Please buff LTD demand and price a tad. (33% price, 3x demand)

[DemiserofD]

LTDs have been pretty useless since their boom was nerfed back in the Borann days. At present they sell for about the same as Platinum but have far lower demand AND mine a bit slower.

I don't want a huge buff on them, but it'd be nice if they sold for maybe 400k instead of 300k in (typical) ideal conditions(IE, absent Public Holiday), and if they had higher demand. I managed to mine a few hundred today expecting 300k each, but unfortunately thanks to the low demand that got lowered to 200k each, compared to platinum which typically has on the order of 10x the demand.

Maybe a 3x buff to demand, too, then? That would put them in a place where they're still not quite as good as plat, but they'd be a bit more viable than before.

So, 33% price buff, and 3x demand buff.

Thanks.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Why? Just because of the pretty name? Plenty of core minerals out there that sell very well depending on where the BGS is. Just between Monazite, Musgravite and Grandiderite alone you can reliably make 600k+ per tonne, often 800k if you make a bit of an effort and look for the right BGS states. Other minerals regularly sell for 400k+ too.

Core mining is more than just LTDs and Void Opals. And it's in a fine state without singling out and buffing individual ones.

 

[DemiserofD]

Why? Just because of the pretty name? Plenty of core minerals out there that sell very well depending on where the BGS is. Just between Monazite, Musgravite and Grandiderite alone you can reliably make 600k+ per tonne, often 800k if you make a bit of an effort and look for the right BGS states. Other minerals regularly sell for 400k+ too.

Core mining is more than just LTDs and Void Opals. And it's in a fine state without singling out and buffing individual ones.

The problem is it's balanced a little bit too low right now. Other core minerals can get up to 700k or 800k, but LTDs even with the absolute perfect combination of states, can only get to 400k. And, to be fair, you can get it in more ways, including laser Mining and subsurface mining, but unfortunately even then it tends to fall behind, because it typically has about half the price but less than double the demand.

My thinking is that if it had a lot more demand, then it could be a viable option in systems that have seen a lot of mining recently, so the more typical core mineral prices are depleted. You know, Maybe monazite has zero demand so it has dropped to 400k, so LTDs also at 400k, but being able to mine them a little bit faster because they can be laser mined could become a viable option at that point.

But right now, you only really get 400k with public holiday, which makes all the other options far more appealing, and there is never really a time when mining LTDs is worthwhile.

My goal would be, by increasing the price slightly and the demand fairly significantly, they could go from useless to Niche.

 

[aRJay]

But apart from LTDs being an easier name and at one time being a gold rush material why bother to buff them again, nostalgia for 'the good old days' is a poor reason..

I am not a fan of credit inflation so maybe the same balance could be achieved by decreasing the others slightly.

 

[DemiserofD]

But apart from LTDs being an easier name and at one time being a gold rush material why bother to buff them again, nostalgia for 'the good old days' is a poor reason..

I am not a fan of credit inflation so maybe the same balance could be achieved by decreasing the others slightly.

That'd be fine too, but in general mining is fairly well balanced at present, I think. It's by no means the most profitable thing to do anymore. That honor falls on Exobiology.

It's not really about nostalgia though, it's more a growing realization that as things currently stand, mining just kinda dies when Monazite demand gets depleted, since nobody really knows how to cause public holidays.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

I disagree. Core mining seems balanced at least okayish, if not better. It's more than Monazite, and you don't need holidays to make a profit. Finding a mining system in boom isn't exactly rocket science, and at any given time I can find a system within a few jumps where I can mine and sell at least four different minerals for more than 500k a ton. I can go right now and sell LTDs for 560k at a demand of over 5000 just a few jumps from my position.

If anything you might moan about basically needing Inara to find them, but that's a different discussion. Pretty much all core minerals sell VERY well at the moment - all the time in fact, at least each time I tried to, at least in the area my CMDR is in right now.

Don't change what isn't broken.

 

[DemiserofD]

I disagree. Core mining seems balanced at least okayish, if not better. It's more than Monazite, and you don't need holidays to make a profit. Finding a mining system in boom isn't exactly rocket science, and at any given time I can find a system within a few jumps where I can mine and sell at least four different minerals for more than 500k a ton. I can go right now and sell LTDs for 560k at a demand of over 5000 just a few jumps from my position.

If anything you might moan about basically needing Inara to find them, but that's a different discussion. Pretty much all core minerals sell VERY well at the moment - all the time in fact, at least each time I tried to, at least in the area my CMDR is in right now.

Don't change what isn't broken.

I've been doing it for a good while now, and the way it currently works is, monazite goes to ~800k with just boom and expansion, which makes it the best and most consistent method of getting good core mineral prices. Other minerals can get decent prices with the combination of Boom and Civil Liberty - but Civil Liberty is much harder to achieve by accident, and even at their best, they cap out around 500k, which unfortunately just isn't enough to be worth mining when monazite is available elsewhere, unless it's absolutely necessary. So in practice, it's 100% monazite or platinum, nothing else.

The exception to his is when Public Holidays or Pirate Attacks take place, but unfortunately those seem to have very vague and ill-defined parameters to trigger, so can't be relied upon. Even then, however, LTDs still aren't worth mining, because they go to ~400k, compared to other minerals like Rhodplumsite, which goes to upwards of 900k.

The one consistent factor here is that LTDs are never worth mining, with or without public holiday. In either case, it's better to mine and sell monazite even at zero demand, than to mine and sell LTDs with full demand. That's the problem I'd like to fix.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

So it's minmax or bust? That's a bad strategy. Almost all the core minerals are worth mining and giving a decent profit unless you demand 800k for them.

 

[DemiserofD]

So it's minmax or bust? That's a bad strategy. Almost all the core minerals are worth mining and giving a decent profit unless you demand 800k for them.

It's not really minmaxing, it's just being efficient with my time. If I were minmaxing profit I'd be out doing exobiology.

Ideally, there would be a variety of different circumstances that would make mining anything ideal in the right circumstances. That is, by and large, already the case for a lot of things. Rhodplumsite normally isn't worth bothering with but is the best during Public Holiday. Musgravite, Benitoite, and Void Opals aren't normally worth bothering with, but become so during Pirate Attacks.

Like...here. Look at this list:

Can you honestly tell me you'd mine Low Temperature Diamonds in this condition? Why would you ever bother, when every second you spend getting them is a second you're wasting not getting musgravite or void opals?

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

You might not want to hear this, but that is classic minmaxing strategy in my opinion, you just stay within that activity. I don't go "I want to make maximum profit core mining now. Drats, LTDs are still not the max. Better mine Void Opals."

I decide to go mining, make a rough plan, go to an appropriate ring, and start mining. And if I find a core of my preferred mineral, that's great. And if I come across a core of LTD, I mine that too. I don't scoff and say "come back when I get 800k for you". A mined core of LTD for 500k is better than no mined core.

Core mining and their prices are fine unless all you care about it minmaxing. I stand by that opinion. Don't touch what isn't broken.

 

[SteveWW57]

Store stuff on your carrier until the opportunity to get the price you want appears.

Or just mine something else.

Mining imo is not all about the credits, it is a chill session.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Store stuff on your carrier until the opportunity to get the price you want appears.

Or just mine something else.

Mining imo is not all about the credits, it is a chill session.

And even without minmaxing core mining makes you a boatload of credits while being a great relaxing and yet somewhat skill based activity - unlike the soul crushing laser mining.

 

[SteveWW57]

And even without minmaxing core mining makes you a boatload of credits while being a great relaxing and yet somewhat skill based activity - unlike the soul crushing laser mining.

Laser mining is the chillest of chill. Point and click to generate rocks for the limpets to collect. Fill a T8 in an hour that is stress free.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Laser mining is the chillest of chill. Point and click to generate rocks for the limpets to collect. Fill a T8 in an hour that is stress free.

Laser mining is SOUL CRUSHINGLY boring. I rather watch paint dry. I can feel my IQ dropping when doing laser mining.

You get the picture. I hate it.

 

[SteveWW57]

Laser mining is SOUL CRUSHINGLY boring. I rather watch paint dry. I can feel my IQ dropping when doing laser mining.

You get the picture. I hate it.

As much as you hate unwanted PvP?

You do not have to pay attention whilst laser mining, just watch entertainment on another screen.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

As much as you hate unwanted PvP?

You do not have to pay attention whilst laser mining, just watch entertainment on another screen.

I hate them both with different passions.

 

[DemiserofD]

You might not want to hear this, but that is classic minmaxing strategy in my opinion, you just stay within that activity. I don't go "I want to make maximum profit core mining now. Drats, LTDs are still not the max. Better mine Void Opals."

I decide to go mining, make a rough plan, go to an appropriate ring, and start mining. And if I find a core of my preferred mineral, that's great. And if I come across a core of LTD, I mine that too. I don't scoff and say "come back when I get 800k for you". A mined core of LTD for 500k is better than no mined core.

Core mining and their prices are fine unless all you care about it minmaxing. I stand by that opinion. Don't touch what isn't broken.

Do you keep bauxite? Or lithium hydroxide?

The line between efficiency and minmaxing can be fuzzy sometimes, but I don't really see it here. Minmaxing isn't about being efficient alone, it's about sacrificing fun for the sake of efficiency. It might be mapping out all the cores in a ring so I could get profits extremely quickly even at the cost of the enjoyable gameplay of finding said cores in the first place. Or in DND, it might be over-fixating on mechanics, AT THE COST of story and character progression. It can't just be 'max', it has to be 'min', too.

Just following the established economy and profit incentives isn't particularly minmaxing, it's just playing the game as it's meant to be played.

The thing is, here, we have an actual niche available. By making LTDs something that can be mined efficiently when more typical options are depleted, you generate new content at no real cost. To me, that's the perfect type of addition, it just makes the game better with no consequences.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

Do you keep bauxite? Or lithium hydroxide?

You don't collect those when core mining. Also that's a bad faith argument as they are worth only a fraction of what core minerals are worth.

 

[DemiserofD]

You don't collect those when core mining.

You could. They're on the rocks you're blowing up, and you could scrape them off while you deploy the core charges. Indeed, it wouldn't even take any extra effort if you just bound the mining laser to the same button. Get a few extra tons of ore!

But you don't even think about it, because...why would you? It'd be pointless to grab them. That's my point.

 

[Helmut Grokenberger]

This is a ridiculous argument. I COULD also bring subsurface missiles and mine those first. Or also bring lasers. Or my grandmother. If we go by what else we COULD do, we'd be here all night.

Bauxite is worth a fraction of core minerals all the time. LTDs are worth a little bit less then the others unless you do it wrong. It is not pointless to grab an LTD core if you come across one.