Hunting for Bacteria in Exobiology is Extremely Unfun: Better markers for Microbes on the ground!

[sfried]

I've been doing lot of Exobiology as of late, but I can't help but notice how much of an oversight the Bacteria life form design in this game can by downright frustrating at times to look for, if not painful on the eyes in some circumstances.

I'm quite aware FDev have probably anticipated the issues with certain exobio lifeforms when under certain lighting conditions. To compensate, they rely on the player to utilize their DSS to find "hotspots" of where the particular lifeform might spawn, along with a exobio scanner that has a limited range "ping sweep". The problem arises when a planet, with barely any visible light reaching is is tained in a magenta hue, has a bacteria itself colored in magenta! To make matters worse, the bacteria pattern is barely if not visible at all in night vision mode, and it doesn't help that the way level of detail (LOD) is handled on planetary surfaces tend to miscolour textures on the ground if it's anywhere near brown or red. The appearance can vary greatly too depending on the kind of PC build you have. That definitely goes far beyond looking for a needle in a haystack!

I fully understand the reasoning for the bacteria's current design: It's meant to depict something feasable and realistic that one could find in the beyond, but the problem is that this is a game first and formost, and the tools give to players currently do not make finding Bacteria all the worthwhile, especially with the measily payout of specimens when compared to fungus and shrubbery. Looking for them in the aformentioned circumstances is also not healthy on the eyes!

My suggestion would be a) either increase the payout of Bacteria b) redesign the bacteria so that they will always contrast with their surroundings in both color and design or c) do both! I feel the current designs look like a cross between a Rorschachs test and chewing gum that has been spat out and stepped on a sneaker, and having it simply be a simple texture on the ground feels...dull! Give us actually modeled "bacteria rocks" or something that can stand out more and make the player actually feel excited to see something peculiar rather than digusted!

 

[sfried]

I also think this is an area where game design should take precedence over "realism". (While it might be feasable to find same-coloured bacteria on a planet's surface, it's definitely not healthy for the player to be squinting on their monitor just to find it.)

 

[aRJay]

I've been doing lot of Exobiology as of late, but I can't help but notice how much of an oversight the Bacteria life form design in this game can by downright frustrating at times to look for, if not painful on the eyes in some circumstances.

I'm quite aware FDev have probably anticipated the issues with certain exobio lifeforms when under certain lighting conditions. To compensate, they rely on the player to utilize their DSS to find "hotspots" of where the particular lifeform might spawn, along with a exobio scanner that has a limited range "ping sweep". The problem arises when a planet, with barely any visible light reaching is is tained in a magenta hue, has a bacteria itself colored in magenta! To make matters worse, the bacteria pattern is barely if not visible at all in night vision mode, and it doesn't help that the way level of detail (LOD) is handled on planetary surfaces tend to miscolour textures on the ground if it's anywhere near brown or red. The appearance can vary greatly too depending on the kind of PC build you have. That definitely goes far beyond looking for a needle in a haystack!

I fully understand the reasoning for the bacteria's current design: It's meant to depict something feasable and realistic that one could find in the beyond, but the problem is that this is a game first and formost, and the tools give to players currently do not make finding Bacteria all the worthwhile, especially with the measily payout of specimens when compared to fungus and shrubbery. Looking for them in the aformentioned circumstances is also not healthy on the eyes!

My suggestion would be a) either increase the payout of Bacteria

All of them, just the hard to find ones, just the cheap ones?

b) redesign the bacteria so that they will always contrast with their surroundings in both color and design or

While this would help it would also lesson the immersion and make it feel more game like, why would bacteria colonies evolve to be really obvious in their environment?

c) do both! I feel the current designs look like a cross between a Rorschachs test and chewing gum that has been spat out and stepped on a sneaker, and having it simply be a simple texture on the ground feels...dull! Give us actually modeled "bacteria rocks" or something that can stand out more and make the player actually feel excited to see something peculiar rather than digusted!

As @Koma Pahu I use the Composition scanner from my ship to locate them when there is insufficient contrast to spot them easily. I just fly along and from time to time point the nose at the ground and listen for the beep.

I also try to be searching around local noon and when I find my first try to study how it looks so I can spot the next two more easily.

But the important thing is that it is only a bacterium colony and if I haven’t found it before I tire of the search there will be other opportunities to complete my Codex in that or nearby systems, now if it was really valuable I might be tempted to grind it.

 

[metatheurgist]

I also think this is an area where game design should take precedence over "realism". (While it might be feasable to find same-coloured bacteria on a planet's surface, it's definitely not healthy for the player to be squinting on their monitor just to find it.)

It's not even realistic. Bacteria (all life) emit signature chemicals that you can trace, which must be pretty easy on low pressure worlds with no weather. If you had a sniffer you could pretty much home in on it...like some kind of wave scanner....

 

[sfried]

Use the composition scanner in my ship to help locate them.

Although it’s possible to scan stratum in 3 different systems in the time it can take to locate my first bacteria! It does allow for lots of first find bonuses though, as most people just leave them.

Composition scanner on the ship really doesn't help. It just shows you the likely locations they will spawn...but within those locations, good luck trying to guess what they look like!

While this would help it would also lesson the immersion and make it feel more game like, why would bacteria colonies evolve to be really obvious in their environment?

I would take that consession over blinding myself from squinting too hard at my monitor! Seriously, the game already takes certain liberties with realism that a little redesign of the microbial colonies would actually be infinitely better than trying to scan the ground for textures that vaguely look like an M.R.I. scan. The current design simply isn’t distinguishable enough especially for new players getting into exobiology.

Also, it just doesn't make sense for something to be totally camoflaged like that when there aren't any other lifeforms nearby that could act as predators! That's just excusing poor game design choices.

It's not even realistic. Bacteria (all life) emit signature chemicals that you can trace, which must be pretty easy on low pressure worlds with no weather. If you had a sniffer you could pretty much home in on it...like some kind of wave scanner....

Exactly! Why the heck is it this hard to look for exobiology given the in-game technology and tools?

 

[sfried]

No it doesn’t that’s the surface scanner. The composition scanner becomes highlighted when it’s put on something geological or biological. There’s definitely YouTube videos explaining how to use it if you need it.

Similar to what @aRJay says. I fly with my nose around 45 degrees, using forward and up thrusters to keep around 100m from the ground, fly in a straight line until the Comp Scanner flashes, then stop and investigate what triggered it.

Oh, you mean the SRV? Or on the ship?

 

[sfried]

On the ship, it works on the SRV too, but is less reliable as it works best when the scanner is pointing at the surface.

Thanks! I'll try it out.

I still stand by what I said in saying that the Bacteria in the game simply don't look interesting enough or as pronounced as it should. I would expect there to be some fancy effects placed on such colonies instead of just a flat texture. I wouldn't mind some normal mapping or some sort of a wet or subsurface sheen to give the impression it's producing a sort of mucus.

It's not even realistic. Bacteria (all life) emit signature chemicals that you can trace, which must be pretty easy on low pressure worlds with no weather. If you had a sniffer you could pretty much home in on it...like some kind of wave scanner....

I have jumped around aimlessly half an hour with my scanner out pinging for such life forms because of how unremarkable and undistinct their design is compared to the rest of the scenery...in broad daylight. But yes, I've also done so at night. Still pretty unfun and less exciting than spotting a mushroom a couple of meters away.

 

[HRDiagram]

I have jumped around aimlessly half an hour with my scanner out pinging for such life forms because of how unremarkable and undistinct their design is compared to the rest of the scenery...in broad daylight. But yes, I've also done so at night. Still pretty unfun and less exciting than spotting a mushroom a couple of meters away.

The best is when you look for them on frozen, dark planets (far from their star), where the lights of the ship don't help (they actually make things worse) and the composition scanner is just a gamble.
The best way was to bunny hop in my Artemis suit, sending the pulse regularly, waiting to hear typical noise made when a bio signal is located within its range.

 

[Nowski]

As @Koma Pahu I use the Composition scanner from my ship to locate them when there is insufficient contrast to spot them easily. I just fly along and from time to time point the nose at the ground and listen for the beep.

I also try to be searching around local noon and when I find my first try to study how it looks so I can spot the next two more easily.

But the important thing is that it is only a bacterium colony and if I haven’t found it before I tire of the search there will be other opportunities to complete my Codex in that or nearby systems, now if it was really valuable I might be tempted to grind it.

As well as this great advice, setting directional shadows to "low" in graphics quality can help bacteria stand out - they go very black and then back to normal - but this can depend on lighting conditions.

Flying with the nose dipped (throttle 0 and using up and forwards thrusters) I often hit ctrl-alt-g to remove visual clutter and let me concentrate on spotting difficult bios, but that may just be aging neurons seeking an easy time.

I can relate to the completionist urge, but I mostly do bacteria if they're on a body with other bios. Icy bodies with one or two bios I generally ignore (except nitrogen atmosphere) and it's only very rarely I get frustrated by elusive bacteria these days.

I would probably like to see exo prices more based on rarity, along with more bios, fancier bio models, ... but realistically, Frontier have bigger fish and a small frying pan.

 

[sfried]

On the ship, it works on the SRV too, but is less reliable as it works best when the scanner is pointing at the surface.

I just tried it right now. It helps alot!

The best is when you look for them on frozen, dark planets (far from their star), where the lights of the ship don't help (they actually make things worse) and the composition scanner is just a gamble.
The best way was to bunny hop in my Artemis suit, sending the pulse regularly, waiting to hear typical noise made when a bio signal is located within its range.

Like I said, that's what I did for half an hour. It was terrible.

I can relate to the completionist urge, but I mostly do bacteria if they're on a body with other bios. Icy bodies with one or two bios I generally ignore (except nitrogen atmosphere) and it's only very rarely I get frustrated by elusive bacteria these days.

I would probably like to see exo prices more based on rarity, along with more bios, fancier bio models, ... but realistically, Frontier have bigger fish and a small frying pan.

Hopefully FDev will redesign how the Bacteria patches look in the game. Would be nice if they emitted some sort of aerosol/gas as well. There are so many ways they can improve the look of microbes within the game without ruining the immerssion, and not making them simply be a flat texture would be the first of many (like, at least make them have normal maps or a sort of gloss to them).

 

[Nowski]

I just tried it right now. It helps alot!

Hopefully FDev will redesign how the Bacteria patches look in the game. Would be nice if they emitted some sort of aerosol/gas as well. There is so many way they can improve the look of microbes within the game without ruining the immerssion, and not making them simply be a flat texture would be the first of many.

Yeah, there's like 10,000 things that could be improved in this game, given an infinite pool of programmers, artists, designers, project managers, testers, ... But it's not going to happen when there's big features like Colonisation, major fixing like in PP2, a fat stack of issues and a very finite development team. Frontier aren't Bethesda with 400 devs on a game, it's probably in single or low double figures, they have to prioritise ruthlessly to get anywhere at all would be my bet.

All I'm saying is don't hold your breath.

 

[sfried]

Yeah, there's like 10,000 things that could be improved in this game, given an infinite pool of programmers, artists, designers, project managers, testers, ... But it's not going to happen when there's big features like Colonisation, major fixing like in PP2, a fat stack of issues and a very finite development team. Frontier aren't Bethesda with 400 devs on a game, it's probably in single or low double figures, they have to prioritise ruthlessly to get anywhere at all would be my bet.

All I'm saying is don't hold your breath.

Well, Bethesda aren't any better, so I'll take FDev over them anyday. I just do think microbe redesign should be worth investigating given the kind of Quality of Life improvements they've already given to various other aspects of the game.

 

[HRDiagram]

Like I said, that's what I did for half an hour. It was terrible.

And that's why I've given up completionism

I nowadays only scan bacteria if
-they are clearly visible
-I am the first to scan them
-they are worth more than 2M (pre bonus)

 

[Lhorndra]

As a fellow exobiologist and a completionist (yeah, I had to give up this character trait for ED), I feel you. I usually listen to the beeps of the composition scanner when there's nothing to see. It can also help if you just give up your search after a few minutes, hit orbit again and look for a different spot.

And remember, kids are spoiled these days, we had it so much worse back in the day: without any surface signals, blue overlays, or neat targetable POIs, we had to rely on our eyes alone to find them wrecks and abandoned settlements and ruins and whatnot.

(I was being sarcastic. I quite like quality of life improvements in games.)

 

[sfried]

As a fellow exobiologist and a completionist (yeah, I had to give up this character trait for ED), I feel you. I usually listen to the beeps of the composition scanner when there's nothing to see. It can also help if you just give up your search after a few minutes, hit orbit again and look for a different spot.

And remember, kids are spoiled these days, we had it so much worse back in the day: without any surface signals, blue overlays, or neat targetable POIs, we had to rely on our eyes alone to find them wrecks and abandoned settlements and ruins and whatnot.

(I was being sarcastic. I quite like quality of life improvements in games.)

Yeah, I know some of the earlier versions of Elite Dangerous were…rough on newbies. I’m a Kickstarter backer, so I know. I do think some of the usual barriers to entry for exobio could be improved. I heard they actually bumped up the pay rates as part of the feedback…

 

[aRJay]

Oh, you mean the SRV? Or on the ship?

I meant on the ship, I have in the past used the beeps in the SRV to find stuff, but I stopped using the SRV for Exo ages ago and just use a small ship so I have a chance of landing near certain Fungoida.

And that's why I've given up completionism

I nowadays only scan bacteria if
-they are clearly visible
-I am the first to scan them
-they are worth more than 2M (pre bonus)

As I am not particularly interested in my exobiology rank* now I bother with them mainly if they are a variety I haven’t got in my codex I have at times gone for them because they were really obvious and plentiful or because they were the first thing found when I was only doing one bio per planet or was trying not to be mean and only sampling the most valuable bio.

*I don’t have a lot of interest in the ranks themselves once I reach Elite, in the case of exobiology I do it because I like it and for the credits but filling up my Codex is a big driver.

 

[aRJay]

Yeah, I know some of the earlier versions of Elite Dangerous were…rough on newbies. I’m a Kickstarter backer, so I know. I do think some of the usual barriers to entry for exobio could be improved. I heard they actually bumped up the pay rates as part of the feedback…

Yes, it was because ranking was slow as well, it took months to sort out the mess that the initial fix caused due to ranks being based on credits changing the payment made getting Elite V was almost easier than finding the rebuy for the free sidewinder.
I so wish they would make things easier for themselves and decouple payment and rank so they could balance things separately.

 

[Fixitman]

I've found a very simple solution for hard to find biologicals. This solution works for me throughout many aspects of ED as well.

I set personal time limits based on the situation. I have a very complex set of limits that I stick to ~90% of the time. It's a very good way to avoid the FOMO monster.

Recent example for me:
Note: I use ED Observatory to determine what I might find.
Limit 1: If I'm sure I won't get more than 2 Million credits, I skip the planet.
I found a planet with only Bacterium Acies, and no first footfall. That's a potential for 5 Million credits, so I approached. I found the first bacterium right away, so I scanned it.
Limit 2: SC and pick a new area after 10 minutes without another find. (10 minutes is decided by dividing the base value by 100K)
I didn't find another for 10 minutes, so I moved to a new area.
Limit 3: Only do Limit 2 twice.
I didn't find another within 30 minutes (plus two jumps to orbit), so I moved on.

Yes, this is somewhat complex. For me, it fits in nicely with the ED's inherent complexity. On the rare occasion that I do skip something, I don't regret it.

 

[varonica]

I only scan bacteria if it is a new codex find, and even then I don't always sample if it's only 1m, but there are ways to get around the colour problem, for instance planets often have different coloured surface areas. But I see it as bacteria is there as bio background noise, if a body doesn't fit requirements for any other type of bio it will often fit requirements for some kind of bacteria, just so we don't have lots of empty planets with no bio at all.

 

[Markov Chaney]

I've read in a few places that scanning with the Comp Scanner also triggers things like the Codex acknowledging your find (and by implication the Genomics scan doesn't do that.)

Is this true? In which case this thread could be a discussion on how to make the Comp Scanner better, because it is supposed to be the tool for this in the gameplay loop and the intended solution for finding little black microbes on a black background which wiggle their little cilia when you find them.

It seems the community has decided ship plus on foot is The Way but what if The Way for bacteria is still SRV turret and Comp Scanner?