Why you can't 'max out' at ED and why it's not so bad as you think

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I think loud complains about nature of ship prices and "income rates" of pure traders made me think that lot of players have taken idea of ED freedom very literary - and this cause a bit of problem. Hear me out.

But putting pure combat progression aside, I think there's some misunderstanding about nature of Elite and sort of trying to force it to be what really won't be. Lot of people point out that they feel forced to grind, feel forced to do things over and over again. This confuses me a lot, because I don't neither feel forced to progress very quickly ED, not I play it that much. I still find lot of things enjoyable to do. And I think there's crux and issue of all debate of ships, "inch deep sea", etc.

ED is more like space commander simulator than game. Therefore by it's nature, it just allows you to live in game. If you enjoy living there - ceavats apply of course - ED is blessing for you. My story in game was - a bit of exploration, then quite a bit of trading, then quite a bit of bounty hunting. I enjoyed all those elements - and I haven't even unlocked Cobra yet. With 1.2 wings it's even more awsome - I just forget why I even bounty hunt, I just go out with friends to blast some nutty pirates. And vola, I am not just Harmless anymore.

But if you don't enjoy being there - if you "hard to satisfy" - or you strictly measure your entertainment - then I don't think anything devs would do will help you - ED will be curse for you. If you try to maximize everything, if you try to complete everything and do it your way and your way only - I think you will view ED as failure. If you are trained to squeeze games dry and move on, ED will be failure, because it will fail to comply. If you just grind because you want that ship - don't. Just don't.

Almost year ago I wrote how ED will be viewed as grind and why it is good. Strike that, I don't think ED is grind, but it is viewed like one by many as I predicted. Hopefully, with more meat for a game, and with more balanced out gaming time after first months crunch many will feel less forced to do something in ED and will just enjoy being here.

See you guys out there, I am usually around Sol/Earth. Let's go blast some pirate Anacondas together.

 

[Ekar]

That's a healthy attitude, but what's your opinion on community goals for eg? The object of that game seems to be 'do the same thing over and over again to get to the top tier'. Of course you could argue- why would you want or need to get to the top tier? But then why even structure things like that to begin with?

 

[Simon853]

I think a lot of it is because the nature of gaming has changed. We've become used to the idea of buying a game, playing it and then "finishing it" before the next big thing comes out. We're all aware of the release schedules for top titles over the next year and people already have one eye on what they're going to buy and play 3 months from now. This means that they believe they should be able to achieve the highest ranks, ships, etc. within that window in order to have got the most out of the game before they move on.

Conversely, a lot of players see ED as something they'll play sporadically for years to come, and therefore expect the high rewards to come over a longer duration and after a lot more work.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I think a lot of it is because the nature of gaming has changed. We've become used to the idea of buying a game, playing it and then "finishing it" before the next big thing comes out. We're all aware of the release schedules for top titles over the next year and people already have one eye on what they're going to buy and play 3 months from now. This means that they believe they should be able to achieve the highest ranks, ships, etc. within that window in order to have got the most out of the game before they move on.

Conversely, a lot of players see ED as something they'll play sporadically for years to come, and therefore expect the high rewards to come over a longer duration and after a lot more work.

I think you nailed it. Then ED is failure from this POV, because it's clearly not that kind of game people would expect. I just hope some of them will see what FD tries to do and will log in now and then and it will become a habit for them.

 

[GunnerBill]

I played Original Elite until my BBC computer ceased to function.

I'll play ED until the servers go cold.

 

[Spiridon]

Yes, you people made a fine point: perceived time to be spent on a game. All expect instant gratification here. Not so in Elites.

I will play this too as you said "until the servers go cold" - or Braben still might surprise us with an offline edition a couple of years from now.

 

[Simon853]

Well, I consider myself in the second group, so by that definition it's not a failure.

To satisfy both player mind sets, there needs to be meaningful rewards that are achievable in the shorter term, or alternative rewards to those achieved by grinding credits alone. Alternatively it requires a mechanism to change the mindset of the first group into that of the second. I'm not sure what that would entail though.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

That's a healthy attitude, but what's your opinion on community goals for eg? The object of that game seems to be 'do the same thing over and over again to get to the top tier'. Of course you could argue- why would you want or need to get to the top tier? But then why even structure things like that to begin with?

