Going with T16000M or Fighterstick, seeking experienced suggestions...

[kursah]

Well I have about $100 to spend on myself with the holiday season in full swing. Going to see what Friday and Monday have to offer before I make any moves, but have read a few threads over the forums and am still trying to debate what my next best move will be.

I have enjoyed the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro over there years and it is starting to show its age. Frankly I want something with more buttons. Right now the stick flies pretty well, and I'll be good to go for now...but I want more options and feel limited with it. I've been looking into HOTAS setups, but am not going with a Saitek setup at this point. I am debating picking up a Thrustmaster T-16000M stick once the prices go back down a bit...which has increased over $10 in the past week alone over it's standard pricing.

The thing I don't like about the T-16000M is the limited buttons on the stick...I don't mind all of the buttons on the base, but the more I think about it the more I'd rather have more buttons and HATs on the stick and then use the keyboard for the rest.

So then I look at the CH Fighterstick, I LOVE all the switches it features! I can see a use for each and every one of them in ED, SC and EvoMerc. But I don't know if its throttle is worth a damn...I really see nothing out there about it, and if you search CH Figherstick Throttle...the query results in CH Pro Throttle combos. I would LOVE a Pro Throttle too. But it's just over my budget and I'm hoping to pick a used piece of kit up to save some $$$.

Final concern, I have grown used to the twist yaw axis with the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, but at the same time...I am also familiar with Mouse + KB schemes because I play this title on my laptop when not at home as well. So maybe I can just use throttle and yaw on the keyboard for now...get a Pro Throttle later and use one of the HATs for yaw. This is an issue because I have really come to prefer the precision that yaw offers during maneuvering in various situations and want to ensure I have that ability. Do I like twist yaw? Absolutely! Do I need it? Not necessarily but it would be preferred. If it comes down to buying a flight stick with more usable controls over an extra axis...I'd rather have the extra controls.

I also may never get a Pro Throttle or any throttle for that matter...is the Figherstick good enough on its own? I don't mind the Logitech's throttle flap...over the years I've grown to like it a lot and it works well for me...but at the same time I used keyboard throttle in many other space sims for a long time. I suppose I could do a test run with my current setup and see how I fare.

I also like this suggestion for the yaw axis issue on a non-twist stick...anyone else try this and like it? Is it a pain? Seems in the heat of the moment I may have problems...and I DO mix roll and yaw...thoughts?

 

[kursah]

Is the CH Fighterstick good enough to be without the Pro Throttle at least for an interim solution for you pilots out there?

I might have found a deal on the 16000m, but haven't heard back from the seller yet and kind of feeling like this might not be the right option for me as I'm really leaning towards the CH part.

 

[Lucky Shaw]

Personally I find the twist yaw essential...

 

[Zeeman]

Must have twist - I have no space (or budget) for pedals...

Z...

 

[SharkH]

If you can afford than the CH fighterstick.

Three month ago I was considering getting the T.16000 and later a throttle also but I bought a saitek X-55 instead. I found that the T.16000 is a very good quality stick with very good precision but I didn't like the placing of its buttons and its hats maybe because its placed symmetrically as it was designed to fit both left and right handed usage. Although I like my X-55 very much I realized I hate the stick' s twist rudder and there is no option to lock it.

Now I would go with the CH fighterstick instead what doesn't have rudder twist but I would like to keep my x-55 throttle because its ergonomics is excelent with well placed plenty of buttons.

Btw if you have wheel set... I have heard maybe its pedals can be used as rudders as a last resort option I haven't tried it yet

Edit: If you buy the CH than the only problem would be until you don't have other equipments is how to control the rudders. So later you will either have to use pedals or you can set your throttle to contol it. (maybe you can set one of the hat switch to control it until you have better options)

 

[aRtFuL]

The thing I don't like about the T-16000M is the limited buttons on the stick...I don't mind all of the buttons on the base, but the more I think about it the more I'd rather have more buttons and HATs on the stick and then use the keyboard for the rest.

T-16000M actually has 8 buttons on the stick itself. The hat on the top are actually similar to buttons you can set that to do whatever you want (I use it for directional thrust from the default setting of PIP configuration control)

Final concern, I have grown used to the twist yaw axis with the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro

T-16000M has twist yaw.

T-16000M imo is actually very good value for money because the controls are actually very precise. CH Stick is better however it is imo is a bit too "flight sim" stick for Elite. T-16000M and Thrustmaster HOTA is more suited for games like Elite or SC or mecha games.

 

[Sounder Deeps]

I have the T1600 for left hand/throttle. Great buy for the $. Hall sensors won't degrade with age and it's well built. Yes I wish it had mor buttons on the stick, maybe 2 triggers but it is very responsive. As for twist I got a x52 p over the warthog because of twist ymmv.

 

[kursah]

Personally I find the twist yaw essential...

Must have twist - I have no space (or budget) for pedals...

Z...

Thanks for the opinion. I agree I have no budget for anything but a replacement stick and even that is pushing it. I have grown to agree that the "twist yaw" feels essential.

My biggest concern with this decision. Do I go with more HAT switches for more use or go with a twist yaw axis option.....because I will either need to use part of a HAT switch, the yaw/roll switch as I linked in the OP, or the keyboard for yaw if I go with the CH.

If you can afford than the CH fighterstick.

Three month ago I was considering getting the T.16000...

Now I would go with the CH fighterstick instead what doesn't have rudder twist but I would like to keep my x-55 throttle because its ergonomics is excelent with well placed plenty of buttons.

Btw if you have wheel set... I have heard maybe its pedals can be used as rudders as a last resort option I haven't tried it yet

Edit: If you buy the CH than the only problem would be until you don't have other equipments is how to control the rudders. So later you will either have to use pedals or you can set your throttle to contol it. (maybe you can set one of the hat switch to control it until you have better options)

Thanks for the suggestions and opinions.

As above, I have a few options to mess with on the yaw factor...pedals isn't one of them though! At least not until I am more hardcore than I am now and can justify that cost, which is when I could raise the budget to do so. Cheers man!

T-16000M actually has 8 buttons on the stick itself. The hat on the top are actually similar to buttons you can set that to do whatever you want (I use it for directional thrust from the default setting of PIP configuration control)



T-16000M has twist yaw.

T-16000M imo is actually very good value for money because the controls are actually very precise. CH Stick is better however it is imo is a bit too "flight sim" stick for Elite. T-16000M and Thrustmaster HOTA is more suited for games like Elite or SC or mecha games.

Yep I'm aware of the HAT switch count, which makes the CH Fighterstick way more appealing having 3 4-way and one 8-way HAT and several buttons as well. I am still losing buttons compared to my Logitech Extreme 3D pro, which has 6 buttons and a 4-way HAT for a total of 10. I use all of them and would love more options within a thumb's reach.

I'm also aware of the 16000M's twist yaw, pretty sure I explained that in the OP, my apologies if that wasn't made clear.

That is the tradeoff I'm dealing with for which stick to get...do I sacrifice switch/button ability for twist yaw? Do I try to find a yaw replacement that I can live with now that I've adjusted to twist yaw?

Then I have the poll for which flight stick option people would go with, with a chance of a throttle coming in to make it a HOTAS setup...but maybe not.

Cheers and thanks for all the responses! +Rep left! This is really a great community.

 

[SharkH]

Welcome Commander

I agree with ARTFUL that the CH is a bit too "flight sim" but who knows maybe in the future when you will have the throttle you might will get into that genre also playing games like DCS:World so it will come handy than.

There are other options to consider like the saitek x-52pro, x-55, or the Tflight Hotas but in that case you can't buy the stick and the throttle separately in two round ofc.

 

[kursah]

Thanks Shark! Much appreciated.

I haven't been into flight sims in recent years...but play space sims a lot. The Logitech has a lot of hours on it, bene a good stick.

I'm very leery of the saitek stuff, having known folks that have had failures over the years, and the complaints I see all over the web. I suppose any purchase is a risk, but it seems the Saitek goodies are riskier than most.

That led me to the Thrustmaster 16000M and CH Fighterstick (or maybe Combatstick). If the HotasX throttle was a seperate unit and $25 or so, I'd consider that with my current Logitech stick.

Also thanks to all folks voting, seems like a fairly even between the 3 main choices. Cheers!

 

[pryzm]

I use the t1600M and find it to be a beautiful feeling joystick. The lack of buttons is not an issue for me, in fact i only use the thumb and trigger buttons on top as using the other ones feels like it takes too long and is too clumsy to remove my hand from the keyboard, all the way over to the right to use them.

How i have it setup is:
hat switch to up , down, left, right thrusters
Trigger to primary fire
right thumb button to thrust/afterburners
left thumb button to secondary weapon
bottom thumb button to flight assist off/on

My other hand is always on the keyboard on wasd controlling forwards backwards thrust and all other buttons nearby to that. (again reaching over to the right to the joystick throttle feels wrong and wastes time)

 

[Zeeman]

Thanks for the opinion. I agree I have no budget for anything but a replacement stick and even that is pushing it. I have grown to agree that the "twist yaw" feels essential.

My biggest concern with this decision. Do I go with more HAT switches for more use or go with a twist yaw axis option.....because I will either need to use part of a HAT switch, the yaw/roll switch as I linked in the OP, or the keyboard for yaw if I go with the CH.



Thanks for the suggestions and opinions.

As above, I have a few options to mess with on the yaw factor...pedals isn't one of them though! At least not until I am more hardcore than I am now and can justify that cost, which is when I could raise the budget to do so. Cheers man!



Yep I'm aware of the HAT switch count, which makes the CH Fighterstick way more appealing having 3 4-way and one 8-way HAT and several buttons as well. I am still losing buttons compared to my Logitech Extreme 3D pro, which has 6 buttons and a 4-way HAT for a total of 10. I use all of them and would love more options within a thumb's reach.

I'm also aware of the 16000M's twist yaw, pretty sure I explained that in the OP, my apologies if that wasn't made clear.

That is the tradeoff I'm dealing with for which stick to get...do I sacrifice switch/button ability for twist yaw? Do I try to find a yaw replacement that I can live with now that I've adjusted to twist yaw?

Then I have the poll for which flight stick option people would go with, with a chance of a throttle coming in to make it a HOTAS setup...but maybe not.

Cheers and thanks for all the responses! +Rep left! This is really a great community.

I was very close to pulling the trigger on an X52, and decided to do the due diligence thing, and did some Google research.

Basically, it turns out that CH make joysticks for commercial applications (controlling cranes, for example) and thus, make very heavy duty products that last. ALso, the X-52 and X-55's seem to have lots of QC issues, which I'd rather avoid if I'm dropping that sort of cash...

The down side, as stated before, was that it lacked twist. However, it turns out the T16000M was well regarded, and that the CH Throttle plays well with other sticks, so, my endgame for Elite Dangerous control is a CH Pro Throttle with the T16000M - a combo that seems to be well regarded for the money from anyone who has ever used it.

The CH Throttle seems to have a lot of assignable buttons and hats - which is awesome, as I'd love to move thruster control to my left hand, I tend to use my thrusters a lot in combat, and the extreme 3D pro I currently use makes me choose between firing a fire group and using thrusters to help my positioning (not a fault of the stick, mind you).

The extra buttons on the CH Throttle should give me extra control I need, and should only need KB bindings when docking, or non "life and death gotta press this button right freaking now" situations. The T16000M, on the other hand, should give me a nice, precise throttle (which the Extreme 3D pro isn't quite), and a long lasting stick (my extreme 3D pro already has 3 or 4 buttons that no longer respond).

My only issue is finding the T16000M for $20 as some people seem to have been able to!

Z...

 

[Muss]

Have an X45 but its been unused for ever and has a few issues so i will be upgrading probably to an X52 or X-55 Rhino

 

[kursah]

@Zeeman

Yeah, I found the same in my research time as well, and why I'm steering clear of Saitek at this point. And I'm still torn between the T16000M and Fighterstick. If I knew for certain I was going with a throttle I'd still be torn, but as it stands, I don't know if I'll ever end up buying one or not.

I've also been told by folks that the 16000M can be had for under $25 or used to be, with current demand skyrocketing, and it rising from $40 to $55 in a week's time...I'll wait.

I am hoping for good prices this upcoming weekend or a great deal on a used piece of kit for me to stumble across. Hoping one of these sticks shows up at an unimaginably affordable price!!!

 

[David Oliver]

CH stick, throttle and pedal user here. No experience with other recent hardware.

As you're working with that budget and may not be buying more items in future I suggest sticking with your current stick with its twist if it's working okay and getting the CH throttle, which has loads of buttons (every single one usable) and great ergonomics. Its mini thumb joystick is great for horizontal and lateral thrust.

 

[kursah]

Thanks for the input David. I hadn't actually seriously considered that. I suppose it could be a viable option too. That I will look into, if I could find a USB throttle for sub-$100 I might be inclined to go that route!

 

[Borgkube]

The thing about CH Products is that there stuff is really rugged. I have an original Flight Stick from over 20 years ago and it still works just fine. The only problem with it is that it only has a trigger and thumb button. The thing is that Ch Product's real business is industrial controls. They make controls and joysticks for all kinds of machines and loaders and excavators. That experience goes into their gaming joysticks. They last forever.

 

[DaHunn]

microsoft force feedback 2

 

[David Oliver]

Yeah, my thinking is that if only one of the two hands is going to have lots of buttons, it should be the left one as it only has to otherwise deal with forward/backward movement whereas the right hand does three axes. I'm happy to have all of the buttons on the CH stick, but I don't find it as easy to use (some of) them quickly as the CH throttle buttons.

Plus if you can get a Thrustmaster stick with twist for $30-50 a little further down the line, it sounds like it would be more likely to be justifiable that way round.

 

[Tuzmaal]

Got myself an x52 a few days back from ebay, the saving was worth the waiting time to get the right deal. Nearly new stick with tons of buttons and options to fiddle around.