Elite Dangerous | Thargoid War Changes | 6th June 2024

Since these changes, you have a single day to find out where to go to evacuate, and pick whoever you can - absolutely no time to build rep and make an income.
Then it's gone. In a single day.
As a workaround - since Frontier don't seem to want "25 LY stalemate with plenty of invasions" to be the situation for the next few months - building rep for the systems to be attacked next week while they're clear now will let you start out at higher rep when they do.

Inhabited system attacks which are extremely likely to take place next week:
Indra: Obamumbo, HIP 20485 (plus some others, but they're harder to be certain about which ones)
Cocijo: Picenile
Thor: Theemim, HIP 21724 (others possible but may be prevented easily)
Raijin: Vistnero, Isla, HIP 117177

While the attack on Indra goes on there's a good chance of Alerts at the others recurring on a roughly 3-week cycle, so after a few weeks you could have high rep at a lot of the systems built up already. (Indra's targeting will be a lot more erratic because of the attack, so despite its much higher number of inhabited targets, less good for pre-building rep with)
 
Maybe we could see the titans giving up controlled systems to put a couple nearby inhabited systems directly into invasion state, bypassing alert, when they have no successful alerts the previous week. Gives us more opportunity for the gameplay some people (like me) enjoy and lets those activities still progress the war by taking a controlled system off the board.

Dunno what to do about keeping alert activities around for the whole week. Maybe just don't clear the alert till thargsday when progress reaches 100% and let people keep doing those activities even if they don't add to progress? Bonus engineering (GUARDIAN) materials for mission rewards after 100%.
 
Maybe we could see the titans giving up controlled systems to put a couple nearby inhabited systems directly into invasion state, bypassing alert, when they have no successful alerts the previous week. Gives us more opportunity for the gameplay some people (like me) enjoy and lets those activities still progress the war by taking a controlled system off the board.

Dunno what to do about keeping alert activities around for the whole week. Maybe just don't clear the alert till thargsday when progress reaches 100% and let people keep doing those activities even if they don't add to progress? Bonus engineering (GUARDIAN) materials for mission rewards after 100%.
Further down the text I tried to defend my position but it was explained to me that I didn't understand anything.

What's really going on and how it used to be from my layman's point of view.

Was: people learned about the port under attack (better with a large site) moved there aircraft carrier and a whole week to do tasks to defend the port is fun and not difficult because of the repair and lack of swarms.

Became: Learned about the port, flew in, did a lot of missions, all the port closed. It's all very quick.
And no amount of increased rewards will drive people to do it in conflict zones, where there are no repairs, where there are a lot of swarms, etc.

P.S. I try not to make any more suggestions from their wrong understanding, and if they think that nothing should be done with weapons against swarms (this I do not understand at all), they could at least from the Capital Ships, at a strong approach to them, could release a very strong repair drone on my ship to repair my hull and replenish my munitions.
 
Further down the text I tried to defend my position but it was explained to me that I didn't understand anything.

What's really going on and how it used to be from my layman's point of view.

Was: people learned about the port under attack (better with a large site) moved there aircraft carrier and a whole week to do tasks to defend the port is fun and not difficult because of the repair and lack of swarms.

Became: Learned about the port, flew in, did a lot of missions, all the port closed. It's all very quick.
And no amount of increased rewards will drive people to do it in conflict zones, where there are no repairs, where there are a lot of swarms, etc.

P.S. I try not to make any more suggestions from their wrong understanding, and if they think that nothing should be done with weapons against swarms (this I do not understand at all), they could at least from the Capital Ships, at a strong approach to them, could release a very strong repair drone on my ship to repair my hull and replenish my munitions.
you can kill swarms with flak. you can repair with limpets. you can synth ammo.
as much as i like invasions and i made myself pretty vocal about them in the past, there is much more game to be played than just the attacked ground port. invasions are the kids pool of ax. at some point you are expected to ditch the training wheels and spread your own wings.
if you need someone else to take care of the swarm and someone else to take care of your repairs and someone else to take of your rearms, you dont get to choose where and when you are 'invited' to the party.
maybe thargoid combat is supposed to be difficult. maybe you are not supposed to be raking in the best rewards in the game with one thumb in your nose and the other up your bum.

when the invasions first disappeared it outed me to counterstrike systems and you know what? it made me a much better pilot. i hope you will get there too.
but if not, oh well...
 
