Hot takes for planet zoo

Utahraptor Arcanus

Utahraptor Arcanus
The_Riot22 said:
I think Community Challenges would be a lot more fun if they ended up being something different from "Everyone turn X animal group into a puppy mill for the next 5 days".
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I think community challenges currently suffers from the fact they aren't neither fun to play nor rewarding enough to justify playing them.

It's not fun to run an chimp zoo just to complete the challenge knowing goddam well that the final rewards will be the same ammount of CC that i could get if i sold a big cat and a bunch of base game animals that will hardly be usefull.
 

The_Riot22

The_Riot22
Utahraptor Arcanus said:
I think community challenges currently suffers from the fact they aren't neither fun to play nor rewarding enough to justify playing them.

It's not fun to run an chimp zoo just to complete the challenge knowing goddam well that the final rewards will be the same ammount of CC that i could get if i sold a big cat and a bunch of base game animals that will hardly be usefull.
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Yeah. The only time I ever play them is for the free animal rewards. But I still do so only rarely because:
1) At most you receive 3 reward animals
2) Only base game animals - never DLCs
3) I seem to always get the lower tier free animals that are really cheap anyways, like Gazelles, Macaques or Flamingos...rarely Lions, Elephants, GIraffes, etc. I have gotten a surprising number of Gorillas tho.
 

Mjmannella

Mjmannella
New hot take to drop: I wish we got species that went extinct during the Holocene (12kya-Present). Stuff like dodos, thylacines, and moas would be fantastic options that could really spruce up some regions today that are missing such ecological puzzle pieces. Hell, I could list enough extinct taxa to add that puts it equal to the number of Exhibit animals that we have.
 

RightWhale

RightWhale
I got a couple more hot takes:
  1. Without the management being better, every other mode in PZ is kind of obsolete to Sandbox. Not even counting the beauty of mods, the management features are so shallow that all Franchise can give is a slight difficulty to balance finances. Which isn’t much, once you get a zoo going it’s golden. I’ll give some credit to the time and challenge modes, but you play those once and are content.
  2. For the core gameplay loop PZ can be boring, especially if you lack inspiration in a moment.
  3. Every animal is a worthy addition to the game, but some are definitely more valuable over others.
  4. Even above the shallow management, the tricky paths, and everything else the worse thing about PZ is how darn quick the time is. I once had multiple days pass and the sun didn’t even rise. I was in the Caribbean! It also makes it harder to be attached to animals, and also prevents future management features being fleshed out.
  5. Frontier should start releasing cheap stand alone mods. Want scenery? Get a scenery/ prop pack for cheap. Want ducks? Get the duck pack.
  6. Bring back exhibits, I miss them. Even if they are clunky!
  7. SA and NA having no “true” bird is worse than any other roster omission as of right now. Even worse than no ABB or another new world monkey.
  8. Frontier, whoever you have doing reptiles, keep doing them. Every time a reptile has been made they are often one of the best parts of the packs.
  9. I like the Nile lechwe and the dama gazelle. There, I said it.
  10. While I would love to have more birds, I really can’t get rid of any animal in the roster. Someone somewhere would like that, I can learn to live without good bird representation. I wouldn’t want to deprive someone of their favorite animal.
  11. I don’t like the “go and mod it” argument, because it can’t extend to the console base. If someone wants birds and plays console they are screwed. Also, Frontier just shouldn’t ignore part of the player base for months. It doesn’t take much to have at least one reptile and bird per pack. That’s only 2/7 of the roster. You still have plenty of space for popular mammals.
  12. I’ll say it again, we should have had at least one fish species at this point.
  13. I for one would love an exhibit only DLC.
 

caninesrock

caninesrock
1. I'd rather a Common Walking Stick Diapheromera femorata than the Lord Howe Island Stick Insect. The LH Stick Insect doesn't look stick-like enough to me.
2. I still want more mammalian carnivores for the game. I'd get bored and lose interest in all future DLC if they didn't include at least one member of Carnivora or a marsupial carnivore of some sort.
3. As a canid fan, I'm not only jealous of cat fans in Planet Zoo but in real-life zoos too. Everybody loves big cats, but wild dogs are either hated by people (like wolves by ranchers) or people are absolutely indifferent to them. Almost every zoo has at least a lion but few zoos have wolves or other canids. The most common here in the South of the US are African Wild Dogs and Red Foxes or Gray Foxes, occasionally Maned Wolves and Red Wolves, and very rarely Grey wolves. That said, I still make use of and enjoy the cats in the game, and I understand that the bird and primate people are feeling way more pain with almost no representation.
4. If we do get another canid in the game, I don't want it to be another fox. I want a Red Wolf, Coyote, Golden Jackal or Black-backed Jackal. I'd also settle for a Tanuki or Bush Dog.
5. I use mods but am also tired of people saying that modded animals can take the place of official animals because until the game ends support, mods are always breaking, going out of date, and needing updating. Also apparently they don't work on my D drive that I bought to save space on my computer which sucks.
 

