U16

Yes. Both points, I think, where the balancing required isn't straightforward, either - because there are two groups of people involved in the war; loosely, the ones who want to fight it and the ones who want to win it (or at least believe that they could win it) - and they have very different requirements.
I am in the former group, and I am bummed about not having invasions anymore (I might have mentioned that moaned about it a few times already). Personally, I feel that the tissue sampling should have been nerfed down heavily; but I suppose Frontier wanted to avoid the same whining we got when the war started ("it is too hard!", "we can't win!").

From my perspective, if there are "alternative approaches" or more efficient machanics, those players who want to "win" will always devise a way to what I would describe as cheesing it, and the "winners" will always outcheese the other group. This isn't unique to the war; look at all the best-start-billionaire-in-a-day guides, it's the same thing. It's the old outcome orientated vs. enjoying the ride issue.

Still. Ask me? Nerf sampling into the ground and take the whining about the unwinnable war like a champ.
 
I am in the former group, and I am bummed about not having invasions anymore (I might have mentioned that moaned about it a few times already). Personally, I feel that the tissue sampling should have been nerfed down heavily; but I suppose Frontier wanted to avoid the same whining we got when the war started ("it is too hard!", "we can't win!").
I think that's two separate balance issues, though they look pretty similar:
1) Sampling is - when min-maxed, at least - massively overpowered compared with other activities. The correct nerf for it is probably including something like "one sample per Thargoid" (which keeps it potentially viable as an interesting supplement at the cost of direct combat effectiveness in a CZ or other scenario) rather than just a raw numbers tweak, though.
2) The system targets as a whole have been dropped to the point where the human side makes net gains of about 40 systems a week, and will keep doing so until all the Maelstroms are compressed to the heavily diminishing returns stage. They'd presumably have done that regardless of sampling - they'd started on it well before systematic harvesting was a thing, after all - and would presumably have done it considerably more if sampling wasn't so effective - and that's the bit that's really taking out the Invasions.

From my perspective, if there are "alternative approaches" or more efficient machanics, those players who want to "win" will always devise a way to what I would describe as cheesing it, and the "winners" will always outcheese the other group. This isn't unique to the war; look at all the best-start-billionaire-in-a-day guides, it's the same thing. It's the old outcome orientated vs. enjoying the ride issue.
On a per-system basis, certainly - but a lot of what's going on at the strategic level is also about thinking about how to target the moves as a war rather than just fighting in random systems and hoping. That's outcome-oriented, sure, but it's also a lot of fun for people who like that sort of planning; take the possibility of that away, and they might as well just set aside a bunch of systems as a permanent "Thargoid War nature reserve" where people can fight their AX CZs and other scenarios each week with no effect on the wider galaxy.

Nerf sampling into the ground and take the whining about the unwinnable war like a champ.
I suspect the biggest balance problem isn't so much about whether the exact balance of the war is winnable or unwinnable (on the scale of the bubble, even the original Thargoid pace would have taken decades to win, there was nothing wrong with that in itself) but on the whole "your punishment for ingenuity is" issue.

If any clever tactic or strategy on the human side is responded to with a "sorry, you can't do that" from Frontier to keep the overall balance within parameters, then there's not much point trying to figure them out. Equally, if they just go for a "set it going and let player actions do what they will" approach (which I'm sure they'd prefer), the inevitable result is something like now where weaknesses in the Thargoid strategy (and to a growing extent, the ability to do things that no Thargoid strategy could counter; if Taranis has just 3 choices for Alerts it doesn't matter how many Alerts it can place at maximum or what its strategy for choosing is) lock down the war too much.
 
and they might as well just set aside a bunch of systems as a permanent "Thargoid War nature reserve" where people can fight their AX CZs and other scenarios each week with no effect on the wider galaxy.
They did do that, in Witch Head; unfortunately there is still no prison ship out there, so most people refused to bother fighting there and risk being shipped ~1000LYs away to the Pleiades if you're unfortunate enough to have an untimely rebuy with a local bounty.
 
I know it is a tough balancing act. I wouldn't want to be the one to balance it. But it is always sad if gameplay has to make room for strategy and "winning". The disappearance of planetary CZs is a loss. Not just for the reload and repair facilities, but fighting a Thargoid on an atmospheric planet while the sun is rising is one of the most spectacular things you can do, and then some if you do it in VR.

I'm simple. I don't want to win that war, I want to keep having an awesome time within the game rather than at the planning table.
 
I know it is a tough balancing act. I wouldn't want to be the one to balance it. But it is always sad if gameplay has to make room for strategy and "winning". The disappearance of planetary CZs is a loss. Not just for the reload and repair facilities, but fighting a Thargoid on an atmospheric planet while the sun is rising is one of the most spectacular things you can do, and then some if you do it in VR.
There's nothing stopping you fighting thargoids near planetary surfaces in control systems. You can even have your pick of atmosphere type.
 
I wonder if that huge permit locked region of space will get opened in U16... probably as likely as fighting Thargoids on foot/CZ's and getting tritium directly to the FC depot. As well as numerous other wonts.

But... I live in hope that one day we'll see all of... well, most of... well, some of... a few of our requested stuffs happen.
 
They fixed the bug I raised a year ago - woohoo! \o/ https://issues.frontierstore.net/issue-detail/50551

I guess having realistic expectations helps with these patches - looking forward to seeing the MB tribute missons (y)
I too thought the Brooks Galactic Tours was a nice touch. Probably going to visit those beacons tonight. As for the rest, there are a couple of nice fixes in the notes; caustic sink restock and glowing hearts for the fighters, and the oh so annoying crash site mission items not spawning. Also the invisible rings. If all the fixes listed in the notes do stick, I'm a happy camper.
 
It's a chunky update and an 8-hour outage, and the non-spoiler patch notes aren't particularly long. Fingers crossed for unexpected new content....
 

Ozric

Volunteer Moderator
I'll reserve my judgement for a week and hope there's a lot more to it than it feels.

I am very pleased to see the addition of the tourist beacons for MB, they will definitely be my first port of call.
 
Seems like FDEV approach is: New content - but not for you console plebs; New content but only for those that engage in the 'evolving narrative'; New content but only for those born on a day without the letter 'y' in it, a month with the letter 'w' in it and a year that has 29 days in February but isnt a leap year. Hey, we have delivered tons of new content!!!!

This is an sandbox game isnt it? Or is ED becoming a linear narative driven storyline single player game.

Also glad to see FDEV is focusing on the priority things: 'Added some new cup props to certain social areas (which are technically "zero-g" environments) to mostly avoid the issue of having un-capped beverages in these areas' - Personally I think investing effort into this is 1,000,000% a waste of time - even investing effort to comment on this in the release notes is a waste of effort - but FDEV see this is high priority.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom