well that ended badly

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I decided to try and change things up last night and went back to my Sidewinder ("Bully's Special Prize" named after the Morris Ital level of quality car one may have won on the classic gameshow).

i decided it didnt matter if i lost it , and chose to to a tasty black box mission...

Things went wrong after collecting the 1st box and a conda with a big wing of ships jumped in...... however it could have been ok had i bugged out then, but no.... It was a time for heroes and with FA off i spun on my axis and charged head on to the ships ready to scoop the last box, blast past them and into hyperspace. (A rated but no ENG mods)

mistake 1) I forgot just how paper thin class 2 even A shields are

mistake 2) it would seem after a patch my controls had all been unbound... including my chaff launcher control.

so about 3 seconds of fire i get my ship blowing up... and just at that second mistake 3 hit me.................. yes the sidey was cheap to replace.. but

3) the 10 million in unclaimed bounty bonds.. not so much....................... oops!.

It seems you can beat a bit of bully after all!.,

 

[the100thmonkey]

Those black box missions...

They used to be free money. I don't do them in anything less than a Python now on my main. I'll be very careful about the rank when using my alt next time.

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

I've done them successfully using an unengineered Adder and a collector limpet. Limit myself to one black box at a time and I could complete them without hull damage if I was quick. A Courier should make a good tool for the job, good shields and mega speed to fly away from attackers.

 

[CMDR Minion Blob]

Those new Engineering 2.0 upgrades are rapidly becoming mandatory, aren't they?

At least you didn't find it out in a CZ with a legacy Engineered Corvette. Some NPCs have them upgrades too, so no more turkey shoot. Pretty sneaky from Frontier to "convince" the holdouts.

 

[Faded Glory]

I use a Cobra MkIII for space salvage missions.

The 'new' pirate wing behavior seems a bit off, very aggressive and seemingly pretty powerful weapons (not saying OP, but definitely seems to do a lot of damage in a very short time) but perhaps FD are trying to make NPC's more of a threat. I don't know.

As above, can be done successfully if you scoop one item then wake out and wait for the mission USS to spawn again, rinse and repeat until you have the required number of 'unique' items. Great game-play, well not really. And to add insult to injury, I did one a while back in a high security system, so hung around until system security dropped in and helped them destroy the pirate wing!

Except the black boxes had gone by the time the fight was over, so had to wake out and wait for the mission USS to spawn again. And then pirates dropped into that one too.

Balance seems to be an elusive thing...

 

[Limoncello Lizard]

As above, can be done successfully if you scoop one item then wake out and wait for the mission USS to spawn again, rinse and repeat until you have the required number of 'unique' items. Great game-play, well not really.

It would be good gameplay if if didn't include the RNG based waiting time.

 

[Solsticide]

3) the 10 million in unclaimed bounty bonds.. not so much....................... oops!.

Take a look at what you could have won

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Take a look at what you could have won

LOL

note this was in no way a complaint thread. i deliberately did this in my stock sidewinder, and i deliberately stuck around to nab the 2nd box when i could have jumped out.

it was my error to forget about my unclaimed bounty vouchers.

I DO agree the missions could be so so much better, with no RNG USS, and some tools / skill to locate an actual position which is locked down on 1st jumping into the system and remains persistant for the course of the mission timer (eith mission failure if the box gets destroyed, and having to hunt down the box if another pirate picks it up and flies off with it, tho with that in mind hopefully positioning hte boxes so they do not get blown up so easily in battle, and at the point of finding the black boxes getting the frequency of a tracker which means we can locate the position of the pirate after he has scooped the box)..

 

[pzykozomatik]

mistake 1) I forgot just how paper thin class 2 even A shields are

More like "the Sidewinder's base shields", an iCourier gets about 4.5 times the shield strength from the same 2A module. (Which I'll admit is quite OP compared to other small ships).
/pedant

 

[ZeroAi]

I decided to try and change things up last night and went back to my Sidewinder ("Bully's Special Prize" named after the Morris Ital level of quality car one may have won on the classic gameshow).

i decided it didnt matter if i lost it , and chose to to a tasty black box mission...

Things went wrong after collecting the 1st box and a conda with a big wing of ships jumped in...... however it could have been ok had i bugged out then, but no.... It was a time for heroes and with FA off i spun on my axis and charged head on to the ships ready to scoop the last box, blast past them and into hyperspace. (A rated but no ENG mods)

mistake 1) I forgot just how paper thin class 2 even A shields are

mistake 2) it would seem after a patch my controls had all been unbound... including my chaff launcher control.

so about 3 seconds of fire i get my ship blowing up... and just at that second mistake 3 hit me.................. yes the sidey was cheap to replace.. but

3) the 10 million in unclaimed bounty bonds.. not so much....................... oops!.

It seems you can beat a bit of bully after all!.,

Oh man - I feel your pain!

And yeah, the resetting of control bindings is getting old - I play on multiple systems with multiple commanders, and resetting them is getting annoying...

 

[Skatez69]

Take a look at what you could have won

Not even his BFH by the sounds of it...!

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Not even his BFH by the sounds of it...!

i dunno. i didnt have to pay to get transported to the local medical facility on the near by orbital platform ... that could be the future equivalent of my BFH

 

[Chorda]

Out in the black earning some cred
There's nothing in this game for ending up dead

 

[Ralph Vargr]

Those new Engineering 2.0 upgrades are rapidly becoming mandatory, aren't they?

At least you didn't find it out in a CZ with a legacy Engineered Corvette. Some NPCs have them upgrades too, so no more turkey shoot. Pretty sneaky from Frontier to "convince" the holdouts.

A near certainty.

 

[Faded Glory]

It would be good gameplay if if didn't include the RNG based waiting time.

While I agree with you entirely regarding RNG wait times in missions (they are awful), I'll be honest and say that no, I still don't think it is really good gameplay.

Good gameplay, to me at least might involve the following:

• Having fun combat with the ambushing pirates.
• If I succeed in destroying them either being able to pick up the items I'm after and complete the mission, or at the very least, wake out, target the next mission USS (without a wait) and then scoop the items unopposed, after all, I defeated the opposition.

The issue with the way the ambush scenario plays out right now is that the pirate wing is very strong, at least a high ranked FDL or Anaconda with a couple of mid ranking small ships in tow. Always, utterly predictable, as is their behavior.

It seems to me that FD sometimes use their RNG backwards. It's RNG as to whether I'll get the ambush, doesn't matter what the mission rank or payout is, but totally predictable what will ambush me. Would be better I reckon, if we knew that we were going to face opposition (the mission description should tell us), but that the opposition would be random. Maybe what we have now, or perhaps a wing of Anacondas, or perhaps a couple of Vultures or even a wing of four small ships. That way we have to make a decision on the spot whether we can fight it (could depend on the security state of the system), not just end up with a formulaic way of completing the mission.

 

[Limoncello Lizard]

Good gameplay, to me at least might involve the following:

• Having fun combat with the ambushing pirates.
• If I succeed in destroying them either being able to pick up the items I'm after and complete the mission, or at the very least, wake out, target the next mission USS (without a wait) and then scoop the items unopposed, after all, I defeated the opposition.

I've found the combat to be one of the more enjoyable parts of these missions, particularly when there's about 5 minions. However, it does force you into larger ships.

I don't get what you are saying with "being able to pick up the items I'm after and complete the mission". Provided you haven't destroyed the cans, they are still there after the ships have been destroyed.

But I agree with the rest of your comment. There needs to be more variation in the opposition. Some variation in the behavior of the NPCs would be nice. I'd also like to be able to negotiate or bribe them as well. It should also be possible to do these missions in a small fast ship.

What I'd like is if the USS was persistent, and in a location that didn't require RNG to appear. So behaving more like a CZ, for the duration of the mission.

 

[Faded Glory]

I've found the combat to be one of the more enjoyable parts of these missions, particularly when there's about 5 minions. However, it does force you into larger ships.

Yes, I enjoy it too, but being in a Cobra MkIII puts me (at least with my combat abilities) at a distinct disadvantage against the FDL's and Anacondas. As long as system authority turns up then it is indeed a fun fight.

I don't get what you are saying with "being able to pick up the items I'm after and complete the mission". Provided you haven't destroyed the cans, they are still there after the ships have been destroyed.

On the occasions that I've hung around to fight, once the pirates have been dispatched there are no canisters left in the instance. Whether they got destroyed in the firefight, or whether the fight simply took too long or took us too far from them I don't know, but they were definitely no longer there so the only way to continue is to wake out and wait for the next USS. As said before, then the frustration is that more pirates drop in, it gets a bit old the third and fourth time.

But I agree with the rest of your comment. There needs to be more variation in the opposition. Some variation in the behavior of the NPCs would be nice. I'd also like to be able to negotiate or bribe them as well. It should also be possible to do these missions in a small fast ship.

What I'd like is if the USS was persistent, and in a location that didn't require RNG to appear. So behaving more like a CZ, for the duration of the mission.

Yes, variation would be good, and persistence would be good in so many ways...

As you point out, the current template does sort push one towards using larger, more powerful ships. Personally I hardly ever fly a large ship, only own one, and don't particularly enjoy it. I actually wouldn't mind having to complete it the way I describe earlier if it wasn't the only way to do it, so while it is possible to do in a small ship at the moment (I do and I've done quite a few and not failed one yet), it would be fun if sometimes the fight / combat / tactics could be different.

 

[Faded Glory]

I like to scoop the canisters 'by hand' (preferably on a Cobra Mk3, too. In FA Off it's fun and challenging btw.) but I can imagine with a big ship and collector limpets they can be scooped much faster, before the 'pirates' arrive. In which case it's no issue anyway. But with my method and in Mk3 I have to pull the wing apart to have a chance to fight them. But then I never find the location of the remaining mission cargo again.

I use a collector limpet, and there's only time to collect one, possibly two before the pirates have arrived and started shooting. Cobra's shields do not last long against the current firepower, so for me at least, I want to be boosting away by then.

Same as you, I quite enjoy fighting the pirates (but only if system authority are going to be dropping in to help), but yes, if you do that then the canisters are gone, and even if you manage to destroy the pirates, when you drop into the next USS, the pirates will drop in again, because that's the template...

 

[Spacecat]

mistake 1) I forgot just how paper thin class 2 even A shields are

That's why I hull tanked my sidey.*

*Disclaimer: It ain't much better.

 

[Limoncello Lizard]

Not really. Even if they appear or not seems totally RNG controlled. And these *pirates* are different. They are murderer that will try to kill you no matter whether you have any cargo on board or not. A combat ace in a decent ship could probably blow them up, at which point you've most likely lost track of the cargo you wanted to scoop. So why bother... Or in other words just another no-brainer which is never an indicator of good game design.

I have to disagree.

I tend to use a Python when I am doing salvage missions, especially when I expect to be ambushed by a wing of NPCs. I try to keep track of the canisters, so they are usually there when the fight is over. Though I have rammed them on occasion.

I prefer to use small ships when I can. But sometimes a small ship isn't appropriate. I don't usually take a small ship for Elite assassinations, so treat these missions the same.

I have done these type of missions in ships that are outfitted for mining. Provided you have plenty of active limpets, and can tank some damage for a little while, these missions aren't too hard. A Type-9 is a good ship for this, though it's best to have a high-wake ready.