Marvinb

Marvinb
caninesrock said:
3. As a canid fan, I'm not only jealous of cat fans in Planet Zoo but in real-life zoos too. Everybody loves big cats, but wild dogs are either hated by people (like wolves by ranchers) or people are absolutely indifferent to them. Almost every zoo has at least a lion but few zoos have wolves or other canids. The most common here in the South of the US are African Wild Dogs and Red Foxes or Gray Foxes, occasionally Maned Wolves and Red Wolves, and very rarely Grey wolves. That said, I still make use of and enjoy the cats in the game, and I understand that the bird and primate people are feeling way more pain with almost no representation.
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Is that a thing in the us? In europe big cats are also more common, but wolves are by no means rare. I think they are more common in smaller zoos but there are also plenty of major ones that keep them
Although i think i would agree that the average zoo definetly has more cats than dogs, atleast in my experience. As to why? No clue tbh. I mean i can easily see why its the case for big cats and large canines, something like a tiger or lion just has the bigger wow factor than a wolf or wild dog (imo). But as to why small cats also seem to be more common than small canines idk.
 

Birb（｡･ө･｡）

Birb（｡･ө･｡）
RightWhale said:
I don’t like the “go and mod it” argument, because it can’t extend to the console base. If someone wants birds and plays console they are screwed. Also, Frontier just shouldn’t ignore part of the player base for months. It doesn’t take much to have at least one reptile and bird per pack. That’s only 2/7 of the roster. You still have plenty of space for popular mammals.
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Just wanna shout out this as someone who's had to rely on GeForce Now for the past year. When I've had time to work on my main zoos most of my old habitats have been totally empty because I've lost access to mods. Sure, some of the animals have decent enough substitutes (kunekune -> Tamworth pig/perentie -> one of the other monitors/Nile croc -> saltie for example), but others not so much (almost every bird, I can only use a mute swan in place of ducks and geese or chickens/peafowl in place of pheasants, crowned pigeons, and guineafowl so many times without realizing how ridiculous they look - and sound - lmao)

I think this decently ties into which animals are most needed for the game too, which is why I also heavily agree with this:
RightWhale said:
Every animal is a worthy addition to the game, but some are definitely more valuable over others.
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I'm sorry that I sound like a broken record at this point, but I think a good roster needs to have priorities instead of just adding every animal without much thought on which are the most valuable. In a vacuum, there is literally no animal I would dislike in the game, but there are some I'd find vastly more useful than others and we can't get them all.
 
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SuzieSky

SuzieSky
Marvinb said:
Is that a thing in the us? In europe big cats are also more common, but wolves are by no means rare. I think they are more common in smaller zoos but there are also plenty of major ones that keep them
Although i think i would agree that the average zoo definetly has more cats than dogs, atleast in my experience. As to why? No clue tbh. I mean i can easily see why its the case for big cats and large canines, something like a tiger or lion just has the bigger wow factor than a wolf or wild dog (imo). But as to why small cats also seem to be more common than small canines idk.
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I would say one large canid is common, but more than one per zoo is unusual. Smithsonian rotates between red wolves and maned wolves (and grey?) in the same habitat, but they're only ever showing one at a time. I don't think I've been to a zoo with more than two foxes. 130+ red, 78 fennec, 60+ grey, 59 arctic, 30 bat-eared fox, 140+ grey/arctic/Mexican wolf, 92 coyote, 44 wild dog, 43 red, 30 maned, 20 dingo, 10 black-backed jackal, 5 bush dog, 3 dhole, 3 raccoon dog, and a meager few other foxes on Zooteirliste.
Many of the bigger ones just look like grey wolves. As for the little guys, most of them are foxes/fox-like with little media presence and are harder to obtain than the red. I think that's why they are uncommon in zoos.

Favorite canid options: (don't need but would be happy to see the first 6 in DLCs if support justifies them)
  1. Black-backed jackal: It is unique and probably the only one I'd call mid-sized.
  2. Grey fox: It is taxonomically the most unique option, a cool local species, climbs trees, and would be the one I'd use most.
  3. Raccoon dog: It is adorable, doesn't compete with much for its region, is popular among canid options, and seems like it would sell best to me.
  4. Bush dog: It is the most unique in appearance and habitat among the popular options.
  5. Bat-eared fox: It's not a bad variety pick for foxes and is relatively common. It's also cute.
  6. Coyote: I'd rather get the grey fox, but it's common enough in local zoos, present in media, decently popular, and could live in all? biomes. I would buy it.
  7. Eurasian wolf/Golden jackal: The European players seem to kind of want a big canid. It does little for me personally, but one would be ok if support justifies it.
  8. South American Foxes: I kind of like the culpeo, crab eating fox, and Darwin's fox, in that order. I don't really want a DLC slot to go to them, especially not a precious South America slot, but mods would be nice. Maybe one or two could turn up in a sequel with an expanded roster?
  9. Tibetan Fox: funny face
  10. Ethiopean wolf: It's pretty and a nostagic pick perhaps worth installing a mod for.
  11. Red wolf: Neat conservation species and good for education. I can't tell it apart from the grey too well and sometimes forget it's its own species, but it's not bad.

To compare, there are roughly 216 tiger, 202 lion, 185 cougar, 109 jaguar, 90 cheetah, 89 leopard, 82 snow leopard, 43 clouded leopard, 170 bobcat, 116 serval, 62 Canada lynx, 60 caracal, 55 ocelot, 43 Eurasian lynx, 28 sand, 21 Pallas's, 18 fishing, 16 black footed, 13 jaguarundi, 11 Geoffroy's, and a handful of other holdings in NA.
Favorite cat options: (need the first two, maybe the third, and hope support or a big sequel might justify more someday)
  1. Serval: It's a favorite zoo animal of mine, super common in zoos around the world, and has a strong media presence. I badly want/sort of need it.
  2. Ocelot (or margay?): It's probably more important and also has a strong media presence. I kind of need this one, too. I think the margay is a more interesting alternative, but I know people would be upset with it because it is extremely rare in zoos. I'd be about as happy with the ocelot.
  3. Fishing cat: This would bring a tiny cat for the tropical and aquatic biome. I think they're cool and would stand in for other small tropical cats.
  4. Bobcat: Super common in zoos near me.
  5. Asian Golden Cat: Cool color morphs.
  6. European Wild Cat: Decent option for additional European Critter:
  7. Other South American Cat(s): Maybe would install a mod for one or two?
  8. Big Cat Subspecies: If support goes on for years and the model is way better, sure
  9. Iberian Lynx: I like their face and miss them a bit from ZT2.
 
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Mr-Hyrax 2

Mr-Hyrax 2
SuzieSky said:
I don't think I've been to a zoo with more than two foxes
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Well I have, there is a mix between red and grey foxes, as well as a fennec fox in a different area, at Birmingham Zoo, which alongside having a secretary bird and bongo makes me appreciate that zoo (mainly because it's the only zoo I have been to).

Also this isn't ment to be a argument, I just wanted to mention it.
 
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Fallax

Fallax
I own cats and dogs irl and love them but to be honest I don't really care about getting more in game that much compared to other groups that need it way more, the rosters are really good and I'd be just fine if we didn't get any more to be honest.

Also the rivalry and the jealousy over each group is really stupid no other animal groups get compared why should we do it with cats and dogs?
 

Marvinb

Marvinb
SuzieSky said:
I would say one large canid is common, but more than one per zoo is unusual. Smithsonian rotates between red wolves and maned wolves (and grey?) in the same habitat, but they're only ever showing one at a time. I don't think I've been to a zoo with more than two foxes. 130+ red, 78 fennec, 60+ grey, 59 arctic, 30 bat-eared fox, 140+ grey/arctic/Mexican wolf, 92 coyote, 44 wild dog, 43 red, 30 maned, 10 black-backed jackal, 5 bush dog, 3 dhole, 3 raccoon dog, and a meager few other foxes on Zooteirliste.
Many of the bigger ones just look like grey wolves. As for the little guys, most of them are foxes/fox-like with little media presence and are harder to obtain than the red. I think that's why they are uncommon in zoos.

