What would atmospheric entry look like?

amadeus1171

amadeus1171
I saw a neat clip of an anaconda (edit) corvette entering a planet'ss atmosphere and wondered, what would that look like in Elite: Dangerous? What would be the mechanics in game?

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Well, we couldn't orbital glide inside the atmosphere. I suspect that would cause havoc with the planets weather system, among other disturbances.

Perhaps we would orbital glide to just above the atmosphere reentry point. One hundred kilometers sounds about right. The space shuttle used to reenter the earth's atmosphere at 28,157.5 (17,500 mph; mach 22). Even though it's 3304, I don't think any spacecraft in the Elite: Dangerous universe can withstand that about of stress and friction on the hull.

Remember Thor's ship when it got overrun by the replicators on "Stargate SG1"? Thor told them that the ship needed the shields to renter the atmosphere or it would breakup like anything else. The shields in Elite: Dangerous would buckle under that much heat energy, and the ship would fry itself.

Let's say the ship enters the atmosphere at 1200 m/s. It could glide down to 10k altitude. That would take 75 seconds. The shields can withstand those stresses, but you have to navigate a corridor of least resistance to minimize the stress on the spacecraft. Remember "Aliens 2"? If you leave the corridor the ship might suffer serious structural damage, and if you're small enough, disintegrate; no more ship. And oh yeah, you have to have your shields modified for atmospheric landings to withstand the heat.

Yes, I know I watch too many movies and SciFy shows, but I think this idea might be a neat mechanic. What do you think?
 
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TheHavoc

TheHavoc
I think it could be adopted relative easily to current mechanics: I think the ships in elite, even without shields, could withstand 2,5 km/s without any problem, that’s 9000km/h. So this could apply to the current mechanics, as the glide to approach a planet surface currently is also 2,5 km/s. At a certain altitude, in dependence of the atmosphere’s density, temperature, composition and gravity of the planet, the rest of the descend would have to done manually, as is in game now, but from a higher overall altitude. It would be cool if the glide thorugh the atmosphere would require a bit of flightskill, for example when curving around too much one would risk stall or something like that, I’d think that to be cool :D .
 

-VR- Max Factor

-VR- Max Factor
TheHavoc said:
I think it could be adopted relative easily to current mechanics: I think the ships in elite, even without shields, could withstand 2,5 km/s without any problem, that’s 9000km/h. So this could apply to the current mechanics, as the glide to approach a planet surface currently is also 2,5 km/s. At a certain altitude, in dependence of the atmosphere’s density, temperature, composition and gravity of the planet, the rest of the descend would have to done manually, as is in game now, but from a higher overall altitude. It would be cool if the glide thorugh the atmosphere would require a bit of flightskill, for example when curving around too much one would risk stall or something like that, I’d think that to be cool :D .
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You can't stall ships in ED with the thrusters ships have. Also it wouldn't need to look anything like the image above, you could go down at any angle. I would assume that entry into an atmoshpere would use the shields to keep the ship safe and the shield could be designed to make the ship more aerodynamic. You could potentially go down at any speed with the thrusters that the ships have and not really need to use the FSD Glide, but it would take longer.
 

Hellfire85

Hellfire85
TheHavoc said:
It would be cool if the glide thorugh the atmosphere would require a bit of flightskill, for example when curving around too much one would risk stall or something like that, I’d think that to be cool :D .
Click to expand...

Even if it would be cool that atmospheric entry requires skill, don't forget that our ships don't have control surfaces. The thrusters will still do all the work. So logically, we could enter backwards and it shouldn't affect the stability in any way. If our ships were built like "space-planes" with flaps and all the other control surfaces of a modern day airplane, staling would be an issue.

Also, I think FD will oversimplify the re-entry mechanics since too many people are not even able to dock without the use of a docking computer...

Edit: Ninja'd by Max x)
 
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RidingTheFlow

RidingTheFlow
Horizon terrain engine was pretty "meh" to me. Especially these ground structures which still look like something out of 2000-era game, just stuck like a sore thumb in that generated terrain.

They probably could manage to make a nice re-entry graphics, but this going to be enjoyable to watch for about an hour - then what?
 

[DOOK] Droogie

[DOOK] Droogie
Max Factor said:
You can't stall ships in ED with the thrusters ships have. Also it wouldn't need to look anything like the image above, you could go down at any angle. I would assume that entry into an atmoshpere would use the shields to keep the ship safe and the shield could be designed to make the ship more aerodynamic. You could potentially go down at any speed with the thrusters that the ships have and not really need to use the FSD Glide, but it would take longer.
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The biggest issue with using shields to protect the ship on re-entry is that shields are most vulnerable to heat. Also, what if you don't have shields?
 

Franc Kaos

Franc Kaos
amadeus1171 said:
I saw a neat clip of an anaconda entering a planet'ss atmosphere and wondered, what would that look like in Elite: Dangerous? What would be the mechanics in game?
...
Yes, I know I watch too many movies and SciFy shows, but I think this idea might be a neat mechanic. What do you think?
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I think you can never watch too many scifi shows and movies...
Also...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otHnRgZUs2I
(loading screens hidden by weak animatics - so I'm guessing flames blasting by our cockpits).
 

-VR- Max Factor

-VR- Max Factor
Droogie said:
The biggest issue with using shields to protect the ship on re-entry is that shields are most vulnerable to heat. Also, what if you don't have shields?
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Yes shields are vulnerable to extreme pinpointed heat. I am still unsure what extreme heat is though in ED. They seem fine when flying through the upper regions of a star to fuel scoop. But the beam lasers seem to cause them an issue. I have to assume these lasers cause a huge amount of heat in the 10-20,000 deg centigrade range. But I am not sure to be honest.

I have always thought that shields should be a mandatory module. Going thousands of meters per second without shields sounds like a silly thing to do to me with all that space debris flying around near stations and planets and even mini-metreorites in space wouldn't be great if you were unlucky enough to be hit by them.

But if you don't have shields I would think that you could still do reenntry. Just have some heat sinks with you if you mess it up.
 
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Hooplah

Hooplah
In previous Elite games a player would purchase/install an atmospheric shielding module and fly without any speed concerns. Without it the ship would start overheating in the atmosphere (I believe it was 15,000M height) above 250M/s. So one could fly below 250M/s without one to land. It will be interesting to see what ED ends up with.
 
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[DOOK] Droogie

[DOOK] Droogie
Max Factor said:
Yes shields are vulnerable to extreme pinpointed heat. I am still unsure what extreme heat is though in ED. They seem fine when flying through the upper regions of a star to fuel scoop. But the beam lasers seem to cause them an issue. I have to assume these lasers cause a huge amount of heat in the 10-20,000 deg centigrade range. But I am not sure to be honest.

I have always thought that shields should be a mandatory module. Going thousands of meters per second without shields sounds like a silly thing to do to me with all that space debris flying around near stations and planets and even mini-metreorites in space wouldn't be great if you were unlucky enough to be hit by them.

But if you don't have shields I would think that you could still do reenntry. Just have some heat sinks with you if you mess it up.
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Of course, it could also just be more handwavium. Consistency isn't exactly a thing in ED.
 

Leadfoot

Leadfoot
Hellfire85 said:
Even if it would be cool that atmospheric entry requires skill, don't forget that our ships don't have control surfaces. The thrusters will still do all the work. So logically, we could enter backwards and it shouldn't affect the stability in any way.
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Oh, now you've gone and set up the next challenge as soon as atmospheric landings are available: backing into your parking space from orbit all the way down to the pad.

Sounds like fun. :eek:
 
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