Dunno what to do about keeping alert activities around for the whole week. Maybe just don't clear the alert till thargsday when progress reaches 100% and let people keep doing those activities even if they don't add to progress?

That was how it used to be; it was well over a year ago that I pointed out some systems were being defended well beyond 100%, and I suggested here that it should inform Commanders with messages but let them remain if they choose. We we given Inbox and Info panel messages—but also Invasions stopping at 100%, then very soon after that Alerts and Controls stopping at 100%.


Maybe we could see the titans giving up controlled systems to put a couple nearby inhabited systems directly into invasion state, bypassing alert, when they have no successful alerts the previous week. Gives us more opportunity for the gameplay some people (like me) enjoy and lets those activities still progress the war by taking a controlled system off the board.

Very unlikely to happen; it is quite clear, especially now that Spire progress no longer affects other Spires, that every single system cleared actually has to be visited at some point in doing so. It makes also little sense for an enemy to trade Control for Invasion! The simple solution to needing more Invasions is just adding more Invasions without affecting anything else, perhaps with the Titan sending smaller U.I.A. signals in the directions of the Invasion target systems.

Ideally Control systems would be more appealing for Invasion defenders to visit, which I think could happen if we get a change such as Conflict zones in Counterstrike systems gaining a form of restock within the zone, perhaps one which has to be defended. It is intended to be challenging though; I have a special support-the-system-forces vessel which can complete a High zone itself without restock, and moreover Commanders are intended to form wings to do it.

Notably the Swarms dissuade some, although there are also many Invasion defenders who prefer Outposts—it is much more about having restock available!


Further down the text I tried to defend my position but it was explained to me that I didn't understand anything.

Reading your original query, actually I would say I did not understand what you were asking! That is to say, you may have understood it, and I would not judge whether you understood it. From the other topic:

Who is an expert on this war, tell me if I'm right or wrong.
In my opinion, the main change that will happen is the transition to dynamics, ie no longer get together in a pile once a week, you need to constantly attack otherwise the next day may find that we completely lost.

There were several large changes, but I think you could have been referring to Spire sites giving peripheral progress; definitely it is true that we have no more need for fixed lists of peripheral systems each week with Research cargo targets on each, if that is what you meant with "get together in a pile".

As for us attacking constantly, I would not say that we need to do that, but now that Spire progress continues onward to new systems when present systems are completed, definitely attacking constantly is now something we can do! The reason I say we do not need to attack constantly is that now we can win eventually just by clearing all Alerts and attacking just one Control weekly, where the new strength changes make that possible all the way to the final system.

Before those changes we needed to use Spire sites for the last few systems and do everything we could to prevent new Alerts. Now, we can just clear all Alerts and take any Control systems we want, although indeed it is more efficient to attack constantly by using the Spires and Titan rescues to help take the outermost and Counterstrike systems.
 
maybe you are not supposed to be raking in the best rewards in the game with one thumb in your nose and the other up your bum.
I always thought my translation sounded too rough for others. I'm sorry. I never want that.

I've been in the game since 2015 I've fought a lot with Targoids, mostly in single player, I like playing single player. Sometimes i do crew invitations. I like that.
Yes I can take a medium ship, no shield and use keyboard and mouse but I don't like it, I become a normal pilot in that case.
I've played a lot of RPGs and I'm used to the fact that if I invest more in equipment and weapons, better armor, better defense, lots of materials and money I've accumulated over the years should help me deal with more powerful enemies !
I still haven't bought PythonMk2 (I have 47 arx) because if I buy it I will be a regular pilot ! And I want to play the way I like to play.
 
There were several large changes, but I think you could have been referring to Spire sites giving peripheral progress; definitely it is true that we have no more need for fixed lists of peripheral systems each week with Research cargo targets on each, if that is what you meant with "get together in a pile".

As for us attacking constantly, I would not say that we need to do that, but now that Spire progress continues onward to new systems when present systems are completed, definitely attacking constantly is now something we can do! The reason I say we do not need to attack constantly is that now we can win eventually just by clearing all Alerts and attacking just one Control weekly, where the new strength changes make that possible all the way to the final system.

Before those changes we needed to use Spire sites for the last few systems and do everything we could to prevent new Alerts. Now, we can just clear all Alerts and take any Control systems we want, although indeed it is more efficient to attack constantly by using the Spires and Titan rescues to help take the outermost and Counterstrike systems.
I play mostly single player and I don't like the spire system, in fact I've only been there once when I was farming tactical chips. I didn't participate in the credit chase because I thought it was a bug (Orpheus kills).
In the spire zone I can't repair my ship quickly and replenish my ammo.
 
In the spire zone I can't repair my ship quickly and replenish my ammo.

Very true; exactly that matter of restocking was the entire basis for my other response regarding Invasion being so much more popular than Control, and for suggesting that Control systems with Counterstrike could gain a limited amount of restocking in Conflict zones!
 
That was how it used to be; it was well over a year ago that I pointed out some systems were being defended well beyond 100%, and I suggested here that it should inform Commanders with messages but let them remain if they choose. We we given Inbox and Info panel messages—but also Invasions stopping at 100%, then very soon after that Alerts and Controls stopping at 100%.
It makes sense, why continue attacking a port if they've lost, divert resources elsewhere. Could argue irrelevant in a game where infinite goids can be summoned up
I play mostly single player and I don't like the spire system, in fact I've only been there once when I was farming tactical chips. I didn't participate in the credit chase because I thought it was a bug (Orpheus kills).
In the spire zone I can't repair my ship quickly and replenish my ammo.
My understanding is that scouts progress spires as much as Orthrus and the continual supply means they are plentiful. Tapping an orthrus so it summons defenders then departs is a valid single player approach and you should also get the odd interceptor. Fly a few km away to repair / synth, or find a carrier in a nearby system rather than synth ammo for several weapons

There is still no good answer for ensuring invasion activity and defence. Most or all alerts will be cleared each week, and any invasions are consequently quickly cleared. Several decent suggestions such as a skipping alerts for a handful of systems made but not clear if devs see these or they aren't straightforward to do
 
you can kill swarms with flak. you can repair with limpets. you can synth ammo.
as much as i like invasions and i made myself pretty vocal about them in the past, there is much more game to be played than just the attacked ground port. invasions are the kids pool of ax. at some point you are expected to ditch the training wheels and spread your own wings.
I thought we were expected to do things our own way which includes not ditching the training wheels if we are having enough fun.

The perceived need to progress to the more advanced portions of the Thargoid war is one of the things that puts me off participating in it.
 
I thought we were expected to do things our own way which includes not ditching the training wheels if we are having enough fun.
yes, you can have fun any way you want :)
The perceived need to progress to the more advanced portions of the Thargoid war is one of the things that puts me off participating in it.
the invasions situation (their lack of) was my real disenfrenchisement of the war. but the war got better and in the end i got better as well. and while the situation might persist, there are options...
however
if someone doesnt participate in the war because the game doesnt have automatic aoe swarm deleter and invincible ship on their ass to repair and rearm on site, i dont think thats the games fault...
 
Very true; exactly that matter of restocking was the entire basis for my other response regarding Invasion being so much more popular than Control, and for suggesting that Control systems with Counterstrike could gain a limited amount of restocking in Conflict zones!
It's not just about the stockpile. Of the big ships you can fly there without losses only on Cutter, all the rest will be damaged no matter how hard they try, especially if there is no shield ;( So it turns out that you flew to AXCZ and fix yourself for a long time ... before you start :(
 
if someone doesnt participate in the war because the game doesnt have automatic aoe swarm deleter and invincible ship on their ass to repair and rearm on site, i dont think thats the games fault...
Certainly not the game's fault, especially when this situation didn't exist before 18.06
And yes:
1. I am not interested in the swarm as I fly a shieldless fast ship build and ignore it completely. What is swarming anyway?
2. Why an unbeatable ship ? I have a fast PythonMk2 I can easily run away from everywhere and if I do not run away, I will object for 0 credits.
3. Message in discord : Hey people, let's go to war today ?
Nah, I'm going to the cottage today, and I'm renovating.
Well, I'm not going then ... because I don't have the guts to go alone.
I went to bed.

:)
P.S. No one asked to destroy the swarm by area.
 
if someone doesnt participate in the war because the game doesnt have automatic aoe swarm deleter and invincible ship on their ass to repair and rearm on site, i dont think thats the games fault...
It might not always be the game’s fault, but consider that even if players do have the necessary skill(or persistence) to do the space AXCZs, they might not want to throw lots and lots of materials at ammo synths in order to complete them(and good luck getting all the way through a high when you end up dealing with 2 or more Medusas - even in a low CZ that is likely to have you end up with the need to throw more ammo at your weapons on the fly).