Favorite canid options: (don't need but would be happy to see the first 6 in DLCs if support justifies them)
  1. Black-backed jackal: It is unique and probably the only one I'd call mid-sized.
  2. Grey fox: It is taxonomically the most unique option, a cool local species, climbs trees, and would be the one I'd use most.
  3. Raccoon dog: It is adorable, doesn't compete with much for its region, is popular among canid options, and seems like it would sell best to me.
  4. Bush dog: It is the most unique in appearance and habitat among the popular options.
  5. Bat-eared fox: It's not a bad variety pick for foxes and is relatively common. It's also cute.
  6. Coyote: I'd rather get the grey fox, but it's common enough in local zoos, present in media, decently popular, and could live in all? biomes. I would buy it.
  7. Eurasian wolf/Golden jackal: The European players seem to kind of want a big canid. It does little for me personally, but one would be ok if support justifies it.
  8. South American Foxes: I kind of like the culpeo, crab eating fox, and Darwin's fox, in that order. I don't really want a DLC slot to go to them, especially not a precious South America slot, but mods would be nice. Maybe one or two could turn up in a sequel with an expanded roster?
  9. Tibetan Fox: funny face
  10. Ethiopean wolf: It's pretty and a nostagic pick perhaps worth installing a mod for.
  11. Red wolf: Neat conservation species and good for education. I can't tell it apart from the grey too well and sometimes forget it's its own species, but it's not bad.

To compare, there are roughly 216 tiger, 202 lion, 185 cougar, 109 jaguar, 90 cheetah, 89 leopard, 82 snow leopard, 43 clouded leopard, 170 bobcat, 116 serval, 62 Canada lynx, 60 caracal, 55 ocelot, 43 Eurasian lynx, 28 sand, 21 Pallas's, 18 fishing, 16 black footed, 13 jaguarundi, 11 Geoffroy's, and a handful of other holdings in NA.
Favorite cat options: (need the first two, maybe the third, and hope support or a big sequel might justify more someday)
  1. Serval: It's a favorite zoo animal of mine, super common in zoos around the world, and has a strong media presence. I badly want/sort of need it.
  2. Ocelot (or margay?): It's probably more important and also has a strong media presence. I kind of need this one, too. I think the margay is a more interesting alternative, but I know people would be upset with it because it is extremely rare in zoos. I'd be about as happy with the ocelot.
  3. Fishing cat: This would bring a tiny cat for the tropical and aquatic biome. I think they're cool and would stand in for other small tropical cats.
  4. Bobcat: Super common in zoos near me.
  5. Asian Golden Cat: Cool color morphs.
  6. European Wild Cat: Decent option for additional European Critter:
  7. Other South American Cat(s): Maybe would install a mod for one or two?
  8. Big Cat Subspecies: If support goes on for years and the model is way better, sure
  9. Iberian Lynx: I like their face and miss them a bit from ZT2.
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Why are there so many eurasian lynx in na? Seem very strange considering european animals are otherwise pretty much absent in na zoos
 

SanRazo

SanRazo
I find this whole dogs vs cats thing so dumb.

We still need smaller cats, like it or not cats have more representation in zoos and we’ve mainly had big cats in PZ. A ocelot or serval would be awesome. I’d even take a Jaguarundi or Fishing Cat.

Dogs are over represented for the average zoo collection. Not saying I don’t want them. I think Tanuki, Bush Dog are the strongest candidates. Then a black Striped jackal or red wolf would be awesome for my Floridian heart. But it is by no means a priority. We’ve been blessed with canids in PZ which is awesome, but other groups should take the limelight.
 

RightWhale

RightWhale
My new hot take: I genuinely don’t care if we get another bear, dog, cat, antelope/bovid, etc. in the next pack, as long as the pack is actually balanced out. Birds and reptiles aren’t gonna get better in one dlc, and we also aren’t gonna get a bird centric dlc anyways. With that being said, packs should be made with balance in mind. The main issue I have been having is we will get packs that are 50% or more Carnivora or ungulata and then have any other animal make up the remainder. Which is what has made me so bitter, not only are we getting a lot of the same animals, they are making up a lot of the same packs too.

