Will the speed limit be universal or will it vary from ship to ship?

[Astraeus]

We know that there will be a speed limit but will it be universal or vary from ship to ship?

I really dislike the fact that in a lot of space sims bigger ships have a much lower top speed than smaller ones. In my opinion mass and engine/thrusters configuration should only impact acceleration and manoeuvrability.

 

[Patrick_68000]

In FE2, there was no concept of maximum speed for the spaceships. Only differences acceleration and manoeuverability. If I am not mistaken, of course

 

[Dejay]

We know that there will be a speed limit but will it be universal or vary from ship to ship?

I really dislike the fact that in a lot of space sims bigger ships have a much lower top speed than smaller ones. In my opinion mass and engine/thrusters configuration should only impact acceleration and manoeuvrability.

Yeah me too. But the dogfights will be automatically from a large distance or jousting.
AFAIK the ships have different top speeds like 100-200 m/s in your current frame of reference, and absolute engine supported speed limit is like 500m/s.

 

[Calim]

Me too ! I'm not sure to understand your post Dejay.
If you have a working thruster, you can always accelerate in space isn't it ?

What is the current solution adopted in ED ?

And anyway, what would be the point to have a sidewinder to fly at a maximum of 250m/s ? That would be hilarious for a Frontier player

 

[alchemy42]

Conventional engines have a maximum theoretical speed of 500 m/s.

This is done because of the multiplayer environment and issues of trying to keep everyone synced up across the network while moving faster than that. Do a couple of searches around the forums and there are many discussions about this.

Ships will have different top speeds. Possibly the same ship with a different engine might get a better top speed.

 

[Dejay]

Me too ! I'm not sure to understand your post Dejay.
If you have a working thruster, you can always accelerate in space isn't it ?

What is the current solution adopted in ED ?

And anyway, what would be the point to have a sidewinder to fly at a maximum of 250m/s ? That would be hilarious for a Frontier player

Yes, agree With real thrusters you have constant acceleration (newtonian physics). Speed limit is not because of hard technical reasons but because "airplane" combat is more fun that realistic space battles. Else everybody accelerates towards each other and then "whizzes" by (jousting).
So they needed some way to make sure that players will slow down to combat speeds. The combat looks fun though, and you can turn flight assist off and turn around and keep drifting for example (the thrusters do the "airplany" stuff like changing course and breaking after a speed boost). You'll also be able to use "supercruise" to fly faster seamlessly.

The DDF thread about supercruise (frame shift device):
http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=7892

And a couple of threads discussing this and alternatives:
http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=8179
http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=8067
http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=12681

Best discuss this in one of those threads

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Top ship *local* speed around 500 m/s (to be clarified). Various ships will have various speeds in this range.

We don't know how different ships will use supercruise. Maybe there will be variations there too.

 

[CMDR Texas Stu]

I believe the reasoning boils down to exciting and fun gameplay.
The age old question of would you rather have fun and exciting or realism is what the decision came down to. That jousting is far less fun than dog fighting in combat situations as well as some regulation is required for multiplayer to work with modern connectivity. At least this is my take on all I've read.
Yours may be far different. Albeit more balancing is in order, space combat is (so far) engaging and exciting (again this is MY opinion) and although I'd like to see a longer fight and perhaps a little more ability to withstand subsystem attack FD continues to improve the experience. I have faith E: D will be a great game and that FD isn't going to toss their hands up or cut corners.

 

[alchemy42]

I read somewhere on this forum that Admiral Braben didn't care for the flight model in FE2 and preferred to do something closer to the original Elite for Dangerous.

That may or may not be complete , I don't have the source for that quote.

 

[Cody]

That may or may not be complete , I don't have the source for that quote.

This was on the KS page right from the start:

I loved the richness of the galaxy, but with the benefit of hindsight I think the way the ships flew detracted from the joyous immediacy of those in “Elite”.

That was DB, I believe.

 

[JeffRyan]

The speed limit is universal. Speed cameras will be deployed on all major space lanes. Anyone caught breaking it will automatically have their pilot's license revoked for two years.

Don't be a flyman. Be a man flying.

