Why can't I see the Moon from Earth?

[TarkinLarson]

OK. I know this sounds really stupid but...

When I'm in orbit around the Earth in Sol and I look at the Moon... I can target it and pinpoint it, but it's not visible except as a point of light, just like other distant objects. Why is this when I can clearly seen the moon from the surface of the Earth in real life?

Is it a FOV thing? Is there an optical illusion from the Earth's atmosphere. Shouldn't the Moon and Sun appear the same size in the sky from Earth? Even the Sun appears small, but is larger then the Moon.

PS. For those KSP players... I had to stop calling it Mun! Haha.

 

[sabrex449]

is it because the moon currently is moving slowly away from earth does any one know by 3300 how far this movement would be ?

edit - (1.5 inches) per year should still see it!

 

[Obsidian Ant]

OK. I know this sounds really stupid but...

When I'm in orbit around the Earth in Sol and I look at the Moon... I can target it and pinpoint it, but it's not visible except as a point of light, just like other distant objects. Why is this when I can clearly seen the moon from the surface of the Earth in real life?

Is it a FOV thing? Is there an optical illusion from the Earth's atmosphere. Shouldn't the Moon and Sun appear the same size in the sky from Earth? Even the Sun appears small, but is larger then the Moon.

PS. For those KSP players... I had to stop calling it Mun! Haha.

The draw distance for the smaller planetary bodies is too low. I seem to remember someone saying this was reduced around release time...

 

[Knightshark]

The draw distance for the smaller planetary bodies is too low. I seem to remember someone saying this was reduced around release time...

Yes, i saw a lot of popups since release.

 

[Sandmann]

Are you that at the time you were looking at the moon it would have been illuminated by Sol, and not eclipsed by earth? It's possibly that, though Granite's explanation seems most likely. The moon is apprently 384,400km (384.4Mm) away. If the game was drawing everything that far away there'd be a hit to FPS.

 

[Retu81]

Definitely a draw distance problem.

From Earth, the Moon looks like this ingame:

Spoiler

But when you get closer and the game actually draws it, it looks like this:

Spoiler

For comparison, the Sun from the same location:

Spoiler

The Sun looks like to be the same size as the Moon. As it should be.

 

[TarkinLarson]

Definitely a draw distance problem.

From Earth, the Moon looks like this ingame:

Spoiler

But when you get closer and the game actually draws it, it looks like this:

Spoiler

For comparison, the Sun from the same location:

Spoiler

The Sun looks like to be the same size as the Moon. As it should be.

That's awesome, thanks for doing that. So they are the same size in the game, it's just the draw distance. Cool, thanks!

They still seem a little small to me, so that part of what I was seeing might be a FOV issue so I'll have a play around with it. I don't have an unusual setup... 1080p single monitor. I just expected the moon to appear a bit bigger in the game from Earth

I don't think the moon would've moved that much further, even in 1000 years.Just being rough here... using 1.5 inches a year for 1000 years is 1,500 inches. 1,500 inches is 125 feet. So in metric it's roughly 41 meters further away from earth in 3000 than in 2000.

 

[Helvellyn]

What's the default field of view? The moon's angular diameter from Earth is about 1/2 degree, so should cover 120th of the field of view at 60 degrees (16 pixels if 60 degrees covers 1920 pixels for example).

 

[Geers]

Because it's daytime!

*badum-tsh*.

 

[Quineloe]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

 

[Kitiara]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

So..... wait for planetary landings?

 

[Helvellyn]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

Er, no. It looks as big as it is.

 

[pev69]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

I'm sorry, but this is wrong. The atmosphere's "lens" effect is insignificant.

 

[Jukelo]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

The moon is visible from the ISS.

 

[TarkinLarson]

I'm sorry, but this is wrong. The atmosphere's "lens" effect is insignificant.

I've seen this happen... the moon appears huge when it's near the horizon, but looks 'normal' when it's high in the sky. I guess there's an affect but it won't be as pronounced as what people are experiencing. It's the same the other way around. I expect the 'Earth' rising pictures similar to the Apollo ones taken from the moon, but even the Earth looks small from the moon (in game). I understand all of this is subjective though, which makes it rather hard to express and replicate.

 

[palang81984]

You don't see the moon because it is much further away than it appears to be. The reason we see the moon so well is because of that giant lense called "Atmosphere". If that weren't there, the moon would be too small to see.

<snip> We have the Internet you know.

 

[Hamerstein]

I've seen this happen... the moon appears huge when it's near the horizon, but looks 'normal' when it's high in the sky. I guess there's an affect but it won't be as pronounced as what people are experiencing. It's the same the other way around. I expect the 'Earth' rising pictures similar to the Apollo ones taken from the moon, but even the Earth looks small from the moon (in game). I understand all of this is subjective though, which makes it rather hard to express and replicate.

It's a common misconception, what you are describing does appear to occur, but it's not due to lensing (atmospheric or otherwise). It's because when the moon is near the horizon, you have frames of reference to compare it to (stuff on earth in your field of view), when it's high in the sky, you haven't any frame of reference.

It's just a game that your brain plays with your perceptions, it is a fascinating one though.

Here's one reference for it.

 

[pev69]

I've seen this happen... the moon appears huge when it's near the horizon, but looks 'normal' when it's high in the sky. I guess there's an affect but it won't be as pronounced as what people are experiencing. It's the same the other way around. I expect the 'Earth' rising pictures similar to the Apollo ones taken from the moon, but even the Earth looks small from the moon (in game). I understand all of this is subjective though, which makes it rather hard to express and replicate.

No, the moon can seem larger when near horizon, but this is still not because of any lensing, it is a psychological thing, because you see something (buildings, mountains, whatever) close to the moon, but when the moon is high, there's nothing near it. You can easily do the comparison by extending your hand and comparing the moon's size to your fingernail, in each case. Then you will see that the size is the same always.
EDIT: Okay, Hamerstein got to explain this first, and slightly better
.
As for what you see in game, one part of it is the unfortunately small drawing distance of small bodies (as already said here), the other is the FOV, which in games is always much bigger than what you would actually see through the display "window".

 

[Mephane]

The draw distance for the smaller planetary bodies is too low. I seem to remember someone saying this was reduced around release time...

This. The distance where it transitions to the actual model is far too low atm, possibly by a factor of 2.

 

[Silvershadow]

1) It exists an optical illusion which makes the Moon larger than it is.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moon_illusion

2) The FOV (Field of view) of a ordinary PC-Game makes things generally smaller than they are in reality.

I remember a race simulation of the Nürburgring "Nordschleife" which has taken its coordinates from real satellite datas.
All those pilots who race in real life there have sworn that the track looks much more wider in reality than in the game.
In the game it looked simply like a tiny, small line.
Finally it was simply the effect of the FOV in the race simulator.