Xbox gamepad over joystick/HOTAS?

[CMDR Reza Malin]

Hey all,

Just wanted to make a thread about this. So i have been playing ED since launch, done pretty good so far, got nearly a max spec Imperial Clipper. Just saving for the last couple of upgrades. All the time i played i have been using an Xbox gamepad for PC. During this time i was constantly hearing about how awesome HOTAS is for the game, so i bought a reasonable priced HOTAS stick. It is really nice, and great quality, i was quite excited when;

It got delivered.
Plugged it in.
Logged on.
Undocked.
Went spiralling around all over the place trying to coordinate between sticks, joystick buttons and keyboard.
Lost 60% hull from multiple sources just getting out of the station.
Logged off.

The HOTAS is now gathering dust, and im back to they gamepad. Im sure given time i could get used to it, but the point i am making is that i just don't get how the HOTAS is better than a gamepad in all honesty, other than immersion value of having a throttle stick. Can someone enlighten me if i am missing something?

My gamepad has 3 different axis possibilities (2 sticks and a D-pad), and 10 buttons.
My joystick has 3 different axis possibilities, (stick, throttle and POV hat), and 10 buttons.

Main difference being all the gamepad functionality is at my fingertips and the axis inputs are more responsive and more accurate. The stick requires more fiddling around and more effort.

Thoughts?

 

[BoingZebadee]

Hi Reza, try using the flight training to sort out the controls for the Hotas, no mashup of your credit balance, you can also change the joystick so 1 button is a shift button, ie. on my T Flight Hotas the centre button 2 is used as the shift so that all buttons have a double action, the throttle 5 and 6 buttons are thrust up and down but with the 2 pressed as well they are landing gear and cargo scoop, 9 and 10 are boost and target but with shift they are FSD and highest threat target.

You also need to have the right set up for the axis controls as one is digital and the other is analogue. The wrong one messes up the gameplay too much.

I would advise you to stick with the Hotas and perhaps mess around with your deadzone settings in setup. The first day I used mine I realised that my high d.p.I. mouse was much more accurate than the Hotas and I stopped playing with the Hotas for a couple of days. But after looking through these threads there are many downloadable configuration options and they also tell you if you have the analogue and digital settings the wrong way round.

Anyway like I said it took me about 6 - 8 hours to learn how to use it properly and now I can kill just about anything in my little viper, even elite Annacondas and you get paid over 100k credits for the kill. Learning to use thrusters and the throttle should keep you behind almost any target without having to resort to jousting, especially because jousting with Annacondas isn't a great way to fight.

Stick with the "stick" and perfect your setup on the training missions, also when I first used mine I over shot and underestimated almost every movement I tried to make, I can now kick butt with the best of them and I've only had it a month or so, but wouldn't go back to the mouse and keyboard even though I thought it was so much more accurate than the Hotas.

Stick with it and by Sunday you will waste every NPC you want, then you can try warzones, (much harder but better quality of opponent). Finally next weekend you can give fellow commanders a run for "their" money and clean up your actions with the Joystick.

Scaega posted this in one of the joystick threads and it fixed my control problems.....

Make sure you configure the "axis" for each (x, y, z) axis of the joystick in the Controls, don't bind them to the individual directions. Sounds like you have each direction bound to the individual key bindings and not the axis which will make each direction input full thrust upon movement of the stick. If you setup the axis binding it will be an analog input. I play with the same joystick (for now) and it works perfectly.

Happy hunting.

 

[mnh]

During this time i was constantly hearing about how awesome HOTAS is for the game, so i bought a reasonable priced HOTAS stick.
[...]
My gamepad has 3 different axis possibilities (2 sticks and a D-pad), and 10 buttons.
My joystick has 3 different axis possibilities, (stick, throttle and POV hat), and 10 buttons.

Main difference being all the gamepad functionality is at my fingertips and the axis inputs are more responsive and more accurate. The stick requires more fiddling around and more effort.

With hotas, "reasonably priced" tends to mean barebones. If it's something like the Speedlink Black Widow, it's not terrible, but it absolutely can't compete with X52s, X55s or Warthogs, which is what many hotas users here use (and where "elite's awesome for hotas" comes from). Xbox controllers are probably somewhere in the middle.

Aside from that: it takes some getting used to.

 

[Yokai]

I can only speak from context of one hotas: Saitek X52 Pro. Yes I did play only with the xbox controller for Windows at first. The learning curve when I switched over to the X52 was probably two weeks total. First few days felt really clumsy, but now I'd never go back, and every action is right in my two hands as always.

Having fine control of your throttle with the kinesthetic awareness of your entire arm, plus simultaneous control of your thrusters under the index finger or thumb of your throttle hand, is priceless once you build the muscle memory.

A lot will depend on whether your stick has yaw built in or not. Some people like the yaw on their stick, and some hate it and prefer using pedals to control yaw.

BTW, xbox controller worked great for station to station flight (trading), but where the hotas shines is when it comes to combat, where constant and precise throttle variation is required while also doing a lot of other stuff. The 10 percent increments for throttle on the xbox shoulder buttons just don't cut it.