 

[noodle]

The speed limit is universal. Speed cameras will be deployed on all major space lanes. Anyone caught breaking it will automatically have their pilot's license revoked for two years

Should be fine so long as they're not average cameras.

 

[laforge]

I believe the reasoning boils down to exciting and fun gameplay.
The age old question of would you rather have fun and exciting or realism is what the decision came down to. That jousting is far less fun than dog fighting in combat situations as well as some regulation is required for multiplayer to work with modern connectivity. At least this is my take on all I've read.
Yours may be far different. Albeit more balancing is in order, space combat is (so far) engaging and exciting (again this is MY opinion) and although I'd like to see a longer fight and perhaps a little more ability to withstand subsystem attack FD continues to improve the experience. I have faith E: D will be a great game and that FD isn't going to toss their hands up or cut corners.

For me realism is also fun, especially here where we have a realistic scaled galaxy. It is not either fun or either realism. I dont know what experience you or others had with 'realistic' games (maybe the interface was too complicated? thats something I would not like either), but in general I had alot fun playing these. And why struggle with a realistic world at all if the rest doesnt fit?

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I read somewhere on this forum that Admiral Braben didn't care for the flight model in FE2 and preferred to do something closer to the original Elite for Dangerous.

That may or may not be complete , I don't have the source for that quote.

Speed limit however is technical limitation due of network component. Judging from FD dev information, they tested different combinations of Newtonian/FA combat, and decided to go FA due of making combat more interesting.

Mike Evans said that when flying just Newtonian combat turned into circle strafing fest. Which essentially what's happening in MP now when people start to use FA off.

 

[PacalB]

Yes, agree With real thrusters you have constant acceleration (newtonian physics). Speed limit is not because of hard technical reasons but because "airplane" combat is more fun that realistic space battles.

Indeed, it is. :smilie:

You say, "airplane" combat is more fun that realistic space battles"? I would agree and add, if we went the realistic space battle route, we would never see an enemy ship. All engagements would be BVR (Beyond Visual Range), we would end up with a stealth missile or a x-ray beam coming out of the blackness and taking us out before we knew what hit us.

Forget accelerations with newtonian physics, any stealth missile could far out burn any human toting ships pitiful G burn (along with anything a human body could handle for that matter). In fact, roll on to 3300 it wouldn't be ships doing the fighting but complex ultra advanced USV's (Unmanned Space Vehicles). What some are suggesting is a form of Submarine/Mini-Carrier Warfare set in space. A different game/sim entirely no?

 

[CMDR Texas Stu]

For me realism is also fun, especially here where we have a realistic scaled galaxy. It is not either fun or either realism. I dont know what experience you or others had with 'realistic' games (maybe the interface was too complicated? thats something I would not like either), but in general I had alot fun playing these. And why struggle with a realistic world at all if the rest doesnt fit?

I played a Newtonian style space sim recently. I can see the reasoning on doing it the way it is being done given networking and other considerations. While I'm sure no decisions will meet with everyone's approval I am of the opinion that FD has spent a lot of time working things out. I am happy that the way they are going is with entertainment as the priority. I believe it will pass the test of time if they continue applying their concepts and improving the player experience. To me it's obvious they are as much wanting E: D to be what they would want to play as it being a product they sell. I look forward to it's continued emmergence!

 

[Globusdiablo]

Don't be a flyman. Be a man flying.

Why not be a fly, man?!

speed limit is not because of hard technical reasons but because "airplane" combat is more fun that realistic space battles.

Blasphemy!! I beg to differ sir!! Shall we say 20 paces?!

 

[noodle]

Blasphemy!! I beg to differ sir!! Shall we say 20 paces?!

But will you continue to move when you stop pacing?

 

[Globusdiablo]

But will you continue to move when you stop pacing?

Mass x gravitational acceleration x negative friction = ??:S

I don't know...

 

[Exmortis]

This is probably one of those situations where "ignorance is bliss". Don't dig too deep into what is realistic and just have fun. A space setting in general where people are hopping between star systems like it's a intercontinental flight on Earth doesn't exactly hold up to scientific scrutiny. It's pretty much a fantasy setting so relax and enjoy it.