Community goals need a bit redesign in my opinion. Rewards are sketchy and really targeted towards completionists - not a bad thing, but as you say, it gives a bit of mixed message about game. I would like to see rare outfitting stuff as reward. Heck, even unique decal would do - I have lot of ideas for this. And no doubt FD wants to see more variety in rewards for CM as well.

As for CM being sole goal - I don't know...It can be fun - I have seen FireyToad get naming rights for Fed Capital ship and I flew over that system to see it my own eyes. Still, it needs more variety to be less tackled on. But i like concept because it gives some sort of rush to complete for some moment of time. It still can't replace whole game for player.

 

[Reido]

I share the OP's point of view regarding this game. For me this is a virtual universe that I come to hang out in for a few hours a day where I can do my own thing.

I'm 51 and been playing computer games since the 1980's and played enough "open world" games to realize that if you approach them from a goal oriented point of view then they quickly turn into a grind to get that next better "thing" and when you've finally got all the "things" there is to get you get bored very quickly. I've ruined a few games for myself doing just that until I started thinking of them in a longer time frame and as an alternate universe to live in.

I've been playing ED for about 2 months now and haven't felt like I've been grinding at all. If I feel like my game play is getting a little stale I'll go do something else in the game for a while, I've got an Adder setup for mining a Cobra setup for combat and smuggling and a T6 for trading and exploration. None of them are that expensive and I get the full range of activities available in the game so far.

Yes, I'd like to fly an Anaconda, and I will...some day, but it will be hundreds of game play hours from now. Right now my alter ego is flying a T6 outfitted as an explorer and heading out to the galactic core. I expect to be gone for a few weeks and if I bite the dust with dozens of pages of cartographic data lost, well I've got insurance and can start the trip again or take up another profession for a while to shake things up. The game isn't going anywhere anytime soon and hopefully will continue to get better as time goes on. Too many people simply don't get it when it comes to open world games and feel like they need to make progress "through" the game and if they feel like they're not making progress then the game is just a grind fest for them and not satisfying because they're not getting their goals fast enough.

My opinion on the community goals is that if I want to contribute to them I will, but I simple don't care about making the top tier and as soon as my part in the goal starts to feel too repetitive then I go do something else before the feeling of "grind" sets in.


Reido

 

[Alexander the Grape]

The problem is not players being frustrated by grinding, it's that grinding=trading. If grinding=bounty hunting, piracy, exploration or mining as well as trading, fewer people would get annoyed. The game's role balance is completely one sided, with one career being far too profitable than any other, which goes directly against what Braben said in the kickstarter campaign.

In short Elite's still good, but it wouldn't hurt for non traders to be able to get a new ship after hour 6

 

[acg515]

People always tell me that games are just grinding now but honestly the old games I remember getting killed like constantly trying to get through a level and I would end up spending hours trying to grind my way out of a level, so it's not like this game is any better. In the old days, it was hard to even beat games. Now I think we've gone too far the other way - games now have like what, 20 hours of gameplay, and then it's over and you maybe grind multiplayer until you get bored and buy the next $60 game? That's console gaming.

I enjoy ED because I enjoy it, I don't know why, I just do. I'm not playing it for the Anaconda, I'm just playing it to screw around and do whatever. So far I am happy with the game and I've had a good time. I don't understand why people who don't like the game continue to play it.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

The problem is not players being frustrated by grinding, it's that grinding=trading. If grinding=bounty hunting, piracy, exploration or mining as well as trading, fewer people would get annoyed. The game's role balance is completely one sided, with one career being far too profitable than any other, which goes directly against what Braben said in the kickstarter campaign.

In short Elite's still good, but it wouldn't hurt for non traders to be able to get a new ship after hour 6

I understand difference between professions and I have said devs have moved in to balance it out (I personally don't believe they should balance them at creds/per hour or day and I see it's not their goal either). However major point remains - why you want to avoid do other things in game? Why you want those ships to be accessable so fast?

I am not saying anyone feeling wrong or anything....I am just saying that some understanding what ED is and where it goes is in order to fully unlock it in your mind.