 

[Frank]

I'm using an Xbox360 controller. I've given a HOTAS a go at the Elite events. I was impressed by the ability to match speed easier with the set-up, but I don't think the gain would be worth all the effort. If I bought one I would need to do a bit of carpentry to attach the controllers to the arms of my chair. I don't play in front of a desk.

I got stick extenders to increase the controller's precision, and Voice Attack addresses those functions I can't assign to buttons. I'm now so used to what I got I really don't feel the need to change it.

 

[welshronaldo]

I had pretty much the same experience as you, Reza. Briefly tried the T-Flight Hotas X (very budget) and couldn't get used to it at all. I'm sure the more expensive sticks do provide a better, more authentic experience but I guess it's not for everyone. I've got all the controls I need on the Xbox One controller and I'm very happy with it but I think the above comment about combat is probably true, lacks a little in the throttle control department.

 

[Tox Laximus]

The xbox one controller has a better deadzone than the 360 and its pretty good but a hotas is better I should imagine.

 

[ChrisUK27]

If the flight assist mode was similar to that of what's in the Promo video then I think I would be far better with an XBox controller (Similar to flying a helicopter in BF). Currently though it's more akin to flying a plane so a HOTAS works well.

 

[Time Streamer]

I can only speak from context of one hotas: Saitek X52 Pro. Yes I did play only with the xbox controller for Windows at first. The learning curve when I switched over to the X52 was probably two weeks total. First few days felt really clumsy, but now I'd never go back, and every action is right in my two hands as always.

Having fine control of your throttle with the kinesthetic awareness of your entire arm, plus simultaneous control of your thrusters under the index finger or thumb of your throttle hand, is priceless once you build the muscle memory.

A lot will depend on whether your stick has yaw built in or not. Some people like the yaw on their stick, and some hate it and prefer using pedals to control yaw.

---

Couldn't agree more. I play with an X52 PRO and at first, i never thought i would enjoy it so much as i enjoy playing combat sims with it. Some nights ago, i came to the house of this friend CMDR of mine, and he plays with Key+Mouse. Looking at the senseless binary inputs from keyboard, playing with an HOTAS system is almost minimum requirement for ED. Foolishly reminds me of X-Wing Vs Tie-Fighter who forces the player to have a joystick or else game won't start. An analogic gamepad would be my first option over key+mouse if i didn't have the money/patience/flight nerdism.

 

[CMDR Reza Malin]

With hotas, "reasonably priced" tends to mean barebones. If it's something like the Speedlink Black Widow, it's not terrible, but it absolutely can't compete with X52s, X55s or Warthogs, which is what many hotas users here use (and where "elite's awesome for hotas" comes from). Xbox controllers are probably somewhere in the middle.

Aside from that: it takes some getting used to.

Ha ha, right on the money, that's the one i got. In fairness, its pretty solid though.

I can only speak from context of one hotas: Saitek X52 Pro. Yes I did play only with the xbox controller for Windows at first. The learning curve when I switched over to the X52 was probably two weeks total. First few days felt really clumsy, but now I'd never go back, and every action is right in my two hands as always.

Having fine control of your throttle with the kinesthetic awareness of your entire arm, plus simultaneous control of your thrusters under the index finger or thumb of your throttle hand, is priceless once you build the muscle memory.

A lot will depend on whether your stick has yaw built in or not. Some people like the yaw on their stick, and some hate it and prefer using pedals to control yaw.

BTW, xbox controller worked great for station to station flight (trading), but where the hotas shines is when it comes to combat, where constant and precise throttle variation is required while also doing a lot of other stuff. The 10 percent increments for throttle on the xbox shoulder buttons just don't cut it.

Well i'm no rookie, done a lot of combat with my controller. I remapped most of the controls in all honesty. The bumpers do throttle for me, no 10% increments. i have left and right thrusters on the X and B buttons. Boost is the A button. Lock target is Y. Headlook is click right stick then control it with right stick. Vertical thrusters are on the right stick up/down axis, which controls yaw left and right also. Left stick remains the same roll/climb/dive. Left stick click is change weapon group, and the back button is the all important shield cell. Everything else i do on the keyboard right in front of me, my hands are right over it so they never have to move far and rarely need to leave the controller except for FA off, landing gear etc. Navigation, comms and systems i use headlook to look at the relevant console and then use the controller buttons to navigate there. Having headlook on the right stick, and pitch and roll on the left is nice.

Im really happy with it which i guess is why i don't want to learn a new system that feels awkward.

I do appreciate what you and others are saying about the HOTAS being better given time to adjust though.

I had pretty much the same experience as you, Reza. Briefly tried the T-Flight Hotas X (very budget) and couldn't get used to it at all. I'm sure the more expensive sticks do provide a better, more authentic experience but I guess it's not for everyone. I've got all the controls I need on the Xbox One controller and I'm very happy with it but I think the above comment about combat is probably true, lacks a little in the throttle control department.

I don't have an issue with throttle on the left and right bumpers, cant even remember if that's where they always were or if i remapped them.

The xbox one controller has a better deadzone than the 360 and its pretty good but a hotas is better I should imagine.

Well i changed all the deadzones on my xbox config, all the axis settings have adjustable deadzones. Though im sure the XB1 controller is just better than a 360 one. I have an xbox one and i think its true.




Appreciate all the feedback and interesting comments.