 38366

D
...and after studying all those Numbers, you wonder why multiple direct hits by a G5 engineered C4 Cannon barely does any damage against an unshielded Adder NPC xD

Dunno, the data sometimes speaks other things than what can be observed in reality.
In short, I've learned not to trust the displayed raw data anymore but go with experience instead.
 

Kzak

Kzak
I seem to remember the Super Penetrator effect allowing the munitions to penetrate up to 75% of a vessel's bow-to-keel length in distance. Thus you can't hit an Anaconda's engines by aiming at them through the ship's bow, but with a bit of an angle to hit closer to the engines, where the distance from the impact point to the engines is less than 75% of the ship's length.
 
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