You might say, “Not an issue”. I say, it is an unnecessary gameplay disruption because it sends you off to some brain tree or shard and (if you intend to use Guardian weapons) the Guardian sites for all the respective synth materials. The only one you might get covered “Just by playing” is picking up G5 material mission rewards in a nearby alert system.

I don’t consider that very exciting or “engaging game design”. Stop your fun gameplay to do something that is a chore which you have no other reason to do (like visit the Guardian sites for blueprints, that I currently do not need) so you can have fun again. Woohoo.

So yes, I fight in space AXCZs and am capable of completing them to the Hydra stage even if they throw two Medusas or three Basilisks at me(which doesn’t appear to be that uncommon), but I have my reasons to think why [I believe] having the rearm/repair option available in at least some of the counterstrikes, like the populated ones, would be a good thing. Just throw it into the Very High intensity zones or stop making port conflicts a mind numbing spam of 50 Cyclops and maybe once or twice a Basilisk.

I’ve seen more Medusas and Basis fighting in open space CZs in a few days than in a few months fighting port conflicts. Or so it feels like, anyway.

And I’m totally fine with that, because it gives me a challenge more adequate to my level than slaughtering hapless Cyclops that I care so little about I don’t even drop heatsinks to shoot them up, in the dozens. Most of the time, anyway. Not something I’d do while I’m getting shot by one of the tougher ones…

… but the origin of that behavior is not burning excessively through material reserves even though heatsink synths are about the cheapest and easiest synth to commit/replace.

Also, in the event of a Glaive spawn, do you enjoy just sitting there twiddling your thumbs if you decided to not run a hybrid or full AXMC build, while you wait for your AFMU to get all four from 0 back to 80 or 100? Or would you prefer having the option to not be a sitting duck by doing the same at a port/the equivalent of a dockable megaship and not have a bunch of time wasted by something completely unavoidable (that is also RNG based)?

Also, yes, I am aware the high end CZs are more likely to be a group activity, or intended as one, and so while I’m fighting solo I’ve been sticking to low intensity. Still seen my fair share of Basilisks and Medusas in the last few days. And also brought all of them down so far.

So, again, not an issue of skill but simple convenience to the player. Certainly in my case. Frankly, I see little difference in the “self-sufficient ship” repair game or doing it at a resupply zone(whatever form that would take), except for the time required with your hands mostly idle or boosting away from a pursuing Thargoid, because repair limpets are destroyed even if you’re hit on the complete opposite side of the hull by something as weak as a single Thargon projectile.

(But they’re totally fine if your ship gets zapped by Interceptor lightning.)

And the flak launcher… it’s a joke. Period. Either it needs a buff or some other player-guided means (not automated) of killing the Thargons. Because, frankly, with 32 shots… you might kill 2 or 3, maybe 4, Cyclops swarms. Or 2 for a Basilisk? Been a while since I’ve used it, and for the simple reason that it’s almost completely useless. There’s a very large abundance of Thargon swarms in CZs that will also be thrown out upon destruction of each heart of an Interceptor, and you can guess what it leads back to. Lots and lots of ammo synths for the flak launcher which are not easily replaceable. And it takes a few well-placed shots of it to even start denting the swarms noticeably. Providing it as a C3 hardpoint with more ammo would be a start.

Then, there’s the matter of swarms being extremely erratic and just switching targets on the fly at complete random, sometimes even in the middle of a kamikaze missile strike. Good luck trying to consistently making the flak work with that, as opposed to the “old style” AX where it would be 100% predictable and only follows you.

… also that its aim indicator is completely broken with trailing sights so you just have to hard guess where you might need to lead(doesn’t really work well in my opinion). And trailing is quite often used with modshards and plasmas. I use shards.

Might as well be an almost obsolete module. As is I see so little reasons to even think of bothering with the flak I just run a vent beam laser(which couples quite neatly with AX multicannons) and ignore the swarms beyond attempting to avoid their missiles as best as possible. Or just taking them and fixing the damage later if I really need to.

Thanks for coming to the TED talk wall of text.
 
It makes also little sense for an enemy to trade Control for Invasion! The simple solution to needing more Invasions is just adding more Invasions without affecting anything else,
Giving up an uninhabited system to launch invasions with the potential to gain control of 2 or 3 enemy inhabited systems? That makes sense to me. The goids are the invaders here.
 
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