I think it is good to have DLCs give a little bit for everyone. This would be how I make DLCs with balance in mind:
  1. Dog/Cat/Bear (Carnivora)
  2. Rodent/Primate
  3. Ungulate
  4. Ungulate/Rodent/Primate/Carnivora (bonus mammal slot)
  5. Habitat reptile
  6. Bird #1
  7. Bird #2
Basically bring back packs like Wetlands, just give 3/7 slots for not-mammals.
 

KönigDerKaffeebohnen

K
oh i got a crazy one

Everytime someone tries to argue if an animal is either "a good pick" or "common/rare" in zoos and continues with "in the zoos ive been to" without at any point having checked on zootierliste if what they say has any value at all just annoys the hell out of me.
Its a free site thats easy to use its really not that hard to go "i dont think domestic bunnys are common in zoos, lets check" and to realise that welp domestic bunnys without a specific breed mentioned, aka not even close to the real number of zoos that keep domestic bunnys, are listed for 1027 Zoos and the 6. most common animal in zoos.
I took less then a minute to get that information, guys i love discussing and sharing my opinions as much as the next guy but please fact check yourself before saying something that just is confidently wrong

Bonus points if its about why something would be a "bad pick" cause thats just sad
 
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RightWhale

RightWhale
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
oh i got a crazy one

Everytime someone tries to argue if an animal is either "a good pick" or "common/rare" in zoos and continues with "in the zoos ive been to" without at any point having checked on zootierliste if what they say has any value at all just annoys the hell out of me.
Its a free site thats easy to use its really not that hard to go "i dont think domestic bunnys are common in zoos, lets check" and to realise that welp domestic bunnys without a specific breed mentioned, aka not even close to the real number of zoos that keep domestic bunnys, are listed for 1027 Zoos and the 6. most common animal in zoos.
I took less then a minute to get that information, guys i love discussing and sharing my opinions as much as the next guy but please fact check yourself before saying something that just is confidently wrong
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Yeah I’m sure I have been guilty of that too. One example being puffins. Going off anecdotal evidence you would think puffins are common in captivity, after all I have seen them at the:
  1. Bronx Zoo
  2. Central Park Zoo
  3. North Carolina Zoo
  4. Georgia Aquarium
  5. National Aquarium in Baltimore
So going off that it would make sense to think puffins aren’t rarely kept. Turns out the aren’t very common, I just happened to have been to almost every place that keeps puffins in the Eastern coast of the United States.
 

synthetase

synthetase
RightWhale said:
Yeah I’m sure I have been guilty of that too. One example being puffins. Going off anecdotal evidence you would think puffins are common in captivity, after all I have seen them at the:
  1. Bronx Zoo
  2. Central Park Zoo
  3. North Carolina Zoo
  4. Georgia Aquarium
  5. National Aquarium in Baltimore
So going off that it would make sense to think puffins aren’t rarely kept. Turns out the aren’t very common, I just happened to have been to almost every place that keeps puffins in the Eastern coast of the United States.
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Puffins are still a good pick, imo! They add bird to the arctic.
 

SuzieSky

SuzieSky
KönigDerKaffeebohnen said:
oh i got a crazy one

Everytime someone tries to argue if an animal is either "a good pick" or "common/rare" in zoos and continues with "in the zoos ive been to" without at any point having checked on zootierliste if what they say has any value at all just annoys the hell out of me.
Its a free site thats easy to use its really not that hard to go "i dont think domestic bunnys are common in zoos, lets check" and to realise that welp domestic bunnys without a specific breed mentioned, aka not even close to the real number of zoos that keep domestic bunnys, are listed for 1027 Zoos and the 6. most common animal in zoos.
I took less then a minute to get that information, guys i love discussing and sharing my opinions as much as the next guy but please fact check yourself before saying something that just is confidently wrong

Bonus points if its about why something would be a "bad pick" cause thats just sad
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Sometimes perception =/= reality. As someone who lives near rabbits and raccoons, I find them so mundane that my attention more easily passes over them than something like a coati, which I don't see too often. Also, when I've seen rabbits in zoos, they are sometimes sequestered in tiny hutches and/or aren't included on the map. They are very easy to miss. Raccoons often have small enclosures, too. In wildlife centers with fewer distractions or in the wild when one surprises me, I'm way more likely to notice a raccoon. Therefore, I strongly associate them with wildlife centers and pest animals even if they have a decent presence in bigger zoos. From what I understand, many other people feel similarly. That isn't to say they're a 'bad' pick, but they might not appeal so much to people who live near